Looking to build indoor flight cage/aviary for Grey

modrummer · May 17, 2016

Hey everyone, I'm looking to build an indoor aviary for my Congo African Grey. I'm planning to make it 7 feet tall, 8 feet wide, 4 feet deep. I plan to make the frame out of untreated lumber so it won't be toxic for her, however I could use some advice on what to use for the netting/mesh.

I know Galvanized steel mesh isn't recommending because of the zinc content, though I hear I can get GAW (Galvanized after Weld) steel mesh and wash it well with vinegar to possibly negate most of the zinc issues, but if possible I"d rather avoid that all together.

Stainless steel sounds like a great option, except for the price. If someone has a good source for reasonably priced SS I would be interested.

Are there any other options? I was at my local Zoo recently (Kansas City Zoo) and noticed all the bird aviaries have what looks like maybe parachute cord mesh?

Let me know what other options I have.

Thanks

SailBoat · May 17, 2016

Your parrot will quickly cut into Zinc coating regardless of whether it is hot dipped prior or after welding. The stuff will fail at the pressure applied by your parrot's beak! If you use this stuff, have your parrot regularly checked (minimum of twice a year) for heavy metal exposure! The Avian Vet bills and medications will quickly make this low cost option, very expensive!

The cord you are talking about will work. However, the Zoo has a schedule that they adhere to for replacing that cord on a regular bases. Once again, beak cutting pressure will win.

So, where in your home are you planning to build this 'small' enclosure? Easy to get away with, if you live alone.

Note: The parrot will also go after the structural grade pine you will likely use for the frame. Plan on regular replace of the wood structure. Make sure you construct this 'small' enclosure so that it can be easily taken apart for repair, cleaning and/or removal.

At the end of the day, Stainless Steel wire allows the flexibility needed to DIY construct the cage.

Washing with anything is not going to limit the affect of Heavy Metal Exposure!

Another expensive option is Aluminum wire.

LaurieC · May 17, 2016

You might find these resources helpful:

NaturalBird.com Indoor and Outdoor Bird Enclosure FAQ

Natural Bird

EBay is a good source for stainless steel hardware cloth. The seller "hardwaremania" has several different sizes and gauges to offer. I have purchased from him/her in the past and have been happy with the product, and the price is unbeatable. Here is an example:

30" Wide 1" x 1 5" 14g Stainless Welded Wire Mesh Hardware Cloth Sold per Foot | eBay

LaurieC · May 17, 2016

For framing the enclosure you might consider using the anodized aluminum framing from available from Esto Connectore, 80/20 Inc., or EZ-Tube. It's safe, cost effective, goes together easily, and most importantly it will withstand the rigors of both birds and environmental conditions. I have used it for both indoor and outdoor enclosures, and I highly recommend it.

The NaturalBird website used to have a tutorial for building cages with it, but that part of their website seems to be missing right now. Corners Limited uses this tubing to make custom cages; you can look at their website for examples:

Corners Limited - Supplier of Ulimited Caging Solutions

modrummer · May 17, 2016

LaurieC said:
You might find these resources helpful:

NaturalBird.com Indoor and Outdoor Bird Enclosure FAQ

Natural Bird

EBay is a good source for stainless steel hardware cloth. The seller "hardwaremania" has several different sizes and gauges to offer. I have purchased from him/her in the past and have been happy with the product, and the price is unbeatable. Here is an example:

30" Wide 1" x 1 5" 14g Stainless Welded Wire Mesh Hardware Cloth Sold per Foot | eBay

Wow that is an excellent price. I think I can actually afford to use SS Mesh at that price, which is a huge relief. Thank you so much!

modrummer · May 17, 2016

LaurieC said:
For framing the enclosure you might consider using the anodized aluminum framing from available from Esto Connectore, 80/20 Inc., or EZ-Tube. It's safe, cost effective, goes together easily, and most importantly it will withstand the rigors of both birds and environmental conditions. I have used it for both indoor and outdoor enclosures, and I highly recommend it.

The NaturalBird website used to have a tutorial for building cages with it, but that part of their website seems to be missing right now. Corners Limited uses this tubing to make custom cages; you can look at their website for examples:

Corners Limited - Supplier of Ulimited Caging Solutions

I will definitely look more into this, thank you for the info!

modrummer · May 17, 2016

SailBoat said:
Your parrot will quickly cut into Zinc coating regardless of whether it is hot dipped prior or after welding. The stuff will fail at the pressure applied by your parrot's beak! If you use this stuff, have your parrot regularly checked (minimum of twice a year) for heavy metal exposure! The Avian Vet bills and medications will quickly make this low cost option, very expensive!

