Eye Gel for conure?

Pine18 · Mar 20, 2019

Hi everyone hope some one can give some advice on ny current situation. I have a greencheek conure and fordt time bird owner .i recently noticed something wrong with one of eyes - watery, itchy and slightly red on lower eyelid.
Being in the UK and it is hard to find a vet who treat birds and none closeby.
I was desperate so i booked a appointment with a local vet who says she treats parrots...the appointment process - not a avian vet and to me looked inexperienced at the end I was charged high fees and was given a eyegel called Clinigel -Vet eye gel Gentamicin 0.3% - Now what I have read this is for CATS AND DOGS ONLY .
Applying it on my conure's eyes is hard enough and I'm not even sure if this eye gel is for birds!
Also she was not socialised or handled much when I got her - she would only perch onto a stick ,she is terrified of towels and gloves, I do not want to scare /injure her or break any little trust she has built with me - but the vet told me the only way was to towel her and rub the gel around her eyes..Please
Any advice or info will be much appreciated! Thanks

T00tsyd · Mar 20, 2019

Hi I'm in the UK too but I have an avian vet near. What about finding one online and giving them a call and asking the question?

EllenD · Mar 20, 2019

It's labeled for dogs and cats, but it's perfectly fine to use in your bird's eye...Gentamycin is actually a very good, broad-spectrum Antibiotic and is in the correct family of Antibiotics that treat the most common strains of bacteria that cause eye infections...In the US the common prescription antibiotic eye-ointments that are prescribed by Vets contain Terramycin, which is in the same family as Gentamycin...So the Vet actually did prescribed exactly the correct prescription antibiotic for a bacterial eye infection for your bird...

The only issue is that they didn't take a culture/swab of your bird's eye and look at it under their microscope, or send it out to a lab for culture, did they? So they have no idea whether or not your bird actually has an eye infection that is caused by bacteria, it may be a fungal/yeast eye infection, or something all together different...But the most common cause of what your bird has is in-fact a bacterial eye infection that Gentamycin will treat...

So the bottom-line is keep giving your bird the Gentimycin ointment in his eye as-prescribed, probably once or twice a day, and watch his eyes, both of the, carefully...If his eye is not markedly improved after about a week of giving him the Gentamycin ointment daily, or if his other eye also becomes affected, then you need to take him right back to the Vet and ask them to do a culture before they prescribe a different medication, so that they can prescribe the correct medication the second time around...But chances are that the Gentamycin will clear it up pretty quickly.

Also, just an FYI, if you start to notice ANY signs or symptoms of an Upper Respiratory Infection in your bird, such as your bird starting to cough, sneeze, wheezing or clicking sounds when he breathes, open-mouth breathing, etc., then you need to get him right back to the Vet immediately, because what you always have to worry about when a bird develops Conjunctivitis (an eye infection), is that it's secondary to Psittacosis Chlamydia. The very first signs of Psittacosis in a parrot are #1) Upper Respiratory Symptoms like coughing, wheezing, etc., and then #2) Conjunctivitis, usually in both eyes but sometimes only in one eye, depending on whether or not it's gotten into the sinus passage of one eye or both eyes...Your bird probably simply has a bacterial eye infection and the Gentamycin will clear it right up, but you always need to be aware of it being something else...Just keep an eye on him and keep giving him the Gentamycin as prescribed, and he should be fine.

LordTriggs · Mar 20, 2019

hi there, I know how you feel with the lack of avian vets here! Any chance you divulge a part of the UK you're from? I found that some vets here don't really advertise themselves much so some of us here may be able to help find a closer avian vet to you

dhraiden · Mar 20, 2019

Seconding EllenD's excellent advice on the matter. I have some of the following on hand in case of anything.

https://glamgouldians.com/product-terramycin-eye.php

SassiBird · Mar 20, 2019

I just went through this with one of my birds. EllenD is on point with my experience with my vet.

