Budgie laying on her stomach

Hi,
Last night she was on her favorite perch but she fell down, then climbed back again. But this morning, I've found her in a bad condition. She doesn't move at all, she seems to not be able to stand on her feet either. She just lays on her stomach. Doesn't seem to eat or drink. I've made a little bit of research, and took her out of her cage, placed her in a box where there is a smooth cloth on the ground, provided her some water, seeds and a calcium source. I also tried to give her some fruits but she doesn't seem interested. We've got 9 more budgies in the house, everyone seems to be fine, but I took her away to the living room with us, just to be safe if this is an infectious thing. We got antibiotics and vitamins and some ointments at home, but I don't want to give her anything since this is something we have never experienced before.

I don't know it will help, but here, she is like this since I found her this morning, very inactive and god damn it I can feel she is in pain.

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We are in the middle of nowhere right now, closest city is 3 hours away, and I can't take her to vet immediately. We got a vet friend in the neighborhood but she is not an avian vet, I'm not sure if she can figure out what is wrong. I want to make her feel better, at least until we can go to an avian vet. Do you have any guesses, what could be wrong?

Hello ineffective, and welcome to the Forums. I'm so sorry to hear one of your budgies is ill. Unfortunately, as birds are extremely good at masking signs of illness, they can be very sick indeed by the time they start to show symptoms.

You were wise to separate her from the rest of your flock in case of contagion. Have there been any changes in her environment lately? Such as a different food, a new toy, or have you noticed her chewing anything in her cage or your home that she hasn't chewed on before? Have you noticed any mating behaviour with another flock member, and has she been exhibiting any straining which may indicate she's having difficulty passing an egg? And how old is she?

I would not administer any antibiotics you may have, since there has not yet been a diagnosis made. Your friend the vet may be better than nothing, but as birds' physiology is so different from a mammal's, a certified avian vet is your best option. The links below may help to locate one closer to you...

https://www.aav.org/search/custom.asp?id=1803
https://lafeber.com/pet-birds/find-an-avian-vet/
https://www.zupreem.com/feed-smart/articles/how-find-avian-veterinarian/

Do try to get her to an avian specialist if you possibly can, as many vets who advertise as an "exotics" practice and may not have specialized equipment or training.

I hope you are able to get some help for your little one soon, and I wish you the very best of luck!

LaManuka said:

Hello ineffective, and welcome to the Forums. I'm so sorry to hear one of your budgies is ill. Unfortunately, as birds are extremely good at masking signs of illness, they can be very sick indeed by the time they start to show symptoms.

You were wise to separate her from the rest of your flock in case of contagion. Have there been any changes in her environment lately? Such as a different food, a new toy, or have you noticed her chewing anything in her cage or your home that she hasn't chewed on before? Have you noticed any mating behaviour with another flock member, and has she been exhibiting any straining which may indicate she's having difficulty passing an egg? And how old is she?

I would not administer any antibiotics you may have, since there has not yet been a diagnosis made. Your friend the vet may be better than nothing, but as birds' physiology is so different from a mammal's, a certified avian vet is your best option. The links below may help to locate one closer to you...

https://www.aav.org/search/custom.asp?id=1803
https://lafeber.com/pet-birds/find-an-avian-vet/
https://www.zupreem.com/feed-smart/articles/how-find-avian-veterinarian/

Do try to get her to an avian specialist if you possibly can, as many vets who advertise as an "exotics" practice and may not have specialized equipment or training.

I hope you are able to get some help for your little one soon, and I wish you the very best of luck!

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We came here for holiday, 15 days ago but my sister's budgies were already here. We got a room just for our little friends, and they all seems very good, i doubt it is environment related. and we didn't give any new toys. but her mate became another's mate 2 days ago, she may be a little depressed.

we didn't see her mating with another but one of the boys were giving her food a couple of days ago. I don't think they went further though.

She tried to fly but she was very clumsy, couldn't go as high as she used to, like she was a first timer. I also noticed that she can't control her feet much.

Our vet friend recommended some medicine, we'll give her for now. I hope that will work because taking her to an avian vet will be hard, since we are far away and the city has a lot of covid19 cases.

