Luna is trying my patience - I need help

TheNamesLuna

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I had a budgie for 13 years who died in 2014
HI ALL
Luna is trying my patience - and I usually have a lot....
She won't stop going for my fingers or my hair.

I am getting more nervous of having her out of the cage & I know that won't help as she wants to be out.

  • When I am in the room she plays happily on her own in her cage, and also likes to watch me. When I leave the room sometimes it's like a dog has got hold of a squeaky toy & won't stop!!!

  • She sits at the door and watches me till I let her out. Then when I sit down she flies to me, wanting to be with me - ok so far.

  • then she wants her way & climbs into my hair. She gets tangled in my hair, pulls on it & this gives me a headache, so I have been trying to stop her, and trying to remove her, and she goes for my fingers or hands

  • when she is on my shoulder she can be the sweetest thing ever & gives me kisses etc.
  • It's like living with a Jeckle & Hyde bird

  • Then she keeps going for my fingers and hands, even when I am doing something else & not trying to touch her. Example is she is sat on my shoulder nicely & I am talking to her while doing computer stuff, when suddenly she will just go for my fingers/hands. they are not even near her and she will jump down and attack them.

  • She is spending a lot of time chewing on baby toys in her cage - baby teathing rings seem to be a thing she loves! Could this be making her bite more?

  • If the bird people I purchased her from got it right, then she is about 9 months old (Not DNA'ed) so could it be puberty early stages??

  • She is eating well.
    She has stopped melting, for now anyway
    She is drinking well
    Her poo is normal
    she is developing lovely new feathers & I have been helping her pins, with head scratches which she has been loving up till last week.

Any help and advice would be great as I am trying to cope with this at the same time as my own health having a go at me, and I am feeling a bit overwhelmed.
I love her & want to do whats right, but there are times when I want to ring her neck (Don't worry, I Wont do it! I mean metaphorically not literally!)

Thanks Guys
 

Laurasea

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My GCC is very jealous of my phone and the attention I show it!!! This can be the issues with attackes on fingers when useing the computer. You are paying attention to that dang thing and she wants you to stop! ;) I had to give Ta-dah treats when ever I had the phone out, I can hold the phone, but I can't talk on it !! Nope a full blown attack if I do.
 
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TheNamesLuna

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My GCC is very jealous of my phone and the attention I show it!!! This can be the issues with attackes on fingers when useing the computer. You are paying attention to that dang thing and she wants you to stop! ;) I had to give Ta-dah treats when ever I had the phone out, I can hold the phone, but I can't talk on it !! Nope a full blown attack if I do.

Thanks Laura, but sadly its not just when I am using the computer. its even when she has my complete attention. she can be sat on my chest and just goes for my fingers when I am trying to stroke her or even just talk to her.

But there are other times when she is lovely.
I don't get it
 
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TheNamesLuna

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GaleriaGila

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The Rickeybird, 38-year-old Patagonian Conure
Ah, my friend...

Parrots.

PARROTS!

May I ramble a bit, claiming no absolutes or expertise beyond my own Planet Rickeybird history? Maybe there is a nugget of encouragement or advice or even just humor...

I hope I don't sound preach-y. I also want to make it clear that I completely support all the great advice on training!
My bird is "difficult", and so I have expressed these thoughts so often that I made a cut-and-paste (below). Apologies to those of you who've heard it a zillion times!

My bird is pretty awful. He's a fun mimic and a real character, but...
Even after all these years, I sometimes find myself putting myself or my bird down... stuff like...
I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PUT UP WITH THIS OR THAT.
WHY CAN'T HE BE SWEET AND NICE, LIKE THOSE OTHER BIRDS?
PEOPLE NEVER UNDERSTAND WHY I PUT UP WITH THIS.
Stuff like that.

Since he's fully flighted, the ONLY way I get him into the cage is to toss a chile pepper in and he flaps in after it. So food reward is a necessity for me. Time-out doesn't exist in the Rb's kingdom.
But the Rb is a parrot... in his particular case, one generation out of the wild.
I do all the right things, as much/well as I can, but in the end, I just LOVE my bird,
Some parrots are SO SWEET, some are NOT. I'm a bit JEALOUS of those successes.
I have lessened my psychological and physical wounds over the decades... not because I've changed the bird, but I have changed me. And a lot of that has involved giving up on a lot of my desires/expectations. After years of battle, I surrendered.
Consequently, I have a Tazmanian Devil on my hands. I love him. I have no complaints, really. He's HIMSELF. And I'm MYSELF. And the result... check my Signature for videos. etc., if you like.
BUT THERE'S LOTS OF GOOD TRAINING ADVICE HERE... DO READ AND LEARN AND DO YOUR BEST!
Over the years, I have sometimes been very embarassed/downhearted/sad about having a pet that was so... out of my control. But it is my choice to indulge and adore him.
Finally, I accepted that I have an amazing half-wild being who shares my life! It's magic enough for me!

