Jealousy/Biting

Hello friends! I did some research on forums and decided I liked this community the best; hopefully you guys can give me some good tips.

I'm sorry this may be long! I am the proud mommy (mate?) to my best friend, Jeep. He's an adult, 7 year old Senegal. He is fully flight capable (and he loves it!). I have no other birds. We do have other pets (three cats and two dogs - all petrified of the bird - we call him General Jeep because of how scared they are of him, it's kind of hilarious). I'm fortunate not to have a typical office job (I work from home), and Jeep spends a majority of his time out of his cage. For most of the day he's either perched on my leg or shoulder (like he is right now), or he's catching some z's on top of his cage. I wanted to say all of that because I've been reading a lot of responses on handling jealousy and I know a few of the questions that get asked are about flight, and normal routine.

So here's my problem: My husband and I were together before we got Jeep. Jeep decided pretty early on that he liked me more, and very quickly became turned off by my husband. But for about the last year, I can't even have Jeep out of his cage if my husband is home. If they are in the same room together, and Jeep is free, Jeep will attack him. And I don't mean that he'll fly at him or bluff bite - I mean full-on attack mode, going for my husband's face, hands, whatever he can get to. I had read before, when this whole thing started, that when Jeep tries to bite we're not supposed to retreat, because that reinforces the behavior. BUT, it happens so quickly and I literally have to save my husband when it happens because while he's not retreating, Jeep is full on biting him. Not nibbles either - it's like he views him as a predator. It seems like more than just jealousy. Jeep does not behave this way around our son, in fact, he doesn't pay him any mind at all. It's JUST my husband. So I need help, I've tried making it so that my husband is the only one that feeds Jeep, he's given him treats. Nothing works. And it makes me sad because while my husband would never ask me to give up Jeep (and I wouldn't, he's my best friend!), I would really like for them to be at least on civil terms because we're going to have Jeep for the next few decades. Thank you for reading all of that, and thanks in advance for any advice you can give me!

Meghan2 said:

So here's my problem: My husband and I were together before we got Jeep. Jeep decided pretty early on that he liked me more, and very quickly became turned off by my husband. But for about the last year, I can't even have Jeep out of his cage if my husband is home. If they are in the same room together, and Jeep is free, Jeep will attack him. And I don't mean that he'll fly at him or bluff bite - I mean full-on attack mode, going for my husband's face, hands, whatever he can get to. I had read before, when this whole thing started, that when Jeep tries to bite we're not supposed to retreat, because that reinforces the behavior. BUT, it happens so quickly and I literally have to save my husband when it happens because while he's not retreating, Jeep is full on biting him. Not nibbles either - it's like he views him as a predator. It seems like more than just jealousy.

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BIRDMATE/OVERBONDING ISSUE -

1. He's trying to drive out the rival for your attention and affection. Jealousy is very common and it can be quite bad. (I know of a wife who lost the flesh on several toes to a serious degloving injury when Hubby's overbonded Scarlett macaw decided the wife had to go!) Amazons have also been known to fly at faces when allowed to overbond.

2. I disagree with the don't react to the biting advice. You immediately react, and let the bird know it isn't going to be tolerated.

3. Birds in my household are not allowed to fly around and attack people and other animals in the house. I'd clip him temporarily as a safety issue. If he wants to behave, he can remain flighted when his feathers grow out. In the meantime, semi-flighted is safer until the behavior gets under control.

No way do I let my significant other get attacked by my bird. I intervene and prevent it from happening. Semi-flighted isn't going to kill him, and if he doesn't like it he can knock it off, and learn boundaries. This is a boundary setting issue.

4. Since he is doing this to gain your attention. Then your withholding of attention when he does it will let him know that this little tactic is backfiring on him. (FULL ON SILENT TREATMENT!)

5. Sennie-Tude. They all have it. You can improve on it. But you can't eliminate it altogether.

6. I WOULD ABSOLUTELY HAVE HUBBY TOWEL HIS LITTLE BUTT AND RESTRAIN HIM WHEN HE PULLS THIS STUFF! If he doesn't like what happens as a consequence of attacking, then he will most likely stop attacking. And in the wild, when a larger creature restrains you like that, you end up being someone's dinner. THAT'S A PRETTY STRONG MESSAGE TO SEND... YOU DON'T HAVE TO REPEAT THAT VERY OFTEN.

Combine toweling, with clipping, and the withholding of attention when he misbehaves like that, you will likely notice a marked improvement in behavior in a very short time.

SET THOSE BOUNDARIES!!!

Thanks for the input! I lol'd at the "Sennie-tude"

When he does attack, I immediately put him in his cage and he's definitely given the silent treatment, so we're doing that right.

Now, you said "let the bird know it isn't going to be tolerated" - when he does attack, he is scolded and immediately put in his cage - is there any other way for me to show my displeasure?

Also, nevermind my ignorance please - but what is 'toweling'? It sounds like it would make Jeep scared of Dan (my husband) - is that the goal?

