Question for those that DON'T clip (and everyone else can chime in too :)

Kiwi is 14 months old (he was clipped when I got him at 7 months) and he has a few full grown wing feathers that grew back and it's time to make that decision.

I've read varying posts on "to clip or not" and I know it's a personal decision and there are pros and cons to each. Problem is I agree with both sides :/

I'm looking for advice, especially from those who have birds that are NOT clipped.

I have a very small house, it's only one story high (fairly low ceilings). I don't think I'd ever be able to get him in a flight harness to take him outside either. So - is there any point really in letting him be flighted?

Can birds still fly around in rooms 1-story houses?

The only reason I'm considering not clipping is that maybe it will give him more confidence (he seems a bit more confident these days). I want him to be able to play/swing on his toys without fear of falling.

Would this be a reason to leave him flighted? Or is a long clip (or whatever it's called where they can still glide down well) going to still help him if he gets spooked or falls off a toy?

I feel bad taking away his flying ability by clipping but I'm not sure how much use he'd get out of his wings anyway in a small house. I'd also have to see if he gets out of control. I'd just feel bad clipping him later after he's had the ability to fly and now knows what he's lost...

Thanks

I dont have a very big house either and I live with my 4 siblings and parents so the rooms my birds can go in are limited for sure you can definitely keep him flighted ina 1 story house. All my birds are free flighted except one my Lorikeet who is still clipped from when i got him and he wont be clipped again when they grow out. It is a personal choice and different living situations can have a big factor in it but I believe flying is essential to birds health and mentality. Flying is a natural thing for birds and they really enjoy it! It strengthens them and uses muscles that dont get used enough when a bird is clipped and it sharpens the birds mind and makes him think more. It does help with confidence a lot once they are comfortable with using their wings also big birds CAN fly when clipped as they are much stronger than small birds so I wouldnt take him out withought a harness or cage anyways!! You can probably train him to a harness different birds take different amounts of time I put my cockatoos harness on in one day my Blu Crown Conure took 2 weeks before i could get it on and a month has passed of harness training my lorikeet and he still thinks its a toy just give it time and im sure you could put a harness on him. And im sure he would get use of flying in your house even if its just a little its better than nothing! Try recall training with him its so much fun for the bird and you

It may give him more confidence, and even just flying around a house is beneficial and lots of exercise. Once they get flying down birds are very agile, when Rosie is spooked she'll fly circles around my room which isn't huge(but not super small either), avoiding two large cages, a cieling fan(OFF when birdies are out), a hanging lantern lamp, and a hutch.

The thing I'd be worried about is doors. In a smaller home, especially a one story house, doors are close up and one mistake could allow him to accidentally fly out. Rosie and Kenji are kept upstairs in my room, with a heavy duty locking screen over the window well away from any doors that may be opened to the outside world.

I'm also in a 1 story home, with slanted ceilings. Ceilings are 8' and higher.


I would consider allowing him to be flighted for *at least* 3 months. It will take some getting used to and some additional training, but doing for 1 month may not be long enough to fully see how he is behavior wise and whether or not you can handle it.


I agree on the recall training! I'm currently waiting for my new conure to be able to fly. She seriously needs the confidence boost!

I couldn't possibly clip my birds! Not for anything! It would be like amputating a limb (and in a way, that's exactly what it is). My house is a tiny miner's cottage - about as big as an apartment with two bedrooms. Four humans, a dog, three cats and three birds live in it quite comfortably. OK, maybe the humans are a bit squeezed for space but you know what I mean. The Beaks are allowed in two rooms: the kitchen and the bathroom. They fly between the two and have designated perches where they're allowed to sit. There are also places where they're not allowed to go and they're pretty good, now, at staying away from those. They *need* to fly! I can tell this by the way they hold onto the cage and flap, screeching at me 'Hello! Hello! HELLO!!!' by way of 'Let us out, we wanna fly!'