Pine18 · Mar 21, 2019

Thanks I'm currently in the West Midlands and from what I've seen online it looks like there are some in Wolverhampton& Birmingham ,the problem is it will take me over an hour to get there...My green cheek also get travel sick very easily....

Pine18 · Mar 21, 2019

Thank you EllenD! even the vet I saw was not as half as thorough and explanatory as you! I am very glad to know the gel is safe to use for my birds! Yes ,you are right no instruments or culture/swab was taken during the appointment.. if anything the vet just had a quick look at the bird whilst she was in her cage....
According to the vet my green cheek had eye trauma...I assume this injury lead to her eye infection? but yes I will apply the ointment for 1 week and keep an close eye on her. Thank u very much for your reply!

Pine18 · Mar 21, 2019

dhraiden said:
Seconding EllenD's excellent advice on the matter. I have some of the following on hand in case of anything.

https://glamgouldians.com/product-terramycin-eye.php

Thanks! will have a look!

EllenD · Mar 21, 2019

If your bird actually scratched the lens of his/her eye, then the Vet did exactly what any certified Avian Vet or Avian Specialist Vet would do as well: The scratch on his/her eye will just take time to heal, as long as they didn't see any internal damage or separation of the cornea, then all you can do is wait for the eye to heal, and prescribed a broad-spectrum antibiotic ointment or drop to prevent any bacterial infection from setting-in to the injury. And Terramycin/Gentamycin is perfect...

Pine18 · Mar 23, 2019

EllenD said:
If your bird actually scratched the lens of his/her eye, then the Vet did exactly what any certified Avian Vet or Avian Specialist Vet would do as well: The scratch on his/her eye will just take time to heal, as long as they didn't see any internal damage or separation of the cornea, then all you can do is wait for the eye to heal, and prescribed a broad-spectrum antibiotic ointment or drop to prevent any bacterial infection from setting-in to the injury. And Terramycin/Gentamycin is perfect...

Hi, I'm not sure if there was any damage to the lens of her eyes, ,all the the vet told me it was due to eye trauma.
My conure has free flight in the house , and unfortunately did bump into the glass windows once or twice though she seemed fine and was eating,active and vocal like her usual self. I can only assume this incident lead to her current eye problem...
I am applying the gel on to her infected eye everyday as the vet has instructed me, there are some slight improvement as she's not getting anymore discharges from her eyes but can sometimes still appear very watery, so still quite concerned.
The eye gel treatment is only for one week .
At the moment I'm cleaning/wiping her cage more frequently incase of any bacteria build up ,taking extra precautions during her time out of the cage and trying to encourage her to intake more fresh veg and fruit(still working on this)
I really do hope the eye heals soon. Thanks again for your info and advice

EllenD · Mar 24, 2019

Usually when they "injure" their eyes, it's actually a scratch on the lens of the eye, which will heal itself with no issues except for the possibility of infection, which your vet covered by prescribing the antibiotic...If the "injury" or "trauma" to your bird's eye was anything more than a scratch to the lens, I would imagine that the vet would have told you exactly what it was, because anything more than a scratch on the lens (which is by-far the most common injury to all eyes, including the eyes of people, dogs, cats, reptiles, etc.) typically requires additional treatment, for example a Detached-Retina, which is also a common injury/trauma to the eye, requires a special suturing procedure and a horribly awkward 24-hour period following where they have to be put under light-sedation and kept under it so that they will stay in a certain position for the entire 24-hours so that the Retinal re-attaches itself....

If your bird actually had any type of ***** "discharge" from the eye, then they were already suffering from Conjunctivitis, or bacterial infection of the eye...And if there was a discharge from both eyes, then both eyes had bacterial infection already. A scratch or other trauma to the eye will not result in a ***** or thick discharge unless it's infected already, and this would have been confirmed if BOTH EYES, even the non-injured eye also had a discharge, as bacterial eye infections easily and quickly spread from one eye to the other.