I'm not sure what type of medicine your friend has recommended, particularly as a proper physical examination and diagnosis has not yet taken place. There is no way to tell if it will be effective or cause further harm. The symptoms you describe do sound very serious, and as we do not have practising avian health professionals on our staff here, I would still recommend you try to contact an avian vet. The COVID situation has meant that vet clinics have had to change the way they deal with clients but they are still operating, perhaps one may even be able to assist over the phone or the internet.

Meanwhile keep her warm, quiet and comfortable, and perhaps you can try some millet sprays which may encourage her to eat something. I really hope you are able to get some help soon for your budgie.

I'm so sorry that you are going through this.

Your bird sounds very ill (as in, an emergency situation). It could be bacteria, fungal, viral or something internal, like egg-binding, metal poisoning, a blockage, organ issue, spinal injury etc.

I am not trying to be fatalistic, and I can tell you love your bird---it's just that they get very very sick very fast when you notice symptoms, and laying on the floor is a massive red flag.

If you want to answer some questions, we could possibly help you guess what is going on, but 100% of the possibilities would still require prompt veterinary intervention. I cannot think of any reason for this behavior that would not be fairly serious...I am just saying this because I don't want you to think that we will be able to give you a solid answer on here that could take the place of a professional. If it's bacterial, her treatment would be different than if it's fungal, viral or other. At the same time, if it's something else, you don't want to give her an antibiotic, because an antibiotic could make a fungal infection worse, or aggravate her liver. If she broke a bone or something, an antibiotic isn't going to help either. Not all antibiotics treat all bacteria..

I do not see her recovering from this without a professional. If that is not an option, as a very last resort (as in, she isn't going to make it) I suppose you could try an antibiotic (it could possibly work, but it could make things worse too). She likely needs supportive care as well (possibly IV etc, depending on what is going on). Just know that it is a huge gamble...and she may hate it as well.

Did you bring your bird around your sister's bird for the first time? it is possible for birds to carry illness and spread them to others without showing symptoms themselves. In a group of 3 birds, if you have an asymptomatic carrier, one bird may get visibly sick from the carrier, while the other may not show any symptoms at all (or show them weeks or even years later)---which is why they say to quarantine for 45 days in a room far away when combining new birds. Obviously this isn't always possible with family visits etc, but I'm just throwing stuff out there.

Does you bird ever have night frights (could she have flown into the cage wall)? Do you see any signs of visible injury? You said she fell...did you see it happen? How did she hit?

How long before the fall did you notice the clumsiness?
Any tail-bobbing when she was perched/still prior to her being unable to stand?
Any changes in droppings?
Is she eating/drinking?

If she isn't you can try some bird-safe foods with a higher water content that she might like (e.g., mashed banana, sweet potato (cooked), plain oatmeal (cooked), baby food (non fortified, as long as you check the label for salt, avocado etc)....

Any swelling on her abdomen area or near her vent?
Egg binding can happen with female budgies...

There is so much that could be going on...I really wish I could help more.

LaManuka said:

I'm not sure what type of medicine your friend has recommended, particularly as a proper physical examination and diagnosis has not yet taken place. There is no way to tell if it will be effective or cause further harm. The symptoms you describe do sound very serious, and as we do not have practising avian health professionals on our staff here, I would still recommend you try to contact an avian vet. The COVID situation has meant that vet clinics have had to change the way they deal with clients but they are still operating, perhaps one may even be able to assist over the phone or the internet.

Meanwhile keep her warm, quiet and comfortable, and perhaps you can try some millet sprays which may encourage her to eat something. I really hope you are able to get some help soon for your budgie.

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Our vet friend just came here and examined her, she said that she didn't get paralyzed or she didn't have a stroke, I guess that is the good news. She said that, she hurt her legs when she fell down, and still in pain. So she kind of locked herself due to pain, and that is the reason why she doesn't eat or drink. She gave us a painkiller and a muscle relaxant creme. And told us to gently massage her feet every hour. We'll see how that'll work out. I am kind of relieved. I was very scared. Thank you for your reply, I'll keep you updated

noodles123 said:

I'm so sorry that you are going through this.

Your bird sounds very ill (as in, an emergency situation). It could be bacteria, fungal, viral or something internal, like egg-binding, metal poisoning, a blockage, etc.