The cord you are talking about will work. However, the Zoo has a schedule that they adhere to for replacing that cord on a regular bases. Once again, beak cutting pressure will win.

So, where in your home are you planning to build this 'small' enclosure? Easy to get away with, if you live alone.

Note: The parrot will also go after the structural grade pine you will likely use for the frame. Plan on regular replace of the wood structure. Make sure you construct this 'small' enclosure so that it can be easily taken apart for repair, cleaning and/or removal.

At the end of the day, Stainless Steel wire allows the flexibility needed to DIY construct the cage.

Washing with anything is not going to limit the affect of Heavy Metal Exposure!

Another expensive option is Aluminum wire.

Thank you for the information. I'm aware of the dangers of zinc poisoning (which is why I was saying I don't plan to use welded wire and was looking for other suggestions). What were you emphasizing about the "small" enclosure? I've owned birds my whole life and I feel that something that has a floor dimension of 32 square feet and is 7 feet tall is plenty adequate as an enclosure for my Grey during the times of day when I'm not available to keep her company.

Maybe I was misunderstanding you, the internet is funny like that.

SailBoat · May 17, 2016

It wasn't the internet, just my odd play at humor! It's dry to begin with and tails off from there! Lets just say it was a play at those who try to stuff a grey into a shoe box sized cage.

I'd be out in the driveway with all my stuff if I tried to fly building an indoor cage of that size. Happy for you and your Gray on being able to get that much room inside the house.

modrummer · May 17, 2016

SailBoat said:
It wasn't the internet, just my odd play at humor! It's dry to begin with and tails off from there! Lets just say it was a play at those who try to stuff a grey into a shoe box sized cage.

I'd be out in the driveway with all my stuff if I tried to fly building an indoor cage of that size. Happy for you and your Gray on being able to get that much room inside the house.

Oh haha, I follow now. I'm terrible at reading sarcasm. Luckily I married a woman who happens to be a vet-tech and an animal lover. When I introduced her to how awesome birds are, she was hooked and she's been on my case to build a nice indoor aviary for a while now.

So if I do decide to make the frame out of wood, would you recommend pine? I've found a couple lists of safe woods for birds, but they seem to contradict on a few (like Oak). Pine seems to be considered relatively safe, but it's also a very soft wood so I feel like it's going to get chewed up much faster....

SailBoat · May 17, 2016

You can spend a lot of money on Hardwoods and still be faced with replacing them. Our DYH Amazon loves chewing hardwoods! The more expensive the more he likes it!

Select structural grade pine (i.e. standard 2 x somethings). Never use chemically treated lumber.

When you are at the Big Box Store and standing in front of the 'standard interior application' 2 x somethings, try this little trick: For the sake of needing an example, find the 2 x 4 x 8' stack. Now, pick-up several boards and set them aside, you should note that there are minor differences in their weight. For a Structural Application, like yours, choose the heavier ones. If you want to make toys, choose the lightest ones!

So, why buy standard structural, interior application 2 x somethings when your parrot is going to chew them anyways. Its all about costs! Price a 2 x something x length Oak board (by the way, they are special order) and compare it to the price of a standard structure pine 2 x something. Assure that you are sitting when you compare the pricing!

Take a look a the Aluminum bar or tube that was recommended above. Consider thick wall conduit, with all the available bits and pieces available will make it much easier to assemble and if needed, redesign!

By the way, put a great deal time into what you are planning for a floor!

modrummer · May 17, 2016

SailBoat said:
You can spend a lot of money on Hardwoods and still be faced with replacing them. Our DYH Amazon loves chewing hardwoods! The more expensive the more he likes it!

Select structural grade pine (i.e. standard 2 x somethings). Never use chemically treated lumber.

When you are at the Big Box Store and standing in front of the 'standard interior application' 2 x somethings, try this little trick: For the sake of needing an example, find the 2 x 4 x 8' stack. Now, pick-up several boards and set them aside, you should note that there are minor differences in their weight. For a Structural Application, like yours, choose the heavier ones. If you want to make toys, choose the lightest ones!