The eyes are probably "watering" because you're still putting the antibiotic ointment in both of them...If you finish the week-long antibiotic treatment in both eyes, and they continue to water, or if the thicker "discharge" comes back and starts again from either one or both eyes, then you need to immediately start the antibiotic again once daily and call your vet back to tell them that as soon as you stopped it the discharge started right back up. When that happens it's usually because the spectrum of the antibiotic wasn't quite right, it was in the correct "family" of antibiotics because it was able to cut-down the infection dramatically, but not able to fully kill it off. If that happens they'll probably want to change antibiotic ointments/drops, which is the correct course of treatment, however if the discharge does come back after you finish the week of treatment with the Gentamycin ointment, do not just allow the vet to prescribe another antibiotic and start giving it to your bird, instead this time you want to demand that the vet actually take a swab/culture from his eye and send it out to a lab (running a "Culture and Sensitivity") so that they can determine exactly what bacteria strain is causing the infection, and exactly what antibiotic that particular bacterial strain is "sensitive" to and will kill it off completely. Don't just go from antibiotic to antibiotic without a Culture and Sensitivity being run, which usually take about 3-4 days after they take the swab and send it out to a lab to get the results.

****Also, I'll say this again since his eyes are still "watery", which again is most-likely due to the antibiotic still being used, but just in-case the discharge does come back after you finish the week-long treatment, please pay close attention to your bird and if you hear any coughing, sneezing, wheezing when he breathes, "clicking" when he breathes, if his breathing seems at all labored like he's having to work to breath and you see his chest/belly/shoulders going up and down heavily, or if he starts to "open-mouth' breathe at all, or if you see any discharge coming from either nostril or any sneezes are wet, then this is when you need to either find a Certified Avian Vet, or you need to take-charge with this Vet that you already have (who seems to know what they're doing so-far so that's good), and demand that they take cultures/swabs and test your bird for Psittacosis Chlamydia, because the 2 main/first symptoms of Psittacosis Chlamydia are #1) Upper-Respiratory symptoms that I just described above, and #2) Conjunctivitis in BOTH EYES. I don't at all think that is what is wrong with your bird, I think he scratched is eye while flying and it got infected and spread to the other eye (if they both had thick discharge coming from them), so don't worry about it being anything more than that. You haven't described any Upper-Respiratory symptoms at all, so he's fine...I just want to make sure that you know that any time a bird (any species) has Conjunctivitis, you want to watch closely throughout the time they have the Conjunctivitis for any Upper-Respiratory symptoms going on, because Psittacosis Chlamydia is a bacterial infection that is very treatable, but it takes a LONG, LONG COURSE of oral or injectable Antibiotics to get rid of it, and it comes right back in about 90% or more of cases because the Vet doesn't do a long enough antibiotic course, or they use the wrong antibiotic (usually it takes a 48-day course of Doxycycline, or Doxycycline combined with Azithromycin, so it's a horrible pain in the ass)...So it's a pain in the ass to treat, and you want to get a jump on it. But I don't think your bird has it at all, just an FYI...

Pine18 · Mar 27, 2019

EllenD said:
Usually when they "injure" their eyes, it's actually a scratch on the lens of the eye, which will heal itself with no issues except for the possibility of infection, which your vet covered by prescribing the antibiotic...If the "injury" or "trauma" to your bird's eye was anything more than a scratch to the lens, I would imagine that the vet would have told you exactly what it was, because anything more than a scratch on the lens (which is by-far the most common injury to all eyes, including the eyes of people, dogs, cats, reptiles, etc.) typically requires additional treatment, for example a Detached-Retina, which is also a common injury/trauma to the eye, requires a special suturing procedure and a horribly awkward 24-hour period following where they have to be put under light-sedation and kept under it so that they will stay in a certain position for the entire 24-hours so that the Retinal re-attaches itself....

