Afraid to fly or lazy?

When we adopted our Hahn's macaw, he was 6 months old and had his flight feathers trimmed. I doubt he had any opportunities to fly before that. Well, my husband and I decided to let his flight feathers grow in fully. It seemed to take forever, and he certainly didn't test any partials out. He has been perfectly content to hop and jump, walk/run and of course, climb. He's about 1.5 years old now and all of his flight feathers are fully operational, and yet he almost never flies. There is certainly nothing wrong with his eyesight or hearing or his wings. He's very healthy. I wonder if he's just afraid, lazy, or doesn't realize his full capability.

There have been a couple of occasions when he took short flights, but they were either out of some desperation or extreme curiosity. They were well controlled in steering and landing. But we are encouraging him to fly more, particularly for exercise, but he prefers "limo service" or climbing/hopping.

Has anyone dealt with this situation? Any advice? We are trying to lure him to us with goodies, fun stuff, and affection. Our bed is only 5 feet from his cage and play gym, so we're not expecting any red-eye flights.

Where do you expect him to fly? Around the house? Too limited a space, I expect. I had an Amazon years ago that never flew unless frightened. Birdie, on the other hand, flies all over the house and an 8’ x 36’ screened porch, but she is way smaller than your bird.

How long has he been flighted? He might not realize he can fly yet. It took my gcc 6 months of being flighted before he realized he could fly and another year to be comfortable flying and fly on a regular basis

If he can achieve the same goals by walking or being carried, then why would he fly in such a limited space? He probably COULD, but he has no reason to take that risk if you think about what he is used to etc.

Japie has been at it for 3 years now (after being mostly caged for 10+, maby 20 years) and he went from the cartoonstyle fly-run into a door and *squeeeeeeeeeeee* downwards to actually landing on his feet and getting better at quick in-the-air turns.
I just let him go at it at his own pace, he loves hop-flying around now and once in a blue moon agrees to do some recall flying.

Still he flies nowhere nearly as well as Appie - who almost never flies, she loves climbing and walking places, but is pure dragonfly when she is at it!

The amazonsticky has (page 4 if I remember correctly / there is an index at the beginning http://www.parrotforums.com/amazons/65119-i-love-amazons-going-journey.html ) some really usefull tips how to give a non-flying bird the courage and training to go about flying (and landing) safely.

My guy has really only been 100% fully flighted for almost a month. Maybe I do need more patience. He is not a big macaw at all. Hahn's macaws are only a little bigger than cockatiels, though a bit stockier.

I still think he should eventually fly from his area to the nearby bed. He could climb down and then up, but a mini flight would save him a lot of time.

So far, the few mini flights he's made were successful (no crashes). That reduces some of my worry

help him to fly, little by little, ideally with treats and eventually on calling him. Little steps to start and get the flights longer as his strength and confidence grows. Reward him and ensure you dont over do things so he fails, positive things should happen so he enjoys flying and wants to go further.

This is why it is generally not recommended to clip birds until after they are already proficient flyers (not that you did anything wrong if he came that way). Much like with human children, there is a narrow timeframe for which young parrots hit key developmental milestones easily, after which learning new things becomes very difficult or potentially impossible. Since your bird is still so young, there is a very good chance he can learn to fly with some time and patience! But he is already past his natural age to fledge, so it will not necessarily just 'come' to him, it will be more of a learned behavior.

I might suggest starting with flapping exercises to build his flight muscles. Flighted birds weigh more than clipped birds because they have significantly more muscle mass to support flight. Start by holding your bird on your hand with your thumb gently over his toes. Pull your hand straight down in a swift, smooth motion. The sensation of falling will cause him to instinctually open and flap his wings. You can tie in a word or sound before doing this so he learns when it's coming and associated that cue in the future with opening and flapping his wings. Once he's become fairly comfortable with that, try pulling him forward while walking, simulating flight. This will help build key muscles. Eventually, you'll want to not hold his toes. If he's flighted he'll start to feel the sensation of lift and likely at some point let go of your hand on his own

CtheBird, I have a black-capped conure with a similar history so it may not be entirely because of your Hahn's size. I always assumed it was because she lacks the muscle and stamina for flight and is content with short flights when absolutely necessary.

Hahns macaws are basically sun conure sized.


Have you tried target training with your macaw or doing a modified step up to encourage him to learn how to fly on his own?

We still have Chris around on this forum, and he made some very usefull (and comforting) 'see for yourself' vids: [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3ahhijXxbM&feature=youtu.be"]From clicker training (without the clicker!) to target training: the run up to flighted recall - YouTube[/ame]

Thanks, everyone, for the advice and feedback. I will keep these things in mind, including the video suggestions. Funny, my guy's favorite treat is pistachios, too, though he adores shelling them, but that would take too much time for target training. I could try crushing them like the guy in the video did.

When Amy picked me to go home with,nearly thirty years ago,he was four months old. He was also clipped,by the "breeder".
I was kinda dumb and clueless about birdies then,and because Amy was going to be my "co- driver" in my Big Rig,I kept him clipped because I would take him for rides all the time in the car,go places,to get him accustomed to people and noise. He went a few times on "day trips" in my Rig and enjoyed it,but I soon discovered the inside of my truck would be a mess from water and bird food strewn all over and there really wasn't enough room in the sleeper for any type of cage.


