Licking inside beak

katie_fleming · May 8, 2015

Hey guys!

Jasper has been licking inside his beak over and over for a bit. Noticed it over the past couple of days. Not constant or anything, but enough that I've noticed.

I've uploaded a video here: www.katiefleming.ca/jasper/jasper_lick_beak.mp4

Does this look normal?

labell · May 8, 2015

No it does not look normal at all, it also appears kind of slimy in his mouth...had he just eaten something before this video? His feather look rough as well. Did he have blood work or a vet visit yet? I am somewhat concerned by the inside of his mouth being slimy looking as well as feather condition and that his beak still has so much black in it. How old is he now?

Added..I do understand that the feather condition could be regular moulting but the other two things are a concern. I have never seen a male with that much dark still left on his beak at over a year old unless it was very sick.

katie_fleming · May 8, 2015

Yes, he had some treats. He just turned 1 the other week ago. I've seen pictures of Eclectuses who have black on their beaks when they're older. Actually from Christmas to now it's insane how much black has disappeared.

He's still moulting but not as heavily. Just one feather every couple of days now. They're all currently re-growing.

labell · May 8, 2015

That sticky looking stuff in his mouth I should have mentioned if he hadn't just eaten something and that is in fact just in his beak then it is probably Thrush, which is a yeast infection, can be fatal if left untreated.

labell · May 8, 2015

I don't think I could count all the eclectus I have fed and dealt with over the last 25 yrs so I do feel I know a little about them. I am not trying to alarm you but with this and other issues you have had with him I would strongly advise a full vet visit.

Allee · May 8, 2015

I agree with Laura/labell, please take the excellent advice you've been given and take Jasper for a thorough exam. I hope it isn't anything serious, but it's better to know for sure. Birds are masters at disguising their illnesses, by the time they show symptoms they can be very ill.

Best of luck, please keep us updated.

ShaunaR · May 8, 2015

I am certainly no expert but I noticed the slimy mouth as well. Our Caique wiggles her tongue alot but doesn't open her mouth like your bird. It looks to me almost like he is wretching or trying to spit. I agree with the other posts that a vet visit is most certainly indicated. Please let us know how it works out.
Shauna

Anansi · May 9, 2015

When birds do get sick, things can cascade very quickly. Between this, the toe-tapping and the wing-flipping, I really do think you should take Jasper in to an avian vet for some tests.

Hawk · May 9, 2015

katie_fleming said:
Yes, he had some treats. He just turned 1 the other week ago. I've seen pictures of Eclectuses who have black on their beaks when they're older. Actually from Christmas to now it's insane how much black has disappeared.

He's still moulting but not as heavily. Just one feather every couple of days now. They're all currently re-growing.

That's a bit unusual especially the flem/ sticky in it's mouth, you mentioned it had treats, can you be specific?

Reason I ask is I have seen parrots get things stuck up inside their beak, even heavily sticky treats, (mango, approcots dried type) get stuck inside their beaks because many parrots add water to their dried fruit which makes them very sticky and can stick to their mouth.

Infection is another thing I would look at if there isn't anything logged in upper beak, even lower beak. Things caught in lower beak are more difficult to get out. I know this first hand as My Grey gotten a toy piece of wood wedged sideways under it's tongue in lower beak and was trying hard with it's tongue to free it. Had to use very narrow pliers to free it. Very scary encounter. But all is good. Another issue is irritation on the tongue or even infection from a cut. ( Yes that happens) and they lick their tongue inside their beak when their tongue hurts or worst case scenario, infection of the tongue.
No matter what, a vet visit is much needed to rule it all out.

katie_fleming · May 9, 2015

As soon as the vet clinic opens I'm calling to see if I can get an appointment today. Hoping it's nothing but I'm also going to ask for a CBC/general checkup at the same time. (And then I can also get them to show me how to clip those two flight feathers)

Hope the little guy is ok!

katie_fleming · May 9, 2015

Hey guys,

So I took Jasper to the vet and after 3 hours and $600 later (good luck to me paying my rent next month) we have some results.

So they did xrays to check all of his organs, they say everything looks fine. They said there's a "line" they're a little unsure of but they think it's related to his testicle. They're going to get a second opinion.

His CBC is all good.

Other blood tests I'll find out next week, they don't analyze them there.

They took cultures of his choana, cloaca, etc I can't remember what else.

He has a crop infection. He has to go on antibiotics for 2 weeks, and have apple cider vinegar added to his water daily to prevent a yeast infection (anyone else ever hear of this?)

The poor guy. I've never seen him so scared or miserable. I wasn't allowed in the room when they were doing tests but I was heartbroken to see him when they brought him out. His feathers also looked really bad, I hope they were gentle. I'm guessing from the toweling.

So on the paper this is what he got today: external physical exam, cultures (above), radiology (2 x-rays of bird), hematology (PCV, TP, Differential, WBC), serum biochemistries (AST, SU.Uric acid), and I refused the Psittacosis test.

I have to do a follow-up appointment in two weeks ($45) + whatever tests they want to do then.

Allee · May 9, 2015

Thank you for the update! I'm so relieved to hear you got Jasper to the vet today. Sorry about the high cost of vet care, but Jasper's health is well worth it.