If your bird actually had any type of ***** "discharge" from the eye, then they were already suffering from Conjunctivitis, or bacterial infection of the eye...And if there was a discharge from both eyes, then both eyes had bacterial infection already. A scratch or other trauma to the eye will not result in a ***** or thick discharge unless it's infected already, and this would have been confirmed if BOTH EYES, even the non-injured eye also had a discharge, as bacterial eye infections easily and quickly spread from one eye to the other.

The eyes are probably "watering" because you're still putting the antibiotic ointment in both of them...If you finish the week-long antibiotic treatment in both eyes, and they continue to water, or if the thicker "discharge" comes back and starts again from either one or both eyes, then you need to immediately start the antibiotic again once daily and call your vet back to tell them that as soon as you stopped it the discharge started right back up. When that happens it's usually because the spectrum of the antibiotic wasn't quite right, it was in the correct "family" of antibiotics because it was able to cut-down the infection dramatically, but not able to fully kill it off. If that happens they'll probably want to change antibiotic ointments/drops, which is the correct course of treatment, however if the discharge does come back after you finish the week of treatment with the Gentamycin ointment, do not just allow the vet to prescribe another antibiotic and start giving it to your bird, instead this time you want to demand that the vet actually take a swab/culture from his eye and send it out to a lab (running a "Culture and Sensitivity") so that they can determine exactly what bacteria strain is causing the infection, and exactly what antibiotic that particular bacterial strain is "sensitive" to and will kill it off completely. Don't just go from antibiotic to antibiotic without a Culture and Sensitivity being run, which usually take about 3-4 days after they take the swab and send it out to a lab to get the results.

****Also, I'll say this again since his eyes are still "watery", which again is most-likely due to the antibiotic still being used, but just in-case the discharge does come back after you finish the week-long treatment, please pay close attention to your bird and if you hear any coughing, sneezing, wheezing when he breathes, "clicking" when he breathes, if his breathing seems at all labored like he's having to work to breath and you see his chest/belly/shoulders going up and down heavily, or if he starts to "open-mouth' breathe at all, or if you see any discharge coming from either nostril or any sneezes are wet, then this is when you need to either find a Certified Avian Vet, or you need to take-charge with this Vet that you already have (who seems to know what they're doing so-far so that's good), and demand that they take cultures/swabs and test your bird for Psittacosis Chlamydia, because the 2 main/first symptoms of Psittacosis Chlamydia are #1) Upper-Respiratory symptoms that I just described above, and #2) Conjunctivitis in BOTH EYES. I don't at all think that is what is wrong with your bird, I think he scratched is eye while flying and it got infected and spread to the other eye (if they both had thick discharge coming from them), so don't worry about it being anything more than that. You haven't described any Upper-Respiratory symptoms at all, so he's fine...I just want to make sure that you know that any time a bird (any species) has Conjunctivitis, you want to watch closely throughout the time they have the Conjunctivitis for any Upper-Respiratory symptoms going on, because Psittacosis Chlamydia is a bacterial infection that is very treatable, but it takes a LONG, LONG COURSE of oral or injectable Antibiotics to get rid of it, and it comes right back in about 90% or more of cases because the Vet doesn't do a long enough antibiotic course, or they use the wrong antibiotic (usually it takes a 48-day course of Doxycycline, or Doxycycline combined with Azithromycin, so it's a horrible pain in the ass)...So it's a pain in the ass to treat, and you want to get a jump on it. But I don't think your bird has it at all, just an FYI...

Thanks again EllenD for your info and reply, I've been closely monitoring her the good news is she doesn't seem to be have any breathing problems ,has the occasional sneeze(not frequent which is normal?) and still eating, active and very vocal as usual.
I cannot see anymore discharges from her infected eye at least not as obvious as before - however the eye is still slightly watery especially in the mornings.. not as bad as before but still noticable . It has been a week since using the gel.
Shall I see the vets again? or shall I wait to for it heal by itself? I am on a budget for this coming month so unless unavoidable I do want to avoid taking her to the local vet again especially if not avian specialised or qualified....

