Squawking

kristy_peaches · Jun 4, 2019

Hey guys,

I've posted a couple times about Peaches and her squawking. She's an 11 year old Meyers parrot, kept beside a window with a curtain blocking some light to her cage so the sun doesn't beam on her. I was at the end of my rope months ago and I get emotional knowing I have literally tried everything I can possibly think of. I even asked her vet for help and she said I'm doing everything I can do, which was not at all helpful.

At the end of the day she wants to be in or around her cage, but she has to have me there 24/7 or she squawks relentlessly, every 0-10 seconds until I come back into the room (which I try hard not to do). I have tried making her foraging toys to keep her busy. She will squawk while spending 10-20 minutes busy with her foraging toy if I'm not in the room.

When my husband gets home from work she squawks relentlessly, whether he tries to take her out of her cage to spend time with her or not. We can't even sit to have a meal without her squawking at us, even if we give her something to eat too (social feeding). My husband ate in the basement last night because whenever he's home, she just squawks.

We have tried covering her up for a time out, she's quiet while the blanket is covering the front of the cage, but then she squawks literally as soon as we take it off, if not minutes later.

We recently bought this remote control and hooked it up to a strobe light, so no matter where we were in the house if she started squawking, we turn on the strobe light beside her cage and it quieted her at first, but now she completely ignores it after a week.

I have tried longer training sessions, taking her outside now that the weather is nicer, bringing her into rooms with me, I only respond to her when she says words or makes small whistles. When she has been quiet for a period I will praise her (that's rare). But at the end of all this, she still squawks if I so much as leave the room to go to the bathroom.

So I'm reaching out one more time to see if there is any hope for this bird or if this is just who she is and I will just put her in her own room instead of the living room, so we can have some sanity.

Inger · Jun 4, 2019

I don’t have any wisdom, but this reply will bump your post back up so more people see it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

noodles123 · Jun 5, 2019

I responded last time you posted, and you never answered my questions.
The strobe light thing is not good. You need to stop trying to "punish"---this doesn't work with birds and it harms them.The same is true of covering the cage in response to screaming. By using a strobe and covering the cage when your bird misbehaves, you are messing up your birds hormones and light cycles. Light plays a vital role in their immune and hormonal health. Taking light away OR providing it in epilepsy-inducing flashes is harmful. By doing these things, you are also showing your bird that screaming has a direct impact on the things that happen within the environment.

You do not want to show your bird that their screaming results in you doing anything other than potentially ignoring or walking away. If you yell then the bird learns that screaming gets it attention (it makes you do things). If you cover the bird then it learns that screaming produces action (heck- it may enjoy being covered if it is hormonal). If you turn on a strobe when there is screaming, the bird is again shown that screaming causes things to happen. If the bird screams and you direct it to a toy, you are providing attention to the screaming.
It is like a behavior roulette slot-machine (Bird thinks: I am stressed/bored/hormonal/seeking attention--whatever. I scream. Every time I scream, something happens---that is kind of exciting, isn't it?! When I am bored or frustrated, I will scream because screaming causes things to change and it makes people do interesting things--plus screaming is already a hard-wired natural instinct and it has proven beneficial, so I will continue to do it at higher levels, as I am anxious and seeking change).

I get that you are at the end of your rope, but then remember that people can't help if they don't have all of the information.

Did you ever remove that day-time sun-blocking cover (as I suggested in your previous posts)?
If not, you really need to. This could be the cause of your main issues, but from the sounds of it, his cage remains partly covered during the day and I am not sure why. Also, if he is getting THAT much sun in his current location, then that could also be part of your issue. Again, remove the "partial" day-time cover and put his cage in a position so that the sun won't fry him (if you haven't already tried it). It may take some time because if it is hormonal, then you have to wait a bit for things to re-adjust. It literally could be THAT simple.
Shadowy spaces (even ones that don't seem that shadowy to us---like a partially covered cage) can trigger hormones and a sexually frustrated bird will often scream. Similarly, while they do need sunlight, if the sun in his location is so bright that you have to cover him to keep him from baking, then it is TOO SUNNY and too much sun is also a hormonal trigger that can lead to screaming.

After you uncover the cage and remove him from the path of extreme sunlight, then make sure that you are allowing him out of the cage and interacting with him when he is not screaming. If he is SUPER destructive any time he is out, you need to bird-proof his area better and/or clip his wings for his own protection. You should work on target training/station training because you should be able to leave for a minute without him flying all over and tearing up the room. If you do clip wings, make sure it is both wings and done by someone who knows how--you want him to still be able to glide to the ground---THIS IS NOT A BAND-AID FOR THE SITUATION and it isn't without controversy... I never would suggest clipping so quickly, but all of the stuff you guys are doing is going to harm him if it continues. If him being destructive is preventing you from LEAVING the room when he screams, then that is a problem (as leaving/ignoring is likely part of the solution---after to rectify the hormonal triggers and rule out anything medical).

