Angry, aggressive amazon

Kiwibird

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1 BFA- Kiwi. Hatch circa 98', forever home with us Dec. 08'
Kiwi was in a most foul mood when he woke from his nap. I was taking pics of his little hissy fit as a response for another thread, but I thought I would share these under "angry amazon". I know I see from time to time people asking what an aggressive amazon looks like or what body language to look for. Well, if you ever wondered what your zon will look like when he or she is about to amputate your finger HERE YOU GO:

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This kind of mood is precisely why one MUST MUST MUST stick train their zons!!! Doesn't matter how sweet, loving and well behaved they *normally* are. Every single one will have their times where they are in a mood for blood! He did this for about 5 minutes before doing a happy fluff/puff of the feathers and going back to being a sweetheart. Amazons are pretty bi-polar;)
 

Birdman666

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Presently have six Greenwing Macaw (17 yo), Red Fronted Macaw (12 yo), Red Lored Amazon (17 y.o.), Lilac Crowned Amazon (about 43 y.o.) and a Congo African Grey (11 y.o.)
Panama Amazon (1 Y.O.)
Ohhhh! That first one is a classic! Be afraid! Be very, very afraid... :11:

Stick training is a good idea. Backing off and giving them five minutes to calm down when they're crazed like that is an even better one...

Sticking your hand up there, when he's hunched over, flippy flapping, with the tail spread, eyes pinning, doing the amazon line of death dance...

"OH, LOOK HOW HAPPY HE IS TO SEE ME! SURE, I'LL SCRATCH YOUR HEAD!"



... Or not!

TRUE STORY: "I don't know what happened. He was super friendly, and acted like he was happy to see me, and then he just went crazy and attacked me!"

BFA doing the "line of death" dance, and this completely naiive lady not only crossed the line, but reached up to pet the bird. (She received a free lip piercing for her trouble!)

Amazon body language is no joke! Nothing subtle about it...
 
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RavensGryf

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It sort of looks subtle to me in the head/face. :confused: So the tell tale signs are the fanned tail and wings out?

I haven't had a mature male Pionus quite yet... They're supposed to do some strut display too. I'm so afraid that I'll somehow miss it and not notice until it's too late and my finger is bloody lol :eek:
 

Birdman666

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Presently have six Greenwing Macaw (17 yo), Red Fronted Macaw (12 yo), Red Lored Amazon (17 y.o.), Lilac Crowned Amazon (about 43 y.o.) and a Congo African Grey (11 y.o.)
Panama Amazon (1 Y.O.)
It sort of looks subtle to me in the head/face. :confused: So the tell tale signs are the fanned tail and wings out?

I haven't had a mature male Pionus quite yet... They're supposed to do some strut display too. I'm so afraid that I'll somehow miss it and not notice until it's too late and my finger is bloody lol :eek:

The wings are out but they are flip flapping, like a coiled springwound too tight getting ready to spring loose. The eyes are crazed. The head is either going around in a circle - think Linda Blair in the Exorcist - OR they are hunched over....

And they pace back and forth, or around in circles doing an "amazon war cry."

That's the "line of death" dance, as in take one more step...

It's an audio-visual experience. It means back off...

It's also pretty dang funny... but they hate it when you laugh at them!

You're not taking me seriously enough...
 
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Kiwibird

Kiwibird

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It sort of looks subtle to me in the head/face. :confused: So the tell tale signs are the fanned tail and wings out?

I haven't had a mature male Pionus quite yet... They're supposed to do some strut display too. I'm so afraid that I'll somehow miss it and not notice until it's too late and my finger is bloody lol :eek:

Keep in mind, a still image can't capture the full....ferocity of what was going on. He was also hissing and making (for lack of a better word) aggressive head/wing/tail movements and rapidly pinning his eyes too! If Raven is going to have a bit of a zon tude (I know you said he was related) you'll only mistake a flashy/aggressive display once as him being "friendly":54: I don't think you'd even get bit once with all your years of bird experience. IMO you'd have to be pretty foolish to mistake a PO'd zon (or close relative;)) for a friendly sweetie pie. Probably the only people who do are ones who've never been around a parrot before in their lives!
 

Allee

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Wow! Kiwi is beautiful when he's angry, and boy does he look angry!
 

RavensGryf

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Keep in mind, a still image can't capture the full....ferocity of what was going on. He was also hissing and making (for lack of a better word) aggressive head/wing/tail movements and rapidly pinning his eyes too! If Raven is going to have a bit of a zon tude (I know you said he was related) you'll only mistake a flashy/aggressive display once as him being "friendly":54: I don't think you'd even get bit once with all your years of bird experience. IMO you'd have to be pretty foolish to mistake a PO'd zon (or close relative;)) for a friendly sweetie pie. Probably the only people who do are ones who've never been around a parrot before in their lives!