Parrot-owners usually wind up determining their own personal comfort level with various behaviors, and it's okay to be okay with that.

You hang in there!
 

noodles123

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Jul 11, 2018
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Sounds like she is biting for attention. When she bites, put her down immediately and ignore her completely. Do not look at her...a neutral "no bite", followed by "shunning" (no talking, no looking, moving away) will likely do the trick over time. If she is flighted, I would leave the room and not return until she is quiet...walk away for a minute or so and then return as long as there is no screaming.
If the biting is not for attention, then this method will not work as well....a fear-biting bird would need to be handled differently, as leaving would be gratifying the very reason for their bite.
 
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TheNamesLuna

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Luna has been sat in the cage watching me since I put her back in there, before I started this thread, because of her last bite. That was almost 2 hours ago. She wants to be out with me but because of her last bite I said no & put her back in.
I am going to bed soon, trying to decide if I let her out first or just say goodnight & leave her till tomorrow. Although it's late, she is still wide awake. Usually by now she is trying to sleep.

I thought of another thing - I can be feeding her a treat & she will be enjoying it, then suddenly go for my fingers for no reason. She does this with her fruit snacks & pumpkin seeds & I really don't know why.....
 

Sandy19

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Is she biting really hard or just an annoying pinch? If it's just a pinch then she probablly is doing it for attention, Peanut does it to me occassionally and it seems like it's a fun game to her at my expense. She likes to attack my feet and when I tell her to stop it she tells me no in this bratty little voice. She has mastered the step up, however, and will step up no matter how much fun she's having tormenting me. I get her to step up and try to distract her with something else. Sometimes that doesn't work and she'll proceed to climb down my leg and attack my feet again and that's when I pick her up, sit her to the side and walk away completetly shunning her. You're probably going to have to start working with her on stepping up consistently. Until she gets that mastered you're going to have to just gently fling her off your hand when she attacks it and walk away from her.
 

noodles123

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Umbrella Cockatoo- 15? years old..I think?
I would let her out--- think of her as a toddler. They forget why they are in trouble after a short time. You want her to make the connection between being good = time with mom and being bad = time away. If you wait too long, the impact is lost. Your responses and rewards need to be fairly close to the behavioral occurrence. If she isn't screaming, you don't have to wait that long to make your point (as long as you aren't attending to her during the shunning). Also, the next time she bites, if I were you, I would put her down and leave the room...You said she has been watching you, which means she is still within her comfort zone...Didn't you say she was always okay watching you, as long as you were near? Not seeing you is what is going to be most meaningful (from my perspective).
 
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TheNamesLuna

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ok, so I've just done a video of our bedtime tonight.
It was almost the same last night, except last night I got a bad bite when my finger got too close.
Here's the video.

I am off to bed as it's 1am here - Luna has been awake for about 13 hours!
 
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TheNamesLuna

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[ame="https://youtu.be/QHa0prxS8xA"]30 November 2018 - YouTube[/ame]
 

noodles123

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Okay- when she bites like that, don't jerk away and don't react. Keep your hand there and repeat "step up" in the same tone. You may be bitten, but she doesn't seem scared...this seems like limit testing. Your tone is just exciting enough that she may be getting a kick out of the cause-and-effect of you saying step-up, her biting, you pulling away and saying "NO!"....You can see that her body language gets really cocky after that pull-away...like, "WHAT- COME AT ME!" (even though she trusts you).

The video just had an error, but you need to be confident---not saying to push the issue (if she were posturing from the moment you put your hand out, then I would say try again later), but she was fine with being petted and then decided to act up. This seems cheeky...I would not react...Best case scenario, she steps up. Worst-case scenario, you keep your hand there and get bitten....Just my opinion....I have an Umbrella Cockatoo who used to bite me lightly (gradually pushing down more and more) just to get a reaction. She doesn't do it anymore though...


Another MAJOR thought---before anything else...my bird gets that way when she is overly tired. If it is 1AM, how much past her bedtime is it, and how many hours of sleep is she getting. She may just be SUPER tired and in that case, ignore my advice above. Birds need a solid 10-14 hours to be happy and healthy...They also need a light and Dark routine.
 

Laurasea

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Also my GCC doesn't like her wings to be touched like that. And I would present your step up so the the palm is facing you and the flat side to her, I hold my hand a little closer and just s bit higher. When you pull your hand away so quick so many times it makes them not trust that it's a steady hand to step up to. She is one gorgeous GCC!!!!! Wow!!!
 