Nothing could bring me to disable my Beaks and rob them of their essential birdness. In fact, my disabled Dominic is only just beginning to fly again after twenty-odd years of being cooped up in a tiny cage. The way I see it, his rehabilitation will be complete when he's flying and calling like a normal Galah. If I can tame and socialise my birds well, there's absolutely no reason to remove their wings. Yes, it may be easier to catch them, but it will also be easier for cats or dogs or hawks to do the same. And why would I want to 'catch' my birds? I'd prefer that they came to me willingly! The whole pleasure of befriending a bird is that it could fly away but chooses not to. I know lots of people clip their birds for lots of reasons and that's not my business. I only share what I think about my own birds 'cause you asked.

I've got 2 birds and 2 different stories.

We have a 2 story house, but really only use 1 level.

We've had our Fids almost a year now and they both came freshly clipped. We have allowed their flight to grow out.

Our Amazon - He is so much happier flying, he flies back and forth from my kitchen to living room countless times a day. He is confident and in shape and he is 35, no perch potato here. He follows me around and doesn't feel the need to scream, is fearless almost.

Our Brown Head - Well he is a scaredy cat and even with his flight feathers grown in does not fly. I don't think he ever learned. Letting his wings grow in has given him confidence though and when he does occasionally panic and jump off his cage he has a little control. At first he would run into everything.

There are considerations to take in for flighted birds, escaping is an issue.
We have to either block off the kitchen or cage the amazon when we cook.
Having a bird land on your shoulder constantly is something you get used to LOL

So to answer your question directly, yes even in a small house flying between a few rooms can give them exercise and confidence.
I would rather cage my amazon on short occasions where appropriate then take his flight away, you can train them about windows and be cautious about escape routes and cooking.

I typically let my birds be flighted. Once I let them learn how to fly they rarely bump into things. I find that the first month or so they sometimes do bump into things, but I just make sure they're ok and let them get back up and try again.

I don't think the area is too small, just be sure to always have your doors and windows closed.

The vet told me that the only way for a bird to use all their air sacs was during flight. She said this helped to reduce incidence of respiratory infections.
I think that is another great reason to flight your bird.

I live in a small apartment and my alexandrine is flighted. He can navigate pretty well, to the point of flying to me in complete darkness through two doorways.

You should know that when your bird first tries to fly for the first time, it's going to crash a lot. I'm hoping your bird was fledged at least, cause if it wasn't then learning to fly is going to take awhile. If your bird flies into things, let it learn in a small room first, then let it fly in a bigger room once it gets the idea of not going so fast (or at least to turn away from walls).

All good reasons above and I agree with allowing companion birds to be flighted for their physical well being. I just wish Chico was not such a potato. All his flights have been at my request. Harnesses are a must have.

Thanks for all the replies so far.

In general are they still somewhat calm (hang out on a perch somewhere mostly) or do they go bat crazy? (i.e - if you have a plate of food do they think they can just jump on you or your plate)

Unlike my dog who I can say "no" to and he listens, I'm unsure how I'd control Kiwi if he could fly and I'm trying to get him back in his cage or away from something he shouldn't be on or near.


How much birdproofing do you do in your room(s). Do you need to protect all your wires/cables?

What about things like the tops of doors, I'd be afraid he is resting up there and no one notices and closes a door while he's sitting on the top of it.


I know he'd have to be caged when something is cooking on the stove, and I know we'd need to make sure toilet covers are down, etc.

What kind of other things are you always mindful of (other than the obvious of making sure no doors/windows are open)


Thanks

Both our hand-raised exclectuses were clipped when quite young- we found that they tried to fly and crashed into stuff, and landed on things they shouldn't. Unfortunately the first guy died before his flight feathers could regrow, but the second regrew his flight feathers within a year and hasn't been clipped since. We clip our corella lightly because otherwise he chases our whiteface cockatiel endlessly (and still tries to jump on it when it's on the floor). Our lorikeet was clipped by the petshop- heavily, on one side, and every time he tried to fly he'd land heavilly on the ground, so once the flight feathers regrew he was allowed to fly. Ceratinly, when we do trim, it's equal trim on both wings so they can at least parachute to the ground without the ridiculous and unsafe unbalanced flight petshops impose.