Did you ever get a sleep cage and establish a light/dark cycle with 12 hours sleep?
Is his cage in the main room of the house where people spend most of their time?
Do you cuddle your bird or pet it anywhere other than its head/neck?
Do you have any cave-like or shadowy places in the cage? That day-time sun cover is at least one that I know of...
Has this bird been to the vet to rule out illness recently?
How many hours a day do you spend w/ bird and how many hours a day does husband spend with bird?
How many hours a day is the bird out of its cage?

I will try to type more after I know more...I don't want to suggest something without knowing more details, but I have a few ideas that I can share once I know more.

plumsmum2005 · Jun 5, 2019

Hi Been a lot written to you above and would just like to add if you can improve on where her cage is located, my 'too's love to watch the birds in the garden and one will even warn me that the crows are knicking the fat balls. I assume you cover the cage from the sun because you think it is too hot?

When you leave the room call I'm coming back, and then just call her name periodically to reassure her you are still around. The advice given is not a quick fix, you have inadvertently reinforced her sqwarking. Please dump the stobe thing.

You need to reinforce her being quiet so stand by her cage and when she is quiet, reinforce it with good girl and a favoured treat. It will take a little while to get your had around this but when you do you will see all that has been done wrong. Please dont dump her in another room, have you a tree or play stand(s) that she can come join you in different places in the house? The other thing please don't react badly to her trying to communicate with you, parrots have limited options for doing this with us, so some noise is good and healthy and my guess is when she isnt being punished and instead rewarded for good behaviour things will start to change.

noodles123 · Jun 5, 2019

plumsmum2005 said:
Hi Been a lot written to you above and would just like to add if you can improve on where her cage is located, my 'too's love to watch the birds in the garden and one will even warn me that the crows are knicking the fat balls. I assume you cover the cage from the sun because you think it is too hot?

When you leave the room call I'm coming back, and then just call her name periodically to reassure her you are still around. The advice given is not a quick fix, you have inadvertently reinforced her sqwarking. Please dump the stobe thing.

You need to reinforce her being quiet so stand by her cage and when she is quiet, reinforce it with good girl and a favoured treat. It will take a little while to get your had around this but when you do you will see all that has been done wrong. Please dont dump her in another room, have you a tree or play stand(s) that she can come join you in different places in the house? The other thing please don't react badly to her trying to communicate with you, parrots have limited options for doing this with us, so some noise is good and healthy and my guess is when she isnt being punished and instead rewarded for good behaviour things will start to change.

I agree-- the only point that I am unsure of is the whole "calling back" thing. If I leave the room, I will preemptively call to my bird when she is quiet (to let her know I am around and okay) but if she screams, I don't call back. I only answer sounds that I like, so now when I am out of sight, she uses words (instead of screaming) to "flock call". The sounds I wanted to hear instead of screaming were the ones I responded to. Any screaming gets ignored **unless I am certain it is due to fear or pain and those screams are VERY rare around here**

fiddlejen · Jun 5, 2019

Hi I don't know how well this will apply to you, since my bird is an attention-loving 7+month-old Sun Conure, with me as her only human guardian. But along with attempting some target-training (which I've been slacking recently), what I've been doing to help quieten her, is stand right by her cage BUT if she yells I turn my back to her. Without speaking or any other response. Once she's quiet I turn toward her and make soft noises similar to her soft sounds that I like. If she yells I turn away again, but stay right there, back to her. And repeat, etc. Also, in her presence, any time she makes soft sounds I like, I try to always respond.

So far this has worked really well. In fact for a couple weeks I had forgotten to enforce quietness, and she started getting really loud. It only took 2 days for her to return to mostly lower volumes again when I did this again just recently.

And if course, she does always yell if I leave her presence without permission. (Which she rarely grants!) But really their little heads contain a ridiculous amount of intelligence. I tell her what I'm doing, and the things that repeat, she remembers. She never gives Quite enough time to finish the task before she yells, but it's clear she knows what's happening.

Also. Another thought. I know -of course!- that parrot yelling can be aggravating. But ignoring it helps. Birds can read human emotions amazingly well!!! So here is something important to keep in mind: parrot yelling does NOT mean the same thing as human yelling. It is just part of their communication system, because they don't have Handsfree Cellphones for when they fly.