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TheNamesLuna

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On my phone, so please forgive any mistakes in typing.
I think me jerking my hand away its because she has made me nervous with the biting in the last few days. She has always been happy to step up on my fingers and almost always plan down on a single finger. I am nervous if her biting me hence not holding my finger too close. Luna seems to enjoy a top to tail stroke, or usually does anyway.

As for sleep, I have a very funny sleep pattern but in going to bed now I can guarantee she will get about 11 to 12 hours sleep tonight because that’s what I need to have a good day tomorrow. Also I was out for four hours earlier today and I expect she slept for some or all of that.
 

noodles123

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I would strongly consider trying to get her into a true routine (even if that means you waking her up and going back to sleep). Birds need a certain number of hours in light and dark each day to regulate hormones etc. My bird doesn't know how to read clocks, but within the hour, she wakes herself up and puts herself to be nightly...unless I keep her up an hour later...then she usually sleeps a bit later.


The point is, you would be much better off with consistency and routine...If you have to sleep at odd hours, consider getting a sleep cage and putting her in a room away from your noise.
 

Sandy19

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It doesnt look like shes ready to give you an all out bite in that video, as Noodles said it looks like shes being cocky. I know its hard, but I would try not to jerk my hand away. Also, is she used to you wearing nail polish? I only ask because you said it's just been happening the past couple of days.
 

LordTriggs

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Rio (Yellow sided conure) sadly no longer with us
yes that does appear to not be an angry "F*** OFF!" bite but more of a "haha got you!" bite. If for now you're worried about biting, which then gets exacerbated by you (quite naturally) pulling away which makes her think "hey that doesn't look too stable, best check with the ol' beak". until things are calm and you get some confidence back try using one of the perches from her cage and hold it in your hand to transport her.

As for when she is being a bit of a brat and biting you I go by shunning as the best (I found) way to curb biting especially like that, which is when she bites you give a stern but not excitable 'no' then if she's on you, put her down and turn around for a like 2 minutes (the equivalent of about 4 centuries in bird shun time) then once time's up ask for a step up and go back to fun time. If she isn't on you then give her a firm "no" just like the first time and turn around. I specifically say not to leave because sometimes, the goal is for you to leave which can reinforce the behavior so turning keeps you there but suddenly the attention isn't on them which may as well be the 7th sounding of the trumpet so to speak. It may take a couple tries at first to get it to stick but keep consistent and persistent and it will fingers crossed get through to her and help you and her understand limits a bit more.

As an addendum I found ruling out the beak entirely isn't fair on them, imagine ruling out a child touching you with their hands cause they smacked once. So only do so when the beak is uncomfortable for you. Be it a place you don't like or too much pressure. A little nibble or a communicating use of beak (the pressure you're comfortable with is the key to that one)

Best of luck to you!
 

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I agree w/ Noodles - the 'time out' needs to be immediiate after the bites, so a connection can be drawn by Luna to the bad behaviour. ANd no cage time - cages are the birds satuary and should no be seen as a punishment or a negative space. Instead - put Luna on a chair back and turn your back to her - no eye contact what so ever for like 5 minutes. Chair backs are ideal - easy to get Luna onto it. ANd lastly, be PERSISTANT. Most parrot owners do not have the patients to see training for behaviour modification through to the end and parrots are stubborn creatures. They will out stubborn their owner. Furthermore, changing tactics after a short period of time only serves to confuse the bird, so pick a training technique and stick to it for ,oh, say 6 months, and if at that point the technique does not seem to be effetive, then re-evaluate.
 

Jenypher

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With regard to the computer, specifically, she may think your fingers are a game. I have a two computer setup for work, and I move between the two machines, which are side by side on a table. My youngest cockatiel (a little younger than your Luna) thinks this is the GREATEST game. She will run to whichever keyboard I'm on and will bother my fingers (she doesn't bite them, she just kind of pokes them). When I move to the other computer, Melvin follows! She also thinks the keyboard cover is her personal challenge to remove and throw on the floor. My GCC was the reason for they keyboard covers. He ripped off the down arrow so often, it couldn't be reattached! He was totally fascinated by the keys. The screen --> couldnt have cared less.

My GCC also went through a bit of a nasty phase around that same age where he wouldn't let me take him out of the cage with my hands, and it would result in lots of flailing about. I used a stick for step ups during that period, which might be helpful to you, too. Obviously different behavior, but maybe it's something with the age. He did LOVE to be tangled in hair, but I keep mine super short, so he had to wait for unsuspecting visitors, like my mother.

With regard to your hair, that may also be a fun game, and the biting could possibly be a tantrum (I KNOW YOU'RE ABOUT TO TAKE ME OUT OF THIS FUN HAIR, SO I WILL BITE). I know this is going to sound stupid, but maybe try wearing a hat for awhile, to thwart that particular activity. No hair, no tangles = no bites!

Good luck :)
 
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