Over time,I still had Amys' sleeves shortened in the summer coz he still went outside...in the car...as he likes to say and winter time I let his sleeves get long again.
Well...he never fledged and learned to fly! I always thought it was a natural instinct,but obviously it isn't.
After joining this fabulous forum a few years ago,seeing other parront's video's and watching YT I wanted Amy to learn,plus for health reasons. His last wellness check didn't go too well. He was wayyyy over weight,and his chest muscles aren't developed like they should be,plus the doc discovered he has a heart problem that is under control with medication.

Amy has put more miles on his FEET than any birdie I know! He does NOT want to fly..he'd rather walk,or hitch a ride on Dads shoulder
I've been giving him flapflapflap lessons every other night. He perches on his perch stick and I say to him "Amy? are you ready to go flapflap?" and I do what was mentioned..I say "ready? one..two...three" and bring the perch stick down quick,and he'll spread his arms and wave the madly,and we do this for about ten minutes,a couple times a day,but he STILL refuses to fly In nearly thirty years I think he attempted maybe five times,and it was mainly because he got spooked. He didn't go far,basically right down to the floor,but at least he didn't crash land :04:


Jim

Jimbo, I still think you’re missing a key part of the training. The flapping exercises merely strengthen the chest muscles, doesn’t teach to fly

Cthebird, You absolutely can teach your bird to fly! As to why would you when they’ve done so well walking? Because it’s a great way to exercise the bird and provide mental stimulation as well. Even coming to you 10 feet away is a great way for the bird to get a good workout.

Also, it can help prevent terrifying and dangerous crash landings for those few times the bird takes off when frightened or startled, as Jim notes.

Flying is fundamental.

As Chris stated so very well above: Flying is fundamental. Birds are Flying Machines. Every part of their body are by design created to support flight. The interplay of the chest muscles, the heart and the air sack is an interlocked system that are the foundation of flight. The underdevelopment of any part of that system becomes problematic for the long health of the bird.

It is a process that one must build upon to bring all three segments together just to get to a point of being ready to teach them how to fly. Kiwi's Mom, spoke to the process of first getting them to flap. Then to feel the lift and then moving them forward to set the joy of flying and than the want to fly. It can take months to get an older Parrot to a place that flight is both possible and then wanted. At that point, one is just at the start of teaching flight paths and safe landings.

With time and positive experiences, they come to enjoy flying and begin to fly not only on request, but out of the joy of flying.

The older the Parrot, the more important it becomes to closely involve your Certified Avian Vet. To go from simply flapping wings for a few minutes to completing laps around your home requires building the strength of the entire system and assure your Parrot is healthy enough to move from one stage to the next. Going from zero to laps could result in the death of your Parrot.

When a Parrot experiences the joy of flight, they change mentally and physically. I cannot understate the importance of including your CAV at each step of the process.

I leave my bird boy's cage open much of the day because I'm in the room with him at those times. Well, today I went downstairs briefly to do something quick and returned to find him on the bed on my big pillow. As I approached the bed he was obviously so excited that he flew about 5 feet and landed perfectly on my left shoulder. That made me happy. We then sat together singing.

I am very careful to close the bathrooms and seats nowadays and take other precautions. I always put him in his cage when I'm cooking downstairs. I doubt hill make that long of a flight in the near future, but my old bird boy used to so I make sure to prevent accidents, when I can.

Yay! Way to go little greenie!!! That's awesome!

Cthebird said:

I am very careful to close the bathrooms and seats nowadays and take other precautions. I always put him in his cage when I'm cooking downstairs. I doubt hill make that long of a flight in the near future, but my old bird boy used to so I make sure to prevent accidents, when I can.

Click to expand...

great news, but now you have entered a new era of bird ownership and will have to make your house bird safe. Electric kettle/radio? Well the cables will get chewed, leave a jacket on the back of a chair, yep, that will get chewed, and the list goes on.

You have helped create a monster

\o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/

Jimbo, I still think you’re missing a key part of the training. The flapping exercises merely strengthen the chest muscles, doesn’t teach to fly

chris-md said:

Jimbo, I still think you’re missing a key part of the training. The flapping exercises merely strengthen the chest muscles, doesn’t teach to fly

Cthebird, You absolutely can teach your bird to fly! As to why would you when they’ve done so well walking? Because it’s a great way to exercise the bird and provide mental stimulation as well. Even coming to you 10 feet away is a great way for the bird to get a good workout.

Also, it can help prevent terrifying and dangerous crash landings for those few times the bird takes off when frightened or startled, as Jim notes.

Flying is fundamental.

Click to expand...

Do I now take Amy into the bedroom on the bed,and toss him up in the air and say "ok Amy...now FLY!" and see what he does
Honestly,I don't think he'll EVER try to fly unless he HAS to

I've put him on his front door and stood not even a foot away,saying "c'mon Amy,go flapflap to me" with my arm extended or showing him his perch stick,and he just looks at me like I'm a knucklehead and that 'ya right" expression on his face :26:



Jim