Citron Crested x Galah Hybrid

kiwifeathers · Dec 13, 2016

Hi all, I'm new here and have been contemplating getting a parrot and I joined up here because I know from getting my leopard gecko and having aquariums just how helpful these sort of places can be (more about that in another thread when I have the time to write it). I was browsing birds for sale and came across this youngster who as the title says is a Citron Crested Cockatoo x Galah.

Now I understand hybrids in the bird world are generally frowned upon? I totally get why but I suppose I'm just curious about this little guy (advert says he's a DNA'd male). He's certainly unique looking!

Has anyone come across this hybrid before? If so what were they like? It almost looks like his chest will turn orange, like the galahs have pink chests.

Scott · Dec 13, 2016

Have not seen this cross before, certainly a beautiful bird. Not intending to be judgmental, but many in aviculture have concerns with hybridization, particularly with endangered species such as the Citron. Don't believe we see this in nature, and may open a pandoras box of genetic nasties.

Regardless of origin, I hope the bird has a wonderful home and life. They are never the cause of human tinkering and ought be respected for their intrinsic goodness.

kiwifeathers · Dec 13, 2016

Scott said:
Have not seen this cross before, certainly a beautiful bird. Not intending to be judgmental, but many in aviculture have concerns with hybridization, particularly with endangered species such as the Citron. Don't believe we see this in nature, and may open a pandoras box of genetic nasties.

Regardless of origin, I hope the bird has a wonderful home and life. They are never the cause of human tinkering and ought be respected for their intrinsic goodness.

No totally understand why there are concerns, it's not judgmental at all! I do find hybirds interesting (in a nerd who's interested in biology kind of way), and that's why I posted this guy up here because he's just an interesting looking bird I thought others may have some more insight on (he really is what you might expect such a cross to look like), but that doesn't mean I think they should be intentionally bred. Which I think this guy was, considering they want $4000 for him.

So do I. He's been for sale for a while, and the bleeding heart in me worries about him. I'd love to see him as an adult and see how he turned out growth wise. Seems to be leaning more towards the galah in him atm.

Kiwibird · Dec 13, 2016

Just my $0.02, but this beautiful baby didn't ask to be a hybrid, or in fact, to be born into captivity at all. I judge the breeder for either not separating their birds or worse, intentionally allowing this, but I have no judgement towards the person with good intentions who ultimately buys the baby. It is kind of a catch 22 though, since one doesn't necessary want to encourage this kind of irresponsible breeding, but still, the bird is innocent in all of this and like all captive bred parrots, deserves a loving home willing to provide lifelong care. If you think you can provide that, I might arrange a meeting and see if you get along with the bird and feel a connection to him. Do be aware, there can be unforeseen health issues in hybrids, which is a possibility you'd have to accept should you decide to buy a hybrid bird. Even the most experienced avian vets cannot always find answers for genetic issues in birds. We don't even have a firm grasp on human genetic issues, let alone those present in avians. My mom has a parrot with suspected "genetic issues" (not even a hybrid, but speculated he may have been inbred) who's had minor health issues most of his life. He's been seen by countless vets, but none have ever been able to turn up what's wrong with him nor offer any treatment advice except for a few individual symptoms in recent years, which seem to be more related to old age than the anything else. Of course, there is also the chance this particular cross or the particular individual inherited all the "good" genes on both sides and will be exceptionally healthy too. It's one of those variables you will not know until you have had the bird for some time.

Best of luck in your decision.

kiwifeathers · Dec 13, 2016

Kiwibird said:
Just my $0.02, but this beautiful baby didn't ask to be a hybrid, or in fact, to be born into captivity at all. I judge the breeder for either not separating their birds or worse, intentionally allowing this, but I have no judgement towards the person with good intentions who ultimately buys the baby. It is kind of a catch 22 though, since one doesn't necessary want to encourage this kind of irresponsible breeding, but still, the bird is innocent in all of this and like all captive bred parrots, deserves a loving home willing to provide lifelong care. If you think you can provide that, I might arrange a meeting and see if you get along with the bird and feel a connection to him. Do be aware, there can be unforeseen health issues in hybrids, which is a possibility you'd have to accept should you decide to buy a hybrid bird. Even the most experienced avian vets cannot always find answers for genetic issues in birds. We don't even have a firm grasp on human genetic issues, let alone those present in avians. My mom has a parrot with suspected "genetic issues" (not even a hybrid, but speculated he may have been inbred) who's had minor health issues most of his life. He's been seen by countless vets, but none have ever been able to turn up what's wrong with him nor offer any treatment advice except for a few individual symptoms in recent years, which seem to be more related to old age than the anything else. Of course, there is also the chance this particular cross or the particular individual inherited all the "good" genes on both sides and will be exceptionally healthy too. It's one of those variables you will not know until you have had the bird for some time.

Best of luck in your decision.

Thank you for your input and advice.