Did you bring your bird around your sister's bird for the first time? it is possible for birds to carry illness and spread them to others without showing symptoms themselves. In a group of 3 birds, if you have an asymptomatic carrier, one bird may get visibly sick from the carrier, while the other may not show any symptoms at all (or show them weeks or even years later)---which is why they say to quarantine for 45 days in a room far away when combining new birds. Obviously this isn't always possible with family visits etc, but I'm just throwing stuff out there.

Does you bird ever have night frights (could she have flown into the cage wall)? Do you see any signs of visible injury? You said she fell...did you see it happen? How did she hit?

How long before the fall did you notice the clumsiness?
Any tail-bobbing when she was perched/still prior to her being unable to stand?
Any changes in droppings?
Is she eating/drinking?

If she isn't you can try some bird-safe foods with a higher water content that she might like (e.g., mashed banana, sweet potato (cooked), plain oatmeal (cooked), baby food (non fortified, as long as you check the label for salt, avocado etc)....

Any swelling on her abdomen area or near her vent?
Egg binding can happen with female budgies...

There is so much that could be going on...I really wish I could help more.

NOTE: EVEN if you answer my questions, I still can't give you anything without a vet's help. I can try to help troubleshoot, but 99% of it can't be treated at home...not trying to get you down, but we can only guess.

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Thank you for trying to help. No, our birds know each other for a long time. They've been seeing each other since last year almost every month at least for a week. She became clumsy only this morning, no tail bobbing, nothing different in her droppings. But she sometimes opens up her mouth like they do when they have trouble breathing, but not often, maybe every 30-40 minutes, but in her situation, i guess that is normal. Our vet friend came and examined her, our friend don't think it is stroke or anything serious. She likes to spread her legs at the top corner of her cage, one leg on the cage and the other on the perch, and she couldn't keep balance for a second because she wanted to move so she fell down to the bottom of the cage. I guess cage's height is somewhere around 20-30 cm.

Anyway, our friend said she hurt her legs and still in pain. And that is the reason behind of her behavior. We'll try what she gave and said, i hope everything will be okay. She is not an avian vet but she worked with domestic pets for a while and she also has a budgie at her home. We always consulted her in previous incidents and she always made our feathered friends better.

Thanks for the food recommendations, I will try to feed her with those. I'll keep you updated

You have received good information from the Noodles and Lamanuka.
Egg binding would be high on my list of things that might be wrong.
The outlook is grim with s bird that is not perching, gasping fir breath every so often and not eating..... I’m not so sure this is a foot problem.

It was good if yiu to isolate, and provide a safe place for her with easy option to food and water. And the millit spray was a good idea from Lamanuka .

Guys, she doesn't eat or drink. We are trying to keep her fed and hydrated but it is hard since she is refusing to eat or drink. We tried all day to feed her, we tried to give her with a spoon no success. We tried to feed her with syringe, again no luck. We even tried to open her beak and give the food, but she is just too stubborn. And I think our friend's diagnosis is wrong, she doesn't seem to feel her left leg and just a little feeling in her right leg. We are still trying to massage her feet. But the main problem is we can't make her eat anything. Is there a technique or any tips to feed her? We will take her to an avian vet on Friday, this is the soonest we can do. But we have to force feed her until friday


Another update: It seems like she is gaining her power back on her legs, there is a slight improvement in her responsiveness. We again tried to feed her, we maee her eat a few drops of baby meal and some water. We again applied creme to her feet, it is something called "ihtiyol pomat". We have noticed that her poop is green. It was not like this this morning, maybe the drugs effect? We gave her animar (antibiotic) and dodicile (vitamin b supply). We also have probiotics, should I give her probiotics in water to help with the poop situation?

be careful w baby meal. When I said baby food, I specified NON-FORTIFIED because the vitamins added some are high and intended for humans. If it has added vitamins, iron etc you you don't want to give that kind to her..but I am glad she is eating. I was talking about the jarred stuff.
Never add anything to a bird's water dish- it can increase bacterial growth and you cant tell how much (if any) they are getting.
Did a vet approve the use of the antibiotic?
Also, be really careful giving them vitamins-- you can OD them

noodles123 said:

be careful w baby meal. When I said baby food, I specified NON-FORTIFIED because the vitamins added some are high and intended for humans. If it has added vitamins, iron etc you you don't want to give that kind to her..but I am glad she is eating. I was talking about the jarred stuff.
Never add anything to a bird's water dish- it can increase bacterial growth and you cant tell how much (if any) they are getting.
Did a vet approve the use of the antibiotic?
Also, be really careful giving them vitamins-- you can OD them

