Keeping an African Grey

I have been thinking a long time of getting a parrot (African grey preferably)
and I live in a small apartment, it does have a large window area with a good view. How messy are parrots? How much attention do they need? What about the cost of its health care?


If someone could provide me with the pros and cons I'd be grateful. I also would prefer an older parrot that needs rehomed as I am 44 and I know Greys can live to 60.


I live on my own and reside in Scotland.

I will chime in with my large parrot experience.

African Greys are messy and they are very dusty as well. You will find their feathers, ad they also like to fling pieces of food everywhere in your house lol. African Greys need a ton of attention every day. At least 4-6 hours outside their cage and they also need a lot of 1-on-1 time, and the vet bills can be a lot if the bird gets sick. In the thousands. All birds need an annual check-up, for me it is $60 for a basic checkup, more if they are doing any blood work.
They can also be loud as well, so I am not really sure about having them in an apartment.

given proper care, Greys can live well past 60. Other than that I don't know much about them so good luck.

brighterdaysaviary said:

I will chime in with my large parrot experience.

African Greys are messy and they are very dusty as well. You will find their feathers, ad they also like to fling pieces of food everywhere in your house lol. African Greys need a ton of attention every day. At least 4-6 hours outside their cage and they also need a lot of 1-on-1 time, and the vet bills can be a lot if the bird gets sick. In the thousands. All birds need an annual check-up, for me it is $60 for a basic checkup, more if they are doing any blood work.
They can also be loud as well, so I am not really sure about having them in an apartment.

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Thank you for replying so quickly, there is a parrot in my local pet shop that stands on a perch (no cage) at the window of the shop and it is an Grey. It seems a very calm bird and makes very little noise.


I have been in the shop about five times, the 3rd time I offered it my hand and it came to me, put one talon on my hand and then the other, it didn't fly onto it, it stepped. Last time I was in the shop the woman said it was in a non-sociable mood but I offered it my hand anyway and it proceeded to put one talon briefly on my hand, it did it one more time and that was that, it felt like a handshake more than an aborted attempt to actually come onto my hand. As I was talking to the shop owner and handing over cash to her the Grey said Toodaloo to me, first time I have heard it speak. I think it knew I was leaving the shop having learned the signs from other customers as they pay before leaving and this was why it said Toodaloo.


Also later after I had been shopping in the supermarket nearby I was walking past its window and I heard it whistle at me. Such a sweet but sensitive bird, as I said very calm and gentle, not exactly enthusiastic or overly boisterous but rather cautiously amiable. It seems its overall behaviour is not typical of Greys? Is this because it is a different environment for it and so might behave differently in its actual home? The owner said that it sometimes is left overnight in the shop on its own to sleep there.



I have been thinking for a long time about getting a parrot but it is not something I would want to rush into without knowing enough about keeping such complex animals.

Caution, you are only seeing snippets of his time. My parrots (not Grey's) are very loud first thing in the morning! Right when the sun comes up, even if they are covered, abd they only get louder till they see me, get attention, get fed. I know of a ship parrot that is lovely in the store, sweet and quiet, but has been sold and returned three times for screaming, she is now permitly the shop mascot never to be sold again, tho man have fallen in love with her and tried to buy her (again) that said every parrot is different. I have pet set African grey but never owned one. One would play tricks on me in the middle of the night, yelling out who's there at Midnight!!! Then he would laugh. I was young and the home I stayed at was out in the marsh, and I was scared to be there at night. He was so smart and he knew it!!! How he plotted to call out in the middle of the night!! I asked the owners if he did this often, they said never once to them!!!!

Willcome and be welcomed. Good on you for doing some research. Do a little more - read the stickies at the top of the Grey sub-forum. Also - read the stickie at the top of the Amazon forum titled "I Love Amazons" - it is a very thorough discourse on not only what it takes to own and care for Amazons, but every type of parrot in general. Owning any parrot is not something to take lightly - they are unlike dogs, cats fish or reptiles and are almost as much work as a human child, maybe more because they never grow up. Greys can be wonderful companions and are VERY intellegent sometimes to their detriment. They need mental stimulation like any child and if not provided this they can develop all sorts of self destructive behaviour like feather plucking and even self mutilation or screaming a lot. I mean any parrot can develop the same but Greys and cockatoos seem to be more prone to the physical stuff (Amazons and others are more likely to scream). Nor are parrots inexpensive to own - besides the initial cost to buy them and the cage they all require a constant stream of toys which they will destroy rather qucikly, and a good healthy diet of fresh veggies and fruits and a small amount of seed. And regular visits 1X a year and the occasional sick birdie visit to a Certified AVIAN vet which can run from $50-60 to several hundred depending on what is needed and where you live. Most owners keep a $1000 slush fund for emergencies.

So read, read read. Go into this with both eyes open. Because the saddest thing in the world is a parrot who thought he had a forever home with some one, only to be re-homed again and again. If you decide that this Grey is your forever birdie, please stay with us. Ask any question and voice every concern. We are here to help, advise and yes share the good times and bad.