Your bird is just trying to TEXT you!!!

And most of what she is texting at you is important thoughts like: OH I LOVE YOU, Oh YOU ARE MY FAVORITE HUMAN AND YOU'RE MY OTHER FAVORITE HUMAN!!! Oh I CAN'T SEE YOU, WHERE DID YOU GO MY LOVE?? OH YOU CAME BACK MY DARLING, IM SO EXCITED TO SEE YOU!! OH MY FAVORITE PERSON WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO NOW! HELLO HELLO I ADORE IM SO GLAD YOU'RE HERE WITH ME!!! etc etc.

So please don't ever punish her for yelling! Keep these translations in mind. (Plus the other comments above. When you respond to her "TEXTING," she will continue more.) My parrot, anyway, if she's actually mad, is actually Less likely to yell. SO if you keep in mind that parrot yelling does NOT mean parrot-anger, and maybe both just keep some earplugs on a string around your neck, you might Feel less stressed by the noise. And really, if you just don't care about the noise, that will go part way to decreasing her yelling to start with.

But if course this is just my 2-cents. All birdies are different. But I am fully convinced that 90% of birdie-yelling is truly them TEXTING "I LOVE YOU, I AM HERE, WHERE ARE YOU?/IM GLAD YOU'RE HERE!, HELLO MY FRIEND I LOVE YOU!"

kristy_peaches · Jun 8, 2019

noodles123 said:
I responded last time you posted, and you never answered my questions.
The strobe light thing is not good. You need to stop trying to "punish"---this doesn't work with birds and it harms them.The same is true of covering the cage in response to screaming. By using a strobe and covering the cage when your bird misbehaves, you are messing up your birds hormones and light cycles. Light plays a vital role in their immune and hormonal health. Taking light away OR providing it in epilepsy-inducing flashes is harmful. By doing these things, you are also showing your bird that screaming has a direct impact on the things that happen within the environment.

You do not want to show your bird that their screaming results in you doing anything other than potentially ignoring or walking away. If you yell then the bird learns that screaming gets it attention (it makes you do things). If you cover the bird then it learns that screaming produces action (heck- it may enjoy being covered if it is hormonal). If you turn on a strobe when there is screaming, the bird is again shown that screaming causes things to happen. If the bird screams and you direct it to a toy, you are providing attention to the screaming.
It is like a behavior roulette slot-machine (Bird thinks: I am stressed/bored/hormonal/seeking attention--whatever. I scream. Every time I scream, something happens---that is kind of exciting, isn't it?! When I am bored or frustrated, I will scream because screaming causes things to change and it makes people do interesting things--plus screaming is already a hard-wired natural instinct and it has proven beneficial, so I will continue to do it at higher levels, as I am anxious and seeking change).

I get that you are at the end of your rope, but then remember that people can't help if they don't have all of the information.

Did you ever remove that day-time sun-blocking cover (as I suggested in your previous posts)?
If not, you really need to. This could be the cause of your main issues, but from the sounds of it, his cage remains partly covered during the day and I am not sure why. Also, if he is getting THAT much sun in his current location, then that could also be part of your issue. Again, remove the "partial" day-time cover and put his cage in a position so that the sun won't fry him (if you haven't already tried it). It may take some time because if it is hormonal, then you have to wait a bit for things to re-adjust. It literally could be THAT simple.
Shadowy spaces (even ones that don't seem that shadowy to us---like a partially covered cage) can trigger hormones and a sexually frustrated bird will often scream. Similarly, while they do need sunlight, if the sun in his location is so bright that you have to cover him to keep him from baking, then it is TOO SUNNY and too much sun is also a hormonal trigger that can lead to screaming.

After you uncover the cage and remove him from the path of extreme sunlight, then make sure that you are allowing him out of the cage and interacting with him when he is not screaming. If he is SUPER destructive any time he is out, you need to bird-proof his area better and/or clip his wings for his own protection. You should work on target training/station training because you should be able to leave for a minute without him flying all over and tearing up the room. If you do clip wings, make sure it is both wings and done by someone who knows how--you want him to still be able to glide to the ground---THIS IS NOT A BAND-AID FOR THE SITUATION and it isn't without controversy... I never would suggest clipping so quickly, but all of the stuff you guys are doing is going to harm him if it continues. If him being destructive is preventing you from LEAVING the room when he screams, then that is a problem (as leaving/ignoring is likely part of the solution---after to rectify the hormonal triggers and rule out anything medical).