I am still nervous wondering if I'd recognize it (lol though you and others say it's quite obvious). Raven is only 14 months old, so too early for some serious hormones, but lately he's been 'practicing' some grown up mating and nesting behaviors. Pi's are sexually mature by 3. Sometimes he will sit and fluff out all his feathers (not like a shake off) but just sit there looking big, and I just don't know what he means lol!

I suppose I shouldn't worry about future hormones, as the "Pionus Strut" as they call it should be obvious.
It's the Poi's you have to worry about! They typically show such a subtle body language BEFORE striking, or maybe it's literally just a split second before, that before you know it, it's too late :eek:. While they're hanging on grinding a chunk of flesh from you, is when you finally see the crazy flaring and pinning.

It's also pretty dang funny... but they hate it when you laugh at them!

You're not taking me seriously enough...

LOL! Raven's breeder said that (about the Pionus Strut), that it's hilarious, but you best not laugh at them haha.
 

Taw5106

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The second pic, "Stop looking at me!"
The third pic, " I said STOP LOOKING AT ME!!!!!"

After seeing a blue fronted Amazon this weekend, Kiwi is HUGE compared to Buddy, I'd definitely be scared. So far Buddy's mood swings have been subtle but he's pretty clear, fanned tail and the eye. He gives you the eye, growls and shows his tongue. When he's done this, I just close cage and come back when he's happy. Thanks for sharing the pics, great example. And Husband calls Buddy Bipolar Buddy, "give him 30 seconds and he'll change".
 

henpecked

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I'm so lucky to have hens.
 
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Kiwibird

Kiwibird

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And Husband calls Buddy Bipolar Buddy, "give him 30 seconds and he'll change".

"Bipolar Buddy"?! I just refuse to believe that cutie pie of yours throws fits!

I'm so lucky to have hens.

I call your bluff! Females may not do flashy displays like males, but they do get broody and can be a tad on the defensive side when it comes to their favored human:54:
 

michellebaughman

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Binky my 11 month old quaker,brought him home July 11,2014. Olly my o.w.a is 8 years old.brought him home,sept.3rd. :-)
Lol...sure is a pretty angry bird! Olly does that now and then,but not very often,I just ask him,what's your problem,wake up on the wrong side of the cage? :p also wanted to add thinking about what bird man said....I'm very new to this,but dang it doesn't take a genius to figure these things out,the Amazon's make it pretty darn obvious when they are peed and why do strangers stick their fingers up to strange birds is beyond me! Then they want to get mad at the bird! Duh! OK...done,lol
 
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Birdman666

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Presently have six Greenwing Macaw (17 yo), Red Fronted Macaw (12 yo), Red Lored Amazon (17 y.o.), Lilac Crowned Amazon (about 43 y.o.) and a Congo African Grey (11 y.o.)
Panama Amazon (1 Y.O.)
Lol...sure is a pretty angry bird! Olly does that now and then,but not very often,I just ask him,what's your problem,wake up on the wrong side of the cage? :p also wanted to add thinking about what bird man said....I'm very new to this,but dang it doesn't take a genius to figure these things out,the Amazon's make it pretty darn obvious when they are peed and why do strangers stick their fingers up to strange birds is beyond me! Then they want to get mad at the bird! Duh! OK...done,lol

Well, what happens is that people don't understand what it means.

The lady who got "faced" honestly thought that the bird was being super friendly and was doing everything it could to get her attention...

What the bird was actually doing however, was warning the stranger that "you have entered my territory and I will fight to protect it." He was letting the lady know in no uncertain terms that he was a pretty fierce creature, you know, big bad birdie...

She took that to mean, he's really goofy and really wants my attention...

WHICH WAS JUST SOOOO NOT THE CASE! "Take one more step towards me and there will be blood!" And she not only kept right on walking, she made an aggressive move with her hand toward the displaying bird... (and the bird then immediately launched at her face!)

And the people involved will tell you they "didn't do anything." I just walked up to the bird, and tried to be friendly, and he attacked me. Zons are psycho!" And that's where the bad rap comes in. But it's not the bird. Zons communicate VERY clearly. One look at them and you just know what's gonna happen... (compare that say to a U2!)

So, I see this as a "train the humans" thing. It's more a human training thing than a bird training thing. You don't reason with a crazed amazon. You leave them alone for five minutes. (Even crazed, I could handle both Pecker and Sally. But that is a bonding thing. No one else could!)

And again, a lot of these are territorial triggers.
 