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Yes, we are only doing what our vet friend told us. The baby food is not fortified. In another forum, somebody offered a recipe to provide her electrolytes. This is his recipe:
½ cup hot water
3 ½ cups water
2 Tablespoons honey (or sugar if you have no honey)
½ teaspoon salt
Optional: 2 Tablespoons Orange or Apple Juice

Mix the honey and salt with the hot water until dissolved
Add the room temperature water and juice and let cool to room temperature before using.

I prepared the solution with honey, salt and water to give her in the morning. But I'm hesitant because I thought honey or sugar was bad for budgies. What is your opinion about that?

no honey for birds....sorry! sugar is way safer. No honey for the same reason babies can't have honey. Raw is really dangerous, but many say to avoid all honey (raw or not) (as you would with a baby). Sounds fine otherwise, but again, you have watch for fortification (especially in apple juice-- they add human vitamin levels to it in most cases, so just be aware). It is probably so dilute that it makes little difference in your recipe, but just in general, it is something to watch out for.

The sugar is for calories--- some sugar is okay if they are in a starving state-- you don't want them to get hypoglycemic. Sugar or salt in excess would be bad, but this sounds minimal. I am not sure if that is too much salt or not- I have never mixed mine, but I have heard of birds being fed pedialite in some instances...and it contains sugar and salt.

noodles123 said:

no honey for birds....sorry! sugar is way safer. No honey for the same reason babies can't have honey. Raw is really dangerous, but many say to avoid all honey (raw or not) (as you would with a baby). Sounds fine otherwise, but again, you have watch for fortification (especially in apple juice-- they add human vitamin levels to it in most cases, so just be aware). It is probably so dilute that it makes little difference in your recipe, but just in general, it is something to watch out for.

The sugar is for calories--- some sugar is okay if they are in a starving state-- you don't want them to get hypoglycemic. Sugar or salt in excess would be bad, but this sounds minimal. I am not sure if that is too much salt or not- I have never mixed mine, but I have heard of birds being fed pedialite in some instances...and it contains sugar and salt.

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I did more research, turns out it is okay to give them some honey like very small amount and diluted with water. This helps to put the calories back. It is okay to give them if they are sick and haven't eaten anything for a while.

Okay, last night she had a good sleep, I woke up every 30 minutes to check on her. This morning I think she is better. I hold some millets for her and she took a couple of bites. I also made her drink some water with a teaspoon. Today she is somewhat willing to eat. I also gave her a teaspoon of honey+salt+water thing.

Today's problem is, she is trying to fly 😞 Probably her wings started to ache since she couldn't fly since yesterday. I tried to hold her so she could flap her wings, but it seems like it only scared her. I am afraid she is going to hurt herself while trying to fly. By the way I put her back into her cage, I removed the perches and everything. Placed a bottle of hot water wrapped in a towl. Any recommendations for her need to fly? She tries and tries and gets devastated when she can't, but she is stubborn, never gives up

She is gone. She just didn't stop trying to fly, but we couldn't manage to make her eat, she only ate maybe 10 drops of food since yesterday. Again we gave her some painkillers, she was okay, she was calmed down. Couple of minutes later she fell asleep. She slept for a while, but never woke up. I don't even remember crying this much in my life, not even when I was a kid. I really hope she didn't suffer, and I hope she knew I love her. Nothing worked, and I hope nobody will ever feel the desperation I felt for these two days. I thank everyone who tried to help. I hope your little friends live for ever with you. My little bonbon couldn't make it.

I am so sorry, my deepest condolences. You tried but sometimes illnesses are hidden for a long while and are beyond remedy. We do get deeply attached and the loss stings. Please grieve and take care of yourself. In time the wonderful memories will outweigh the sadness and despair.

I’m so sorry , you really tried. You kept her comfortable and safe. The pain of losing them is so deep. It shows how deep our capacity for love is.