It happens very quickly and without warning, or certainly I would stop it before it started. Oftentimes, if Jeep is out and my husband is home, I'll be with the bird in a completely separate room (my office) and when I'm walking into the main room to put him away he'll launch at my husband. It's all just so frustrating because Dan has never done a thing to Jeep, Jeep just really doesn't like him.

I really, really, reaaaallly don't want to clip his wings. It breaks my heart to see them try to fly when they can't. He was fully clipped when we got him and was so shy and skittish. Ever since he's grown all his feathers back in, he's become much more social and his personality has really blossomed. He sings and dances, and says several phrases now, none of which he did before...it's like he was depressed when he couldn't fly. I have to assume that if I had wings and knew I could fly, and then someone took that away, it would crush me, too. I'll do anything in the world that I can do, but I won't clip him.

Meghan2 said:

Thanks for the input! I lol'd at the "Sennie-tude"
Also, nevermind my ignorance please - but what is 'toweling'? It sounds like it would make Jeep scared of Dan (my husband) - is that the goal?

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No. The goal is not fear. The goal is respect for your husband and for boundaries...

I start by going back to their wild instincts.

In the wild, if one bird oversteps his boundaries within the flock, especially with the other birds, they would mass on him, and drive his little butt off... And this would happen immediately, the instant he got out of line. There would be serious consequences to such an action...

Here, the person he is attacking does nothing. Doesn't even react... So the bird is getting sent the message that I can do this any time I please and get away with it, because nothing happens. And the bird is turning into a bully because of it...

Toweling involves wrapping the bird in a towel, the way you would if you were grooming him. Physically restrain the bird, and make him sit there and face the wrath of hubby, if hubby were so inclined... I won't. But I could. The point of this is that if hubby wanted to hurt him, HE COULD, but he had him there, and DID NOT hurt him. The message you want to send is:

"I am not going to hurt you, but I will NOT permit YOU to hurt me, or anyone else in this family ever again!" Do we understand each other, bird? You don't have to like me, but you do have to stop attacking me!

The way I do it with aggressive birds, is you don't get out until you are calm, and step up nice. If you try to bite me again, back to the floor you go, and back in the towel you go. We will do this for as long as it takes until you quit biting, and step up nice...

It won't work if he just flies off and you have to chase him around the room trying to catch him every time. It only works if he is clipped.

Meghan2 said:

I really, really, reaaaallly don't want to clip his wings. It breaks my heart to see them try to fly when they can't. He was fully clipped when we got him and was so shy and skittish. Ever since he's grown all his feathers back in, he's become much more social and his personality has really blossomed. He sings and dances, and says several phrases now, none of which he did before...it's like he was depressed when he couldn't fly. I have to assume that if I had wings and knew I could fly, and then someone took that away, it would crush me, too. I'll do anything in the world that I can do, but I won't clip him.

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Long clipping leaves them semi-flighted. They can still fly around the room. In fact, my birds can fly the length of the inside of my house when long clipped. So, what you don't do is clip him way back. Clip the outer 3 primaries about half way down. He will still be flighted - just not as well as he was. This is only a TEMPORARY measure until you get the bad behaviors under control. They grow out in six months tops, by then you should have modified the bad behaviors.

And if he's dive bombing other pets, and attacking people he doesn't like - he isn't growing "more social" he's growing anti-social!!! Combine Sennie-tude, with spoiled bird syndrome, and then you really will have a problem on your hands!

The example I frequently use is a Dominant Male Greenwing that was chasing people around the house. I was the person down at the rescue who was rehabbing "the biters" and got called to do an intervention...

Sure enough the bird was climbing down from his cage, and charged. Household members fled in terror for fear of being bit...

I didn't run.

I immediately picked up a couch cushion and backed his little butt into a corner of the room until he was trapped, uncomfortable and helpless. He got a STERN "NO! I DON'T THINK SO! WE DON'T DO THAT!!!" And then sat there trapped for a minute, until I got good and ready to let him up. Then I told him to step up nice.

The first time, he tried to bite me, but I expected it, and Mr. Couch Cushion once again put him in the corner.

The second time he was ordered to step up nice, HE DID!

Never tried to bite me again, but immediately lunged for his owners nose...

And yet, I was a complete stranger that he did not know, and didn't like very much.

Why?! He knew I'd do something about it.

STAND UP TO THE BULLY BIRDS, AND MAKE THEM BACK DOWN... then they quit doing it.

I'm old school on this one. My big birds have the power to maim. It's my responsibility to see that they are trained NOT TO!

He really is spoiled, isn't he? I just can't help it, he's so darn cute! I have a friend who has birds, I'll see if she will clip his wings - I'm afraid 1) I'm a ninny, 2) I'll do it wrong, and 3) he'll hate me! But I think that maybe just a little clipping won't hurt, at least so that we can try the behavior modification tools you mentioned.