So, why buy standard structural, interior application 2 x somethings when your parrot is going to chew them anyways. Its all about costs! Price a 2 x something x length Oak board (by the way, they are special order) and compare it to the price of a standard structure pine 2 x something. Assure that you are sitting when you compare the pricing!

Take a look a the Aluminum bar or tube that was recommended above. Consider thick wall conduit, with all the available bits and pieces available will make it much easier to assemble and if needed, redesign!

By the way, put a great deal time into what you are planning for a floor!

Great advice! And I definitely plan to do some calculating tonight on price and ease of use. I'll take a look at the tubing as well.

The floor was actually my next question! I was considering just making it out of 2x6 boards, but I'm open to suggestions. I haven't put much thought into it yet. Presumably Plywood is not a safe wood, it would be far too easy to just buy a big sheet of plywood for the floor.

LaurieC · May 17, 2016

If you decide to go with wood for your framing, I would go with Maple. It's bird safe, and much harder than oak. Woodworking is one of my hobbies, and maple is one of my preferred woods for building animal enclosures. Pine is far too soft to use with parrots.

Do some bargain shopping in the "materials" section of Craigslist. You can usually find mills and other folks selling hardwoods at bargain prices. In my area I can usually find maple for $2-$4 a board foot. That's a steal compared to the $8 a bf that the retail hardwood stores charge.

I would also price out the Quick Frame aluminum extrusions from 80/20 Inc. You might find that it doesn't cost much more to use the aluminum, especially when you factor in the labor of building with wood.

LaurieC · May 17, 2016

modrummer said:
Great advice! And I definitely plan to do some calculating tonight on price and ease of use. I'll take a look at the tubing as well.

The floor was actually my next question! I was considering just making it out of 2x6 boards, but I'm open to suggestions. I haven't put much thought into it yet. Presumably Plywood is not a safe wood, it would be far too easy to just buy a big sheet of plywood for the floor.

Some good options for the floor would be tile (floating 'click' tile so you don't have to deal with mortar), or a plastic such as plexiglass, acrylic, ABS, etc. You could use plywood if you applied an epoxy coating to it, such as the type that is used for garage floors.

modrummer · May 17, 2016

LaurieC said:
If you decide to go with wood for your framing, I would go with Maple. It's bird safe, and much harder than oak. Woodworking is one of my hobbies, and maple is one of my preferred woods for building animal enclosures. Pine is far too soft to use with parrots.

Do some bargain shopping in the "materials" section of Craigslist. You can usually find mills and other folks selling hardwoods at bargain prices. In my area I can usually find maple for $2-$4 a board foot. That's a steal compared to the $8 a bf that the retail hardwood stores charge.

I would also price out the Quick Frame aluminum extrusions from 80/20 Inc. You might find that it doesn't cost much more to use the aluminum, especially when you factor in the labor of building with wood.

I like the idea of the quick frame, but I'm having trouble picturing how I would secure the SS wire mesh to the aluminum? With the wood, I could use some SS staples to secure it, with the aluminum I guess I could use ALOT of bolts and washers and drill them into the frame?

Have you every heard of or do you have a picture of any aviaries using one of these Quick Frame things?

Also, it appears that all the corner connectors are made of plastic, would this be harmful if chewed?

modrummer · May 18, 2016

So after pricing out building materials I've had a couple ideas:

1. Use a softwood (Pine) because it's cheap and safe, but affix the SS mesh to the INSIDE of the frame, making it much harder for the bird to chew. I would use either SS staples (depending how well they held in the wood) or some SS screws and washers to hold the mesh to the wood.

2. Use PVC (probably 1 1/2" )for the frame (I've made a few birdstands out of PVC). Much easier to work with and dirt cheap. Most likely attach the mesh to the PVC frame using SS hose clamps (I get the feeling my Congo would eventually break even heavy duty zip ties).

Thoughts?

jdlehman76 · May 19, 2016

How much does your parrot chew? I have a CAG that I could build a wood cage and she would not chew on it. She seems to only chew on cardboard, phone books, and softer toys. If you have a soft chewer like mine you might not have to replace the wood all that often. You might also be able to wait and see where your bird chews and just put a wood cap over that section that is faster and cheaper to replace then the actual cage support. Some pine 1x3's attached to the inside would be easier and cheaper then replacing your 2x4 main supports. It would also cover the edges of the strips of metal hardware cloth.

modrummer · May 19, 2016

jdlehman76 said:
How much does your parrot chew? I have a CAG that I could build a wood cage and she would not chew on it. She seems to only chew on cardboard, phone books, and softer toys. If you have a soft chewer like mine you might not have to replace the wood all that often. You might also be able to wait and see where your bird chews and just put a wood cap over that section that is faster and cheaper to replace then the actual cage support. Some pine 1x3's attached to the inside would be easier and cheaper then replacing your 2x4 main supports. It would also cover the edges of the strips of metal hardware cloth.