Good Luck!!!

It sounds like you have made a connection there.
I know how hard it can be to walk away from something like that.
I think it's true you can't tell how loud a bird will be when viewing it in a pet shop. Once they come home they can change a lot.

My Grey is not noisy most of the time but she does like to imitate my Cockatiels at a very loud level. Cockatiels have sweet voices for the most part but at the volume Bella (my grey) belts it out it can be annoying.

I don't think she is any more or less messy that any other parrot that I have but they do have more feather "dust" than Amazons or other new world parrots.

Do not listen to me...as I an a confirmed grey-addict.
Just can't live without them.

I have had them for huge chunks of my life (well, they had me actually)- being a enslaved by a grey is an honour, but it is a lot of work.
(I have 2 now-> so double insane)

They are intuitive/smart/sharp observationists almost to the point of clairvoyance, neurotic and easily bored (so overstimulation/ understimulation is always an issue) - so staying a step ahead (or even '*only* one step behind') is a challenge.
Prone to featherpicking, stubborn behaviour and being downright cute and adorable.
They are great at training people, so no worries there - they will have you doing 'the right things' (in their eyes anyway) in no time.

Feathermess-wise: not as bad as cockatoos (or other australians) but a lot worse than the new-world-birds. The powderdust gets everywhere, so I hope you love your cleaning equipment.
(I hate mine, I'd rather cuddle them or play games)

Having said that: unless you LOVE cleaning up -> do not get any parrot.
They will decorate your walls, ceiling with freshly pressed (in the beak) juice, fling fruit, wingflap vigourously to create mini-tornadoos of everything lying about and light enough to set flying, of course they will poop (but can be trained, within reason, to do so only at designated places but accidents will happen) and will try to get into everything you eat/own/are doing (at their own risk)

They are wastefull - prepare to chuck about 3/4 of every lovingly bought snack/food/drink.
Oh...toys...lots and lots and lots. (ALL your belongings now belong to them, to destroy at will)

and the hours....never end!!


I've never had screamers, but I have a whiner (he's going at it right now and I really wish I could take out the batteries for a bit) the rest were more or less well behaved noisewise.
But if they are taught to scream ... just go deaf in selfdefense!
afaik their flock-call is a high piercing whistle, it is hardly used here anymore, but oh my...

Thank you all for such great replies, you have all been extremely helpful. I am going to give it more time before I decide.


If the parrot in the pet shop was for sale then I'd definitely be more decisive on the matter, I think the manager and his family owns him, unfortunately.

Honestly you gotta know if you can handle that beak. Grays are strong and I only have a 305 gram Timneh not a 500 gram Congo. And it feels like if she wanted to she could break my finger. So make sure you can handle the nips. Timneh doesn’t bite often but it can be a deal breaker for some people and a larger parrot. Pretty much everyone that comes over to meet her is intimidated by her. She’ll go to fly on their head and just watch all the heads duck and run for cover. And she isn’t attacking she just wants to say hi. Each parrot has their own personality and quirks. I used to play computer games till Timneh figures out how to turn my monitor off and destroy my keyboards. So now we just watch videos together. Grays are really awesome as long as your prepared for a lot of messy the occasional nip, and a whole lot of stubborn. My Timneh only screams when she’s flying a little too fast around the house and scares herself. Her whistles are loud enough I keep the door shut at night so I don’t bother my neighbors with their windows open. But we do share a driveway so they are pretty close to me. Sorry for the rambling just trying to give you a peak into a grays world. Oh I recently had to remove the fan blades from my ceiling fan cause the wood is bad for Timneh and change all my cfl bulbs to led so she doesn’t break them.

I have seen some photos of parrot bites and some of them look like the result of a vicious open razor attack, lol. I can see why some people call them mini flying dinosaurs.

A great start is to read this thread: http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/59366-cag-101-a.html

Greys are among the more intelligent of parrots, but many don't enjoy much physical contact to include cuddling. I'd encourage a thorough reading of member experiences as well as various themes including health care and diet.

LOL, *every* single grey I've ever met was a cuddlebug - so I have no idea where that reputation stems from


Rico was okay even with lying on his back- as long as he got scritches, the world was just fine (he only bit my father, but then he had Parkinsons disease so maybe he moved "freaky" - they absolutely loved calling each other names btw.).

D, was okay with everyone scritching her head and she used to take naps with me -> sitting on my chest under a blanket.
(I know not a wise thing to do, but we were both totally exhausted at the time.)

Appie prefers her scritches when I am contorted -> so her @ the back of the cage, hanging from the curtains etc.etc. She is the challenging one. Though sometimes she'll just hang out on my lap, hook her beak somewhere (T-shirt, pants etc.) en just be pettet untill amost liquid.

Japie will fly over, knock everyone else off their perch and