A side note: He won't go after the other pets, he leaves them alone. They'll all just scared of him because they've been taught 'no bird' - my dogs are incredibly smart and learned quickly. The cats were interested in him until they got bit - once - and they never went near him again. I just wanted to be clearer on that - he is not mean to the other animals and he is not mean to anyone but my husband. My dad, son, best friend, all can hold him and pet his head with no issues. He'll even dance for my dad!

Well it really does sound like a jealousy issue.

If you clip the outer 3 he will still have quite a bit of flight capability.

And if you do the behavior mods, he may never love or accept hubby, but I am 99% sure he will stop going after him...

(1% hedge for Sennie-Tude!)

My Zon just recently got clipped. Last night he jumped down from his play area and started waking across the room. They can get where they want to even with a clip. It just takes them a little longer and a different way.

birdman this is helping me as well as my cockatoo is super jealous of my entire household I have done some of what you have suggested... and a couch cushion saved my friends ear! However my husfriend will not have anything to do with my bird (he is not an animal person) any suggestions on how to curb the attacks without him being directly involved? can I be the one to make her stop and get the same result? My too also goes for the kids which is unacceptable and they are too small and afraid to handle her. Suggestions?

gnatnlucy said:

birdman this is helping me as well as my cockatoo is super jealous of my entire household I have done some of what you have suggested... and a couch cushion saved my friends ear! However my husfriend will not have anything to do with my bird (he is not an animal person) any suggestions on how to curb the attacks without him being directly involved? can I be the one to make her stop and get the same result? My too also goes for the kids which is unacceptable and they are too small and afraid to handle her. Suggestions?

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Well, you handle it the same way...

However the bird is going to recognize the fact that you're the one doing it, and one of these days you're not going to be around to stop him...

NOW'S MY CHANCE! (Evil birdie eyes gleeming...)

So, you do the discipline, but have "the talk" with everyone else. If my bird ever does this, and I am not around, THIS IS HOW YOU HANDLE IT.

Oh I'm glad I found this thread because my senegal is doing the exact same thing to my man. I adopted the 15 year old senegal almost a month ago and he took to me after 3 days (after spending 15 years with someone else!) I thought wow this is great we have an AMAZING bond already! But when anyone else comes in he bugs out. He fluffs up really big and raises his wings to look scary. I took him out in front of my man for the first time to try and let him pet him but he puffed up again even after I kept calming him. I don't know what to do. I try to get my man to do this mimicking game I do with my Sennie cause he loves to play that game and dances. But he is weary.

Will this go away with time? I don't know if he is weary of others because of his recent huge change (despite latching to me almost immediately) or if he is just seriously jealous or territorial or what! I don't know what to do...

My adult son recently moved in with us and my African Grey quickly claimed him as his "special" friend. He is obsessed with being near him and will happily sit next to him for hours. Then, out of the blue, he will latch onto any part of his anatomy he can and not let go. His wings are clipped. We towel him in a specific red towel, and withdraw my sons attention. None of these tactics have made a difference. Oh, and he is also cage territorial. Only I am allowed to get him on and off his cage, and change his food and water. Could he be "claiming" my son as his? What can we do? My son loves him and is really frustrated by this treacherous behavior!

This will be lost in a three year old thread! Those numbers in the upper left corner, are the date and time!

Yes it could be better to have started your own new thread? Pm a MOD if you so choose this option?

Is there anything going on that your AG doesnt like and this is the cause of the bites? Rewind in your mind and go through in slow motion. Could be someone coming in the room, a pet, a shadow on the wall, anything that he feels unsettling.

My guess is the CAG is displacement biting.

Could also be attention biting.

I need more information on this one to really help.

RainbowRose said:

Oh I'm glad I found this thread because my senegal is doing the exact same thing to my man. I adopted the 15 year old senegal almost a month ago and he took to me after 3 days (after spending 15 years with someone else!) I thought wow this is great we have an AMAZING bond already! But when anyone else comes in he bugs out. He fluffs up really big and raises his wings to look scary. I took him out in front of my man for the first time to try and let him pet him but he puffed up again even after I kept calming him. I don't know what to do. I try to get my man to do this mimicking game I do with my Sennie cause he loves to play that game and dances. But he is weary.

Will this go away with time? I don't know if he is weary of others because of his recent huge change (despite latching to me almost immediately) or if he is just seriously jealous or territorial or what! I don't know what to do...

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I'm guessing it's an overbonding issue. This is a one person bird.

Just my 2 cents. When your critters get out of hand do NOT yell, scream, or in any way go goofy. They love that!! My BFA would attack wife when I left the room and she would scream and rant regardless of my advice... for a while. Finally she listened and his behavior totally stopped. He now will sit on her shoulder and preen her hair. Note the change took a few weeks...he tested her ..she endured a few test bites in silence. Once he couldn't get her to go goofy the fun went out of attacking her.
I know it can be frustrating.. makes you wish for a baseball bat and a stun gun. But handled right there is a good chance you can bring your bird around.
Good luck!