CITES and Traveling with African Grey from US to SE Asia

Sufipoet

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Hi Everyone,

I appreciate the wonderful resource of this discussion forum.

I live in Virginia, and my wife and I are planning on relocating to SouthEast Asia for a few years, and then probably returning.

I have owned a Congo African Grey parrot since 2004 (with she was 2 months old).

I was reading the CITES information, and it states that I need a purchase receipt or some kind of documentation for her.

But, since it was 15 years ago, and I can't find the sales receipt, and I can't find the sexing document that I had for her when I purchased her, how should I approach this?

Thank you for your help.
 

SailBoat

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With great hope, you have been on a yearly Avian Professional examination schedule with your Parrot. As a result you have a document trail that reaches back over many years. That document trail will provide a Historical Statement of ownership. If not, it is time to build such a document trail.

While you are in said South Asia country you will need to maintain that document trail with a Certified Avian Vet (CAV) to be able to return with your Parrot.

Whether traveling from or to North America, you will need to assure that your Parrot is Healthy. Your Avian Professional (best if a CAV) will know the needed documents and protocols.

Select your Airline early and start working with them as to the documents required. Yes, the country you will be staying in as well.

As a warning, there are some countries that you maybe able to get your Parrot into, but getting out maybe another story. Researching is critical!!! Failure could be heart crushing if you are forced to leave your Parrot behind.

CITES has been in place for three years now in North America and individuals are still not getting, nor are breeders providing proper (if any) documentation on their CITES class Parrots.

FYI: If you are leaving soon, you are going to need to work very hard at collecting all the documentation /paperwork. Normally, it can take up to six months to get the information you need gathered. Returning could take up to a year.
 
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Sufipoet

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Thank you for your reply and advice, Sailboat...

I have had my grey in my life since 2004 (since she was 8 weeks old), and since I've been self-employed, I've been with her nearly every day during that time (handling her multiple times per day).

Unfortunately, even though she has been very loved and fed organic and fresh food, she has never seen an avian vet. I will make an appointment ASAP.

I do have a lot of evidence that I have had her for many years (Facebook photos and videos, personal photos and vids), and could receive affidavits from those who know both her and me (if I need to prove that I have had her since before 2017).

I'm concerned about having CITES issues.

My wife and I are planning to move to the Island nation of Sri Lanka (mainly for her work)m and we plan on staying at least 3 years, but do plan on moving back to the US again after a few years.

I'm grateful for ANY and all advice you have.



With great hope, you have been on a yearly Avian Professional examination schedule with your Parrot. As a result you have a document trail that reaches back over many years. That document trail will provide a Historical Statement of ownership. If not, it is time to build such a document trail.

While you are in said South Asia country you will need to maintain that document trail with a Certified Avian Vet (CAV) be be able to return with your Parrot.

Whether traveling from or to North America, you will need to assure that your Parrot is Healthy. Your Avian Professional (best if a CAV) will know the needed documents and protocols.

Select your Airline early and start working with them as to the documents required. Yes, the country you will be staying in as well.

As a warning, there are some countries that you maybe able to get your Parrot into, but getting out maybe another story. Researching is critical!!! Failure could be heart crushing if you are forced to leave your Parrot behind.

CITES has been in place for three years now in North America and individuals are still not getting, nor are breeders providing proper (if any) documentation on their CITES class Parrots.

FYI: If you are leaving soon, you are going to need to work very hard at collecting all the documentation /paperwork. Normally, it can take up to six months to get the information you need gathered. Returning could take up to a year.
 

Kiwibird

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Jul 12, 2012
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Does your parrot have a leg band? If so, that would at least prove she was hatched in captivity. I would definitively get her into an avian vet ASAP to start a document trail and get in contact with the appropriate authorities in both the US and where you’ll be moving to get further info on what can be done since you do not have the CITES documentation.

Also be aware, you may need to have her microchipped. That seems to be becoming a fairly common requirement for moving with parrots internationally. The avian vet should be able to do that if required.
 
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Sufipoet

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Thank you for your feedback, Kiwi...

My grey was hatched at the pet store with their breading pair, and they unfortunately did not band her.

Yes, I called am avian vet and they told me to call Fish and Game to make sure that I have the most up-to-date information.

And yes... the vet recommended microchipping my grey. I did ask if it would at all be painful for my grey, and the vet's office did not think so, but I can't imagine how it would not feel uncomfortable to have a piece of metal imbedded in your chest (if you are a small creature like a parrot). But, if it needs to be done, it needs to be done.

Does your parrot have a leg band? If so, that would at least prove she was hatched in captivity. I would definitively get her into an avian vet ASAP to start a document trail and get in contact with the appropriate authorities in both the US and where you’ll be moving to get further info on what can be done since you do not have the CITES documentation.

Also be aware, you may need to have her microchipped. That seems to be becoming a fairly common requirement for moving with parrots internationally. The avian vet should be able to do that if required.
 

noodles123

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Hey-- even though you waited to get her into the vet, do get her into the vet for blood-work etc (not because you are travelling, but because it is recommended to do so 1x per year for all parrots).
 
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Sufipoet

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Absolutely Noodles (and thank you for the suggestion).

The receptionist at the Vets office today expressed the same thing.

Hey-- even though you waited to get her into the vet, do get her into the vet for blood-work etc (not because you are travelling, but because it is recommended to do so 1x per year for all parrots).
 

SailBoat

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STOP!

Lets start-over.
A Certified Avian Vet will know what you need as far as their side of the document trail. I.E. they would not send you to fish and wild life until they know that your Parrot is healthy. If your Vet is not Signature Level to provide Health Documents for International Travel, you need to find a Certified Avian Vet. They can be rare away from major cities!