EllenD · Mar 28, 2019

Occasional sneezing is completely normal, and nothing to worry about unless it becomes a chronic, every day thing, and/or becomes "wet" with mucous coming from her nostrils...

As far as the "watering" of her eyes, is it a clear discharge? And is it coming from both eyes, or from only the injured eye?

If it's a totally clear discharge and it's only coming from the injured eye, then it's most-likely just due to some remaining irritation from the injury itself...I don't know if you've ever scratched your eyeball, but it's extremely annoying/frustrating and it will drive you insane if you don't get some prescription eye-drops that having something like Lidocaine in them to totally numb your eye...Otherwise it feels like you constantly have something in your eye 24/7 and you can't get it out no matter what you do. So that's most-likely the issue IF the discharge is totally clear and IF it's only coming from the injured eye...And it should go away with time after the scratch heals...

However, if the discharge is not clear but rather yellow, green, brown, etc. and on the thicker side, like pus or snot, then that means the eye is still infected and the Gentamycin probably wasn't the correct antibiotic to treat the strain of bacteria that causing the infection...The same goes for if the discharge is from BOTH eyes and not just the injured one...

***If the discharge is still yellow, green, brown, etc. and still on the thicker side even after finishing the entire course of Gentamycin ointment, then you do need to take her back to the Vet ASAP, because they need to take a swab and send it out to a laboratory to run a Culture/Sensitivity to determine exactly what bacterium and/or fungi is causing the infection, and exactly what antibiotic and/or anti-fungal medication will work to treat it. That usually takes about 2-3 days or so to get the results back from the lab because the culture has to have time to grow-out, so typically the Vet will give you an antibiotic of a different spectrum than the one you already tried for you to start using in both eyes right away, and then once they get the Culture/Sensitivity result back, if the antibiotic they gave you to start using isn't the correct one, or if another medication also needs to be added because it's also a fungal infection, then they'll call you and give you the correct medications.

***If it's just the injured/scratched eye that is still watery/runny, and if the discharge is completely clear, then I would give it another couple of days to allow enough time to see if it resolves itself and the runnyness is just due to lingering irritation due to the healing process...However, if the discharge doesn't go away in 2-3 days max, or if the discharge turns into a thicker, colored discharge, or it starts happening in BOTH eyes and not just the injured one, then you need to get him back in to the VET ASAP...Hopefully that isn't the case, it's just due to some lingering irritation from the scratch to the lens of the eye (as well as the 7 days of putting antibiotic ointment in it, which can also burn and cause irritation), and it will resolve itself completely in a day or two...

I understand about money/budgets, and waiting 2-3 days is fine as long as the discharge is totally clear...However, if the discharge goes from clear and runny to yellow/green/brown and thicker, or it doesn't stop in 2-3 days, then you really do have to take him back to the Vet, simply because you're dealing with the eyes and vision...

Any time I'm dealing with an issue regarding the Eyes or Ears (as well as the Hands on certain other animals, such as Primates/People), I take it very seriously and don't wait around too-long to act because of the potential of losing vision, hearing, and/or the use of the hands, all of which are devastating...And the problem with Eye and Ear trauma/infection/disease is that a lot of damage that results is permanent and non-reversible...With a bird, their Vision is a huge deal, and a bird living with one eye is much more difficult than other animals living with one eye because their eyes are on the sides of their head...So they lose vision diretly in front of them...Not nearly as big of a deal in pet/captive birds because they don't have to worry about predators, they don't have to forage for food, they don't have to fly for food, but it's still difficult...So just keep an eye on it (no pun intended, lol), it's probably just irritation and will go away in a day or two, but you never know...

Pine18 · Apr 3, 2019

EllenD said:
Occasional sneezing is completely normal, and nothing to worry about unless it becomes a chronic, every day thing, and/or becomes "wet" with mucous coming from her nostrils...

As far as the "watering" of her eyes, is it a clear discharge? And is it coming from both eyes, or from only the injured eye?