That's actually an awesome idea. I was wanting some way to cover how the mesh attaches to the frame so she wouldn't be trying to pull out the screws or staples.

To be honest, I'm not sure how much of a chewer she will be on the frame. Her main perches and swings and even some of her wood toys are completely in tact, yet one of her wooden ladders and a different wood toy are DESTROYED.

Also, I went to Lowes last night to look for untreated pine (or another acceptable untreated wood) and all the pine they had was pressure treated

Guess I'll check out a local lumber yard this weekend.

modrummer · May 19, 2016

Also, I discovered that two of the gigantic trees in my yard are Maple trees! I'm very excited because I really wanted her new aviary to have one of those big parrot trees but I knew I couldn't afford one. So I'm just going to cut off a couple branches from the Maple (which I've read is safe for birds as long as I strip the bark) and strip and clean them really good and make her a real wood tree.

LaurieC · May 19, 2016

modrummer said:
I like the idea of the quick frame, but I'm having trouble picturing how I would secure the SS wire mesh to the aluminum? With the wood, I could use some SS staples to secure it, with the aluminum I guess I could use ALOT of bolts and washers and drill them into the frame?

Have you every heard of or do you have a picture of any aviaries using one of these Quick Frame things?

Also, it appears that all the corner connectors are made of plastic, would this be harmful if chewed?

The Naturalbird website used to have a photo gallery of flight cages made with the Quick Frame, as well as a building tutorial, but it doesn't seem to be there anymore. I've attached a couple of pictures that show examples of it's use with birds that show you how it's put together.

As you can see, the wire can be attached with screws and washers. Personally, I like to use the tubing profile that has a flange, and attach my wire panels to that with screws. It makes for a cleaner look and keeps the cut edges of the wire tucked against the tubing. I would use screws to attach the wire even if I were making the frame out of wood, because it will be alot easier to remove in the event that part of the framing needs to be replaced due to chewing.

You might also take a look at this custom cage company:

Animal Enclosures, Animal Cages, Pet cages, Cat Cages, Dog Cages: Ultra Lite Products

They make caging using vinyl tubing, and they sell the components for DIY-ers. Look under "Modular Components" and you will find clips and screws for attaching the wire to tubing. I'm looking at using these for an outdoor cage that I'm planning to build.

modrummer · May 19, 2016

LaurieC said:
modrummer said:

I like the idea of the quick frame, but I'm having trouble picturing how I would secure the SS wire mesh to the aluminum? With the wood, I could use some SS staples to secure it, with the aluminum I guess I could use ALOT of bolts and washers and drill them into the frame?

Have you every heard of or do you have a picture of any aviaries using one of these Quick Frame things?

Also, it appears that all the corner connectors are made of plastic, would this be harmful if chewed?

Click to expand...

The Naturalbird website used to have a photo gallery of flight cages made with the Quick Frame, as well as a building tutorial, but it doesn't seem to be there anymore. I've attached a couple of pictures that show examples of it's use with birds that show you how it's put together.

As you can see, the wire can be attached with screws and washers. Personally, I like to use the tubing profile that has a flange, and attach my wire panels to that with screws. It makes for a cleaner look and keeps the cut edges of the wire tucked against the tubing. I would use screws to attach the wire even if I were making the frame out of wood, because it will be alot easier to remove in the event that part of the framing needs to be replaced due to chewing.

You might also take a look at this custom cage company:

Animal Enclosures, Animal Cages, Pet cages, Cat Cages, Dog Cages: Ultra Lite Products

They make caging using vinyl tubing, and they sell the components for DIY-ers. Look under "Modular Components" and you will find clips and screws for attaching the wire to tubing. I'm looking at using these for an outdoor cage that I'm planning to build.

So have you built a cage using some of that quickframe before? If so, how would I build a door? I found only one hinge listed on their website and it doesn't appear to be for the quickframe system, but maybe I'm just missing it.

Also, I'm assuming that anodized aluminum is bird-safe?

Looking to build indoor flight cage/aviary for Grey

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