Hugs to both of you, I hope the other tests come back negative and Jasper is on the way to a full recovery.

katie_fleming · May 9, 2015

Thank you, I appreciate your help and following what's going on. I hope the other tests all come back normal as well.

The vet didn't seem to be very knowledgeable about Eclectus' and said she would read up more. (She asked me what sex he was and I had to laugh for a second...)

Felt like she was trying to push pellets a bit and I told her Eclectus' don't do well on pelleted diets and Jasper had bad toe tapping from the Harrison's ones. Anyway after the rest of the results come in she said we'll talk more about his diet. She noticed the tips of his feathers have a lot of black which she said could be a sign of vitamin A or vitamin D deficiency.

They gave him Nutri Berries (?) while I was there and of course he loved them. Not sure what's in them but I think they want me to buy them.

ShaunaR · May 9, 2015

So glad to hear your update but sorry about the damage to your bank account too! We feed Nutriberries as a treat and our bird just loves them. They are a combination of seeds and pellets and smell great which is more than I can say for most pellets. We have recently switched from a base diet of home made mash and Tropimix because our bird was selectively eating just the dried fruit and seeds in the Tropimix. Now we feed a variety of Harrison's pellets and fresh food only. I was disappointed to hear our AV does not recommend mash because everything I have read here suggests differently. She said lots of mushy warm food encourages "mating" attachment at sexual maturity and encourages behavior issues(ie: food bowl/cage aggression) related to bonding with one flock member only. In the end it's only advice based on the opinion of one person and we all must do what we feel is best for our babies. I hope your bird makes a speedy recovery...sending healing vibes your way!
Shauna

Hawk · May 9, 2015

katie_fleming said:
Hey guys,

So I took Jasper to the vet and after 3 hours and $600 later (good luck to me paying my rent next month) we have some results.

So they did xrays to check all of his organs, they say everything looks fine. They said there's a "line" they're a little unsure of but they think it's related to his testicle. They're going to get a second opinion.

His CBC is all good.

Other blood tests I'll find out next week, they don't analyze them there.

They took cultures of his choana, cloaca, etc I can't remember what else.

He has a crop infection. He has to go on antibiotics for 2 weeks, and have apple cider vinegar added to his water daily to prevent a yeast infection (anyone else ever hear of this?)

The poor guy. I've never seen him so scared or miserable. I wasn't allowed in the room when they were doing tests but I was heartbroken to see him when they brought him out. His feathers also looked really bad, I hope they were gentle. I'm guessing from the toweling.

So on the paper this is what he got today: external physical exam, cultures (above), radiology (2 x-rays of bird), hematology (PCV, TP, Differential, WBC), serum biochemistries (AST, SU.Uric acid), and I refused the Psittacosis test.

I have to do a follow-up appointment in two weeks ($45) + whatever tests they want to do then.

Hi Kate,
Apple cider vinegar is an excellent choice for crop infections. It's highly recommended for chickens that have crop problems and heat exhaustion.
Parrots do equally well with it.
My wife is a former vet, says it' s an excellent choice.

Anansi · May 9, 2015

Katie, I'm glad you at least know the cause of Jasper's beak issue. And I'm hoping for the best with the results from the other tests. Hopefully you'll finally get an answer to the toe-tapping/wing-flipping issue as well.

Thank you for keeping us updated on what's going on. I think quite a few of us are feeling rather attached to Mr. Jasper by now.

Allee · May 9, 2015

I agree with Anansi/Stephen, Jasper has made lots of friends and we all want to see him recover and thrive.

katie_fleming · May 10, 2015

I really appreciate everyone's comments, thank you. I hope he recovers quickly as well. I'll go find the apple cider vinegar today and get that in his water.

I am having a little trouble giving him the medication. He'll open his beak and let me put a drop in no problem, but then he shakes his head and I end up wearing it. Not sure how much he's actually ingesting. I put a drop on an almond slice and he ate that right up so maybe that's the best way to do it for now?

I guess the other option is toweling him and holding his head so he can't shake it but a) I don't really feel comfortable grabbing around his neck because I'm not 100% sure where to do it (the vet tech was going to show me but Jasper was just way too upset and wouldn't go near us, and b) I want to make this the least stressful for him since he's getting it twice a day for two weeks.

Any suggestions would be appreciated!

labell · May 10, 2015

You can try hiding it in a teaspoon or less of organic baby food or in something warm that he likes, not too warm you don't want the heat to destroy anything in the medicine. Do you know if he was fed with a syringe or spoon?

Anansi · May 10, 2015

First thing I'd suggest is to try giving him some time. Working initially with Bixby, sometimes if I waited up to around 10 minutes with the dropper poised by his beak he'd eventually open up for me. Whenever he did, I made a big deal about it, cheering him on enthusiastically. Once he got more used to it, he started opening up pretty much immediately.

If, however, he refuses to open up, you just might have to force him. This never stops being unpleasant, but it at least becomes somewhat less so once you become more adept at it.

The key is to secure the sides of the head and the base of the neck rather than just the neck itself. If you're cupping the head from behind, your index finger and thumb should be in a position to help you leverage the beak.

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