I was never considering a hybrid as a possible parrot companion (I was looking into galahs, and thats how I came across this little one), but I do worry about his future if the "wrong" person buys him (but then, I want to take in every animal I see who's clearly not living a good life currently, or could fall into a poor life.). Of course, I'm still deep in the research phase, so I may not be the right person for any larger parrot, let alone a hybird either! I've only kept budgies, canaries and cockatiels before. That's why I joined the forum. I'll be posting a general situation thread later today asking for advice on that matter.

Scott · Dec 13, 2016

$4K tells you everything necessary to understand the seller's motive. Extracting a premium will only embolden more such breeding to satisfy the human quest for the dramatic, dare I say "trophy."

This is epidemic in the world of dogs, where pets formerly known as "mutts" are prized for hybrid appearances and traits.

chris-md · Dec 13, 2016

Hi kiwifrathers. Not everyone is as strongly against hybrids as you think. Within every breeding scheme - be it birds or orchids - you will find people on all parts of the spectrum. There are the purists, you'll often Find on places like Internet forums (gatherings of people who truly care about what they are doing), you'll find more ambivalent people, and yet others who don't give a rats rear.

Myself, as a student of agronomy ecology and hybridization, there is an inescapable conclusion that contientious hybridization has its place. Dogs are often brought up (no disrespect to Scott!) but dogs are all inbreds of the same species. Cross species hybridization has its own suite of issues can't be viewed through the same lens.

As an example, These hybrid macaws that are popular (harlequin/calico etc) certainly don't bother me. The resulting birds are generally happy and healthy.

Hybrid vigor is a real thing.

Allee · Dec 13, 2016

Thanks for posting the Citron Crested Galah, I've never seen that hybrid. Such a beautiful bird, I hope he finds the loving home he deserves.

Loko · Dec 13, 2016

Scott said:
Have not seen this cross before, certainly a beautiful bird. Not intending to be judgmental, but many in aviculture have concerns with hybridization, particularly with endangered species such as the Citron. Don't believe we see this in nature, and may open a pandoras box of genetic nasties.

Regardless of origin, I hope the bird has a wonderful home and life. They are never the cause of human tinkering and ought be respected for their intrinsic goodness.

Scott said it best. Beautiful bird, but opens up a whole pandoras box of bad things regarding genetics and the species itself.
As far as the concern, will buying the bird be supporting the breeder? Someone is going to buy this regardless, so if you want to give the bird a good life, go for it. You may get some nasty looks from aviculturists who see him but explaining the situation would solve that. What this person does, as irresponsible as it may be, is out of your hands and theres nothing you can do besides talk to them about why this is wrong. If you have a moral objection, then ovviously you wouldnt want to buy it, but if you want to give the bird a good life, its already alive and is in need of love. Be reafy for possible health issues though.

plumsmum2005 · Dec 14, 2016

Just opens another can of worms - the more of these birds are sold, the more that will be bred. £'s/$'s rule the world unfortunately.

The thing is how often would something like this crop up in their natural environment? If the answer is hardly ever there is a reason for that IMO.

Hoping this bird gets it's forever home and is happy and healthy and does not end up suffering if it turns out to have genetic issues that are unable to be helped by the Veterinary profession and/or the owner is unwilling to pay vets fees after having paid a rather large sale fee in the first place.

Very interesting regarding the colours it is though.

JustineBird · Dec 14, 2016

Welcome to the boards. Epic Bird mix and defiantly unique.

MrsBigE · Dec 14, 2016

I'm surprised that the Orange is so dominant... He's cute and he sure would be a conversation starter. Since both parents are Toos he'd probably be smart as a whip but has domestic breeding progressed enough that people are actually starting to breed more and more of these mutations and finding it to be profitable? History shows if people can make a profit they'll do it whether it's"right" or not. Seems sad to me to see the beauty of the distinct species lost for money or entertainment. Imho.

thekarens · Dec 15, 2016

I'm one of those that's vehemently opposed to hybridization, especially in macaws, but I also don't judge the bird or the pet owner. But I would encourage anyone who wants a hybrid to try the rescue route first instead of encouraging breeders by supporting them financially.

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kiwifeathers · Feb 7, 2017

Well as an update on this guy, I saw he was still for sale when I was browsing the other day, so I emailed his breeder about him out of curiosity. He was apparently an accident after all. The price was reflecting that he was a citron cross (supposedly the pure citrons go for a lot more). I rarely see parrots for less than $1k, so I suppose it makes sense.

He has grown to be slightly larger than a normal galah, but hasn't changed colour much yet though he may after moulting. He is starting to talk, with a squeaky citron voice apparently! The breeder owns a pet store and he is out of his cage there all day and is a favourite with the customers; the only problem she is having with him is getting him off people!

I'm not a fan of the idea of supporting irresponsible breeding, especially when it comes to hybirds, but there's just something about this bird that keeps drawing me back to him, and if he was an accidental breeding... I don't know. Its a gut feeling, the same one that drew me to the best dog I ever had.