You may find this Youtube channel of interest.... take a look through the videos!

flychomperfly's channel - YouTube


As far as behavior, well, we can't say how he will act. Just as you can train your dog, you can also train your bird... although it may take more work, it's not impossible to do.

It is hard to say how yours will be. For our amazon I make sure that where he flies to is clear of dangers, no electrical cords, nothing he shouldn't chew etc.He doesn't sit on doorways but he just wants to ne with me, not hang out anywhere else. I don't leave him unsupervised, I go get him or be with him if he flies in the other room.
He has tried to fly to our dinner plates, but he shares dinner with us so I just correct him. If we are both in the kitchen and I open the fridge he will fly to my shoulder.

The top of the doorway thing has happened to me a couple of times. Luckily I always close doors slowly so there was no injury. Part of owning a bird is having to know where it is at all times. My bird has free range of the place, BUT that's because he's not a mischief maker. Anytime he goes to an area he's not supposed to, like the blinds, I just quickly move him from there. Eventually he gets the idea.

My GCC is flighted and we're letting Sunny's flight feathers grow in (he came to us as a clipped baby). Sunny is beginning to get a little lift now when he tries to fly.

I'll suddenly hear "whoosh whoosh whoosh" and there's my cheeky girl on my head. I have to cover any diet drinks or food that we have out because she will help herself. Trixie will fly to Sunny to try and bite him. She's flown to his cage to bite his toes. Also, she hates my husband. Trixie will land on his arm and bite him to draw blood.

As rotten as Trix can be, she loves me and the kids. No fly attacks on us. You can almost see joy on her little face and a sort of parrot smile when she flies. Getting her back in the cage is sometimes a problem, but we're working on it. Our home is one story and these guys are always supervised when out.

MonicaMc - thanks for the youtube link btw!

I'm watching this one: [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmaqOeheQBA]Baby Parrot Training SKILLS plus In-home Freeflight Flying RECALL - YouTube[/ame]

Gosh I wish I had him that young and could start him off with such good habits as in that video.


If you or anyone else knows of any other good resources for training flighted birds please let me know.


Thanks

The main thing I've found with training the Beaks is that it's exactly like training toddlers. Exactly! You have to be prepared to get up and remove them from bad behaviours/places/situations EVERY time. It can be wearing, but you really do reap the benefits in a bird that stays where it should and doesn't get into trouble. FWIW, I don't thing there's any such thing as a birdproofed room or house. Birds can and will get into trouble in a padded cell, I reckon! My biggest fear is electrical cables, which can be hard to hide or make inaccessible. Still, vigilance is a small price to pay for my flighted birds, who whoosh past my head joyfully every day. I love that!

natv, they've also trained adult parrots! So keep checking out the videos!

Here's an older thread where I put some links to flying.

http://www.parrotforums.com/behavioral/34547-help-how-undo-screaming-2.html#post293232


Here's some additional links.

Clipping your birds wings, wing clipping your parrot, free flight parrots, African Grey, Congo African Grey, Yellow Sided Green Cheek, abundance weaning, flying your parrot
http://parrots.dimholt.com/documents/articles/wing_clipping_article_greg_glendell.pdf
Flying

When Georgie was young and still relatively untrained, she was "bat crazy" when she could fly. But as she aged and matured and was trained, she was pretty good and trustworthy.
Gilbert is good most of the time. At meal time he will fly right to his eating perch and will stay there and eat as long as i have food in the bowl. IF i'm 'bad' and take too long preparing food and have him on the eating perch, he will fly to the kitchen counter and run around and look for something yummy. Occasionally if i am busy and ignoring him too much (usually if i'm on the laptop and trying to write an email or something) he will fly over and land on it. Nothing major though. I like having a flighted bird, except for the rare occasion that i put the ceiling fan on downstairs. (I may just replace that fixture and get a different type of safe fan because i cage him when it is on.)