Did you ever get a sleep cage and establish a light/dark cycle with 12 hours sleep?
Is his cage in the main room of the house where people spend most of their time?
Do you cuddle your bird or pet it anywhere other than its head/neck?
Do you have any cave-like or shadowy places in the cage? That day-time sun cover is at least one that I know of...
Has this bird been to the vet to rule out illness recently?
How many hours a day do you spend w/ bird and how many hours a day does husband spend with bird?
How many hours a day is the bird out of its cage?

I will try to type more after I know more...I don't want to suggest something without knowing more details, but I have a few ideas that I can share once I know more.

- We have a sleep cage for her that we keep in our spare room. It’s quiet and cozy.
- We put the cage on the main floor where we normally sit and eat, watch tv etc.
- Peaches gets lots of cuddles every day by me (my husband doesn’t trust her so he just gives her quick pets on the neck). She will normally sit on my pregnant belly now and I’ll pet her head, neck and all down her back and stroke her wings. I don’t really touch her chest much because she rented to get more snappy in that area.
We place Peaches right beside a North-facing window so she doesn’t get direct sunlight. When we cover her when she squawks, it’s when it’s so excessive she doesn’t take a break. We cover the front of the cage so she can’t see us, but she still gets the light from the window.
- I have take Peach to the vet and they were not helpful. They said it could be hormones but it sounds like I’m doing everything I can. They said “ignore her when she squawks” which we do already.
- on a work day I spend about an hour a day with peaches and she spends about 2 hours out of her cage. Lately, I’ve been spending more time at home, so she’s spending more time out of her cage or outside in the nice weather. Hubby will hang out with her outside but she squawks mostly right when he gets home from work. So he is mostly ignoring her on work days. Being Saturday They are currently talking to each other and things are relatively quiet. *fingers crossed*

noodles123 · Jun 8, 2019

kristy_peaches said:
She will normally sit on my pregnant belly now and I’ll pet her head, neck and all down her back and stroke her wings. I don’t really touch her chest much because she rented to get more snappy in that area.
We place Peaches right beside a North-facing window so she doesn’t get direct sunlight. When we cover her when she squawks, it’s when it’s so excessive she doesn’t take a break. We cover the front of the cage so she can’t see us, but she still gets the light from the window.

So, this sounds very hormonal. Stop covering the cage--- period. It creates a cave-like situation (even if it is still light in there). Hormonal birds like to climb under ledges etc (even in full light). You should stop covering when she screams and leave the room instead if you don't want her to see you.

Also, STOP stroking her. This is the other reason I am 99% sure this is hormonal. By stroking your bird and cuddling, you are basically having sex with it. You should never touch your bird anywhere but the head or neck (unless it is necessary for medical reasons). You are sending the wrong message to her and frustrating her/confusing your relationship, while increasing hormonal production.

Stop covering the cage and stop cuddling her and then continue with standard training and sleep cycle etc.

kristy_peaches · Jun 8, 2019

I will do my best! I had no idea you had to pet a certain way. I’ll change that right away.

Thanks for the response.

noodles123 · Jun 8, 2019

kristy_peaches said:
I will do my best! I had no idea you had to pet a certain way. I’ll change that right away.

Thanks for the response.

You should still cover at bedtime though--just uncover her around the same time each morning (as soon as you guys are up). I forgot to say that!
More time out of the cage could help.
I would encourage your husband to try to give her treats etc (so that she associates him with good things as well), because it is likely that your are the "chosen one" as you have been stroking her etc (don't stroke the beak either). You will want to re-frame your currently sexual relationship and your may get some resistance at first. She may not be happy with you when you stop petting her this way, but give it time and again, uncover the cage fully during the day (even though light gets in, that visibly dark side of the cage could be enough to trigger hormones, especially in an already hormonal bird). You will still need to find ways to interact with her, but that may mean bringing a stand perch right next to you while you play etc---it's the inappropriate physicality that needs to decrease, but you will need replacement interaction.
Note:some birds will even get sexual from petting on the head if they are hormonal, so you need to look into hormonal behaviors and start reading the body language to see if she is getting to stimulated. For instance, my bird CANNOT sit on my lap for more than a few minutes without getting sexual but to the average person, her hormonal behavior looks super sweet and innocent (even though it is not). Sexual bird behavior looks very cute and non-sexual 99% of the time if you aren't sure what to look for.
If you are about to have a baby in the house, I would strongly suggest that you work on increasing her independence by ignoring the screaming and praising quiet behavior etc. I would also suggest inviting other people over to socialize her, as you may be dealing with some jealously issues when the new baby comes.
IGNORE undesirable behavior instead of punishing.

Squawking

kristy_peaches

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Inger

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Still Biting Me, I am so sad.

Conure, she smells sour?

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