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Birdman666

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Presently have six Greenwing Macaw (17 yo), Red Fronted Macaw (12 yo), Red Lored Amazon (17 y.o.), Lilac Crowned Amazon (about 43 y.o.) and a Congo African Grey (11 y.o.)
Panama Amazon (1 Y.O.)
The second pic, "Stop looking at me!"
The third pic, " I said STOP LOOKING AT ME!!!!!"

After seeing a blue fronted Amazon this weekend, Kiwi is HUGE compared to Buddy, I'd definitely be scared. So far Buddy's mood swings have been subtle but he's pretty clear, fanned tail and the eye. He gives you the eye, growls and shows his tongue. When he's done this, I just close cage and come back when he's happy. Thanks for sharing the pics, great example. And Husband calls Buddy Bipolar Buddy, "give him 30 seconds and he'll change".

See, now, by the third pic, it looks like that bird is calming down. Ten more seconds and it would probably be okay to test that theory... Still a little crazed, but not like the first pic.

But the first two?! Not so much...
 

Taw5106

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Buddy - Red Crowned Amazon (27 yo)
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Tweety - Budgie 1984 - 1987
Sweety - Budgie 1985 - 1986
Agree with Birdman. A few weeks back our friend wanted to hold Buddy, she had bird experience and several beers. I was outside, kids came and got me, I walked in and I don't know how much clearer Buddy could be about leave me alone. He bit her 6 times, all fluffed out, eyes pinning, growling, lunging. She gave up and he flew to me and landed on my shoulder. After that, no one could close and he didn't want my fingers, just sat on my shoulder till he cooled off and food was suddenly his interest. He communicated clearly, lol. We still call our friend Nubs after that.
 

Birdman666

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Presently have six Greenwing Macaw (17 yo), Red Fronted Macaw (12 yo), Red Lored Amazon (17 y.o.), Lilac Crowned Amazon (about 43 y.o.) and a Congo African Grey (11 y.o.)
Panama Amazon (1 Y.O.)
Agree with Birdman. A few weeks back our friend wanted to hold Buddy, she had bird experience and several beers. I was outside, kids came and got me, I walked in and I don't know how much clearer Buddy could be about leave me alone. He bit her 6 times, all fluffed out, eyes pinning, growling, lunging. She gave up and he flew to me and landed on my shoulder. After that, no one could close and he didn't want my fingers, just sat on my shoulder till he cooled off and food was suddenly his interest. He communicated clearly, lol. We still call our friend Nubs after that.

Which part of the word NO! didn't you understand? The "N" or the "O"!!!

Flew to you for sympathy and protection, "this guy won't leave me alone. Please protect me!" There, mess with me now you have to deal with both of us!
 
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Kiwibird

Kiwibird

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Flew to you for sympathy and protection, "this guy won't leave me alone. Please protect me!" There, mess with me now you have to deal with both of us!

Yup. They may like to act like the "big bad bird" on occasion, but when they truly feel threatened, they know who's going to save their feathered butt and come running! Kiwi is not a cuddler, but when he is truly afraid, he will burrow his head into my arm or chest so I can "shield" him from the "scary" thing. He knows I won't let anything hurt him, even if he likes to get all flashy sometimes and try to "intimidate" me:20: Funny little creatures parrots are! Especially zons with their bad bird attitudes.
 

Birdman666

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San Antonio, TX
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Presently have six Greenwing Macaw (17 yo), Red Fronted Macaw (12 yo), Red Lored Amazon (17 y.o.), Lilac Crowned Amazon (about 43 y.o.) and a Congo African Grey (11 y.o.)
Panama Amazon (1 Y.O.)
Kiwi is not a cuddler, but when he is truly afraid, he will burrow his head into my arm or chest so I can "shield" him from the "scary" thing. He knows I won't let anything hurt him, even if he likes to get all flashy sometimes and try to "intimidate" me:20: Funny little creatures parrots are! Especially zons with their bad bird attitudes.

Sally is a cuddler, but she will either curl up into a ball on my shoulder, and press her face against my cheek, OR she will nestle in the crook of my elbow. Sometimes she'll shove her face between my body and my arm and sleep that way.

Amazons are little green chickens... but they want to see it and get in the middle of everything so badly sometimes, that they can't help themselves... but they're nervous... so they pull the big bad bird number.

and that's part of what makes them so contrary.

The more they deal with it, the less nervous they get, and the more they just want to get in the middle of everything - (to the point of being a pest sometimes!)

And that's why we love them so much - even when they are annoying us!

Oh, wait, did I say THE BIRD was the contrary one?!

They say that people begin to look like their pets after awhile... perhaps bird people begin to act like them too, eh?!
 

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