From what the breeder has said he sounds perfect for a bird that can come to work with me at the pet store, since he is already comfortable in that environment. I have a place I'm lined up to look at so I have a couple of weeks yet to think about it. Advice guys? Did any of you ever pick between head and heart?

itchyfeet · Feb 7, 2017

Hi Kiwifeathers!
Lo you and me both with the 'drawn to him' thing - you should get him so I don't have to

I've always said if I had a big bird, it'd be an African Grey. But my inlaws have a sulfur, and we had mums galah as a long term boarder last year - both birds are really fun! But - we're not drawn to, or suited to cockatoos. His price is up there, but then parrots here are all pretty expensive comparatively anyways.
Doesn't mean this fella hasn't been on my TM watchlist for ages..... Good luck with your decision.

kiwifeathers · Feb 7, 2017

itchyfeet said:
Hi Kiwifeathers!
Lo you and me both with the 'drawn to him' thing - you should get him so I don't have to I've always said if I had a big bird, it'd be an African Grey. But my inlaws have a sulfur, and we had mums galah as a long term boarder last year - both birds are really fun! But - we're not drawn to, or suited to cockatoos. His price is up there, but then parrots here are all pretty expensive comparatively anyways.
Doesn't mean this fella hasn't been on my TM watchlist for ages..... Good luck with your decision.

Haha, funny to see someone else who has had their eye on him here! I've always had a bit of a connection with 'toos. Galahs in particular I always get on great with. The breeder also said that their lutino galah or corella baby would be suitable for my situation, but didn't recommend the amazon (I think they are very cool, but tend to agree with her lol).

He's still cheaper than that beautiful red tailed black on there...! XD

itchyfeet · Feb 8, 2017

I would have gone to meet the Amazon if I had lived closer - but we're in Canterbury. Just gotta be patient for my grey....closest breeder to us that I am aware of is Gloriavale...I've been trying to come up with a righteous name should we go that route....still undecided.

The lutino Galah is pretty special and still holds that point of difference - are you going to go check it out?

kiwifeathers · Feb 8, 2017

itchyfeet said:
I would have gone to meet the Amazon if I had lived closer - but we're in Canterbury. Just gotta be patient for my grey....closest breeder to us that I am aware of is Gloriavale...I've been trying to come up with a righteous name should we go that route....still undecided.

The lutino Galah is pretty special and still holds that point of difference - are you going to go check it out?

Didn't know Gloriavale bred birds lol!

The only thing with the lutino Galah is she's a female, and I've heard its better to get the opposite of the owner? Trying to look into corellas more but they don't seem to be as commonly kept so I'm having trouble finding as solid info as with the galahs and other too's. I should know within a couple of weeks if everything is a go for a parrot! Keeping in touch with the breeder until then, after that can pursue things more seriously.

itzjbean · Feb 8, 2017

What a striking, unique cockatoo!! I myself love hybrid macaws, just love their spectacular colors. I don't see hybrid cockatoos as much as macaws. Anyways, I looked around a little bit how much Cintrons are selling for....and the ones I'm seeing listed are only around $1400-2000. Unless I'm mistaken, this breeder is lying to you. Citrons are not worth more than they are charging for this baby. 4k is a ridiculous amount for this bird.

Though I understand the uniqueness of these hybrids, when breeders overcharge several thousand dollars over the price of the chick's parents all it says to me is: I'm looking to make a HUGE profit on this bird. But maybe if you show the breeder of this bird the current prices of Citrons being sold elsewhere, they may lower this price? I wouldn't count on it, though. Good luck!!

kiwifeathers · Feb 8, 2017

itzjbean said:
What a striking, unique cockatoo!! I myself love hybrid macaws, just love their spectacular colors. I don't see hybrid cockatoos as much as macaws. Anyways, I looked around a little bit how much Cintrons are selling for....and the ones I'm seeing listed are only around $1400-2000. Unless I'm mistaken, this breeder is lying to you. Citrons are not worth more than they are charging for this baby. 4k is a ridiculous amount for this bird.

Though I understand the uniqueness of these hybrids, when breeders overcharge several thousand dollars over the price of the chick's parents all it says to me is: I'm looking to make a HUGE profit on this bird. But maybe if you show the breeder of this bird the current prices of Citrons being sold elsewhere, they may lower this price? I wouldn't count on it, though. Good luck!!

He's certainly interesting, so strange that what would be pink on a galah went orange!

Bare in mind that I'm in New Zealand, large parrots are much, much rarer and less commonly kept as pets here, in fact you don't even see them in zoos much. There are many species we don't have at all or aren't kept in large numbers. The two species of amazons I've seen sold range between 3-5k, macaws are probably more but are usually advertised as POA. A pair of Greenwings that are incredibly awful condition to the point I reported the listing for animal welfare concerns were being sold for $12k, and despite the state of them I'm sure they would of gotten it. I've never seen a Citron for sale; I didn't even know we had them here until I saw this hybrid baby lol
So while I'm not exactly defending what the breeder is charging (and believe me its giving me pause to a degree) its more understandable when larger birds are expensive in this country as it is.

Citron Crested x Galah Hybrid

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