If it's a totally clear discharge and it's only coming from the injured eye, then it's most-likely just due to some remaining irritation from the injury itself...I don't know if you've ever scratched your eyeball, but it's extremely annoying/frustrating and it will drive you insane if you don't get some prescription eye-drops that having something like Lidocaine in them to totally numb your eye...Otherwise it feels like you constantly have something in your eye 24/7 and you can't get it out no matter what you do. So that's most-likely the issue IF the discharge is totally clear and IF it's only coming from the injured eye...And it should go away with time after the scratch heals...

However, if the discharge is not clear but rather yellow, green, brown, etc. and on the thicker side, like pus or snot, then that means the eye is still infected and the Gentamycin probably wasn't the correct antibiotic to treat the strain of bacteria that causing the infection...The same goes for if the discharge is from BOTH eyes and not just the injured one...

***If the discharge is still yellow, green, brown, etc. and still on the thicker side even after finishing the entire course of Gentamycin ointment, then you do need to take her back to the Vet ASAP, because they need to take a swab and send it out to a laboratory to run a Culture/Sensitivity to determine exactly what bacterium and/or fungi is causing the infection, and exactly what antibiotic and/or anti-fungal medication will work to treat it. That usually takes about 2-3 days or so to get the results back from the lab because the culture has to have time to grow-out, so typically the Vet will give you an antibiotic of a different spectrum than the one you already tried for you to start using in both eyes right away, and then once they get the Culture/Sensitivity result back, if the antibiotic they gave you to start using isn't the correct one, or if another medication also needs to be added because it's also a fungal infection, then they'll call you and give you the correct medications.

***If it's just the injured/scratched eye that is still watery/runny, and if the discharge is completely clear, then I would give it another couple of days to allow enough time to see if it resolves itself and the runnyness is just due to lingering irritation due to the healing process...However, if the discharge doesn't go away in 2-3 days max, or if the discharge turns into a thicker, colored discharge, or it starts happening in BOTH eyes and not just the injured one, then you need to get him back in to the VET ASAP...Hopefully that isn't the case, it's just due to some lingering irritation from the scratch to the lens of the eye (as well as the 7 days of putting antibiotic ointment in it, which can also burn and cause irritation), and it will resolve itself completely in a day or two...

I understand about money/budgets, and waiting 2-3 days is fine as long as the discharge is totally clear...However, if the discharge goes from clear and runny to yellow/green/brown and thicker, or it doesn't stop in 2-3 days, then you really do have to take him back to the Vet, simply because you're dealing with the eyes and vision...

Any time I'm dealing with an issue regarding the Eyes or Ears (as well as the Hands on certain other animals, such as Primates/People), I take it very seriously and don't wait around too-long to act because of the potential of losing vision, hearing, and/or the use of the hands, all of which are devastating...And the problem with Eye and Ear trauma/infection/disease is that a lot of damage that results is permanent and non-reversible...With a bird, their Vision is a huge deal, and a bird living with one eye is much more difficult than other animals living with one eye because their eyes are on the sides of their head...So they lose vision directly in front of them...Not nearly as big of a deal in pet/captive birds because they don't have to worry about predators, they don't have to forage for food, they don't have to fly for food, but it's still difficult...So just keep an eye on it (no pun intended, lol), it's probably just irritation and will go away in a day or two, but you never know...

I definately agree with you any vision related injury should be taken seriously! My GCC is a fully flighted bird and I intend to keep her that way - however if there is any permanent damage to her vision I will have to consider having her wings clipped...
Good news is there is no more coloured discharge from the injured eye, still looks slightly watery from time to time compared to her other eye. I think as you have suggested maybebest to give it more time and let some natural healing take place and continue to keep close watch. Really hoping the infection will fully heal and no more will come at the end of it!
Again many thanks for your posts! very informative and re assuring! hopefully next time I post again it will be something positive or being able to provide any useful info

Thanks

Eye Gel for conure?

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