This requires a very direct question of the Vet you are about to see. Most people cannot afford the cost or time of having to do everything again if your Vet does not have the Certificate to Sign Health Documents required by the US Government and the involved Airline. Same is true in Canada.

Identification in North America. Parrot are consider Property and only positive Identification of ownership is accepted by all but smaller town court systems. And, today, that is a register Micro Chip.

NOTE: Cat, Dog and Horse Vets regularly place Micro Chips in those Animals. They rarely place them in Avian clients. If your Vet is not a CAV, I strongly recommend that you
not have them place a Micro Chip in your Parrot.

I truly understand your comfort regarding all of your document sets. That said, the Airline and the US Government, like the Court system want verifiable proof and sadly, that comes from a fairly small group of sources. I honestly do not know what you have that would be acceptable. So, I would consistent on the basics first. Your CAV and your Airlines. The Airline you choice has a great interest in you having the correct and properly completed document by approved sources so that they do not have a Parrot on the tarmac that will not be accepted into the country you are traveling too, nor back into the US.
 
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SailBoat

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I am sorry if I seem pushy, but as stated above: Having a full International travel level examination is a critical part of this process. That includes a complete blood scan, stool examination, a full hands-on physical examination. Depending on the findings, an Xray maybe required. FYI: This examination will not be inexpensive!!!

The vast majority of CAV's are photographing their Clients and placing that photo on their medical documents for both control in their facility and for assured acceptance of that and each additional document they create for your Parrot.

I commonly do not push hard on member and also new members, but not in this regard. You will quickly pick-up on the reality that this is not going to be cheap by any means! You must be seeing a Certified Avian Vet! Although the CAV MAY accept the document provide by a Vet, they will only have to redo many of the tests to assure and receive their Signature!!!

Please, when are you leaving!

Note: If it is soon, you may have to travel later with your Parrot. Most Agencies and Airlines will work with you, but there are specific steps that require specific lengths of time.
 

SailBoat

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By the way, is the Pet Store still open???
A document from them would be very helpful.
Even if now closed, if that owner is still in the area, a document from they will be just as helpful.

Sorry for the flash of Posts!


Thank you for your feedback, Kiwi...

My grey was hatched at the pet store with their breading pair, and they unfortunately did not band her.

Yes, I called am avian vet and they told me to call Fish and Game to make sure that I have the most up-to-date information.

And yes... the vet recommended microchipping my grey. I did ask if it would at all be painful for my grey, and the vet's office did not think so, but I can't imagine how it would not feel uncomfortable to have a piece of metal imbedded in your chest (if you are a small creature like a parrot). But, if it needs to be done, it needs to be done.

Does your parrot have a leg band? If so, that would at least prove she was hatched in captivity. I would definitively get her into an avian vet ASAP to start a document trail and get in contact with the appropriate authorities in both the US and where you’ll be moving to get further info on what can be done since you do not have the CITES documentation.

Also be aware, you may need to have her microchipped. That seems to be becoming a fairly common requirement for moving with parrots internationally. The avian vet should be able to do that if required.
 
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Sufipoet

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I am sorry if I seem pushy, but as stated above: Having a full International travel level examination is a critical part of this process....

Hi Sailboat...

No, I didn't take what you wrote to be pushy (just emphatic).

I really appreciate the detailed information and the genuine concern and desire to help.

The pet store closed several years ago, and the owner moved to Brazil where he was originally from. I MAY have found his profile on Facebook, and I sent him a Facebook message in the hopes he will respond.

Since I live in Northern Virginia, I believe that I found a good Avian vet, and I was told by the vet's receptionist that they have 2 avian vets who can issue Health Certificates. So, I think I have that covered.

I appreciate your comment and insight that microchipping establishes ownership. Since I don't have a sales receipt or previous Vet visits, the microchip (as well as over a decade worth of photos and Facebook posts, plus possible affidavits from people who know me and the bird) is the only proof of ownership I have. I also have been boarding my Grey with a Virginia Bird store for a few years, and I am sure that they could attest to the fact that she is my bird.

This Northern VA vet office did tell me that before I schedule a health exam with them, that I should make some calls and make sure of the requirements of the country I am traveling to (since each country has different regulations). The vet's office manager also said that I should also consult with the airline I plan on traveling with, since each airline may have different requirements.

I am also concerned about the trip back (My wife and I MAY return to the U.S. after about 3 years overseas). I read on the US Fish and Wildlife Service that I may need a Vet's exam in the country of departure, and I'm not sure if there is a certified avian vet in Sri Lanka. I do want to call the USFWS to understand what they require.

Thank you for any other suggestions and thoughts.

Being bird owners, you know how attached my Grey must be to me (and vise versa), since she has been in my life since she was 8 weeks old.
 

SailBoat

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Thanks for understanding.

FYI: Please take a little time and read a Thread in the Amazon Forum. You will find it near the top of that forum, highlighted in light blue with a Title: I Love Amazons - ...

You will find that the vast majority of that Huge Thread will apply to near all Parrots and that you will quickly see that the Author and this Forum deeply share your belief in the deep loving places these wonderful feathered creatures create in our hearts. The Thread is based around the concept of 'Segments' with each segment covering specific information in the Loving and Caring for Parrots. The first page has a listing of the segments and which page they are found since more than one Segment can be on the same page.

I have found the Thread to be an excellent tool for those 'Owned by a Parrot' and for for those who have been owned for a very long time (like me), it is an excellent reminder...

May you enjoy it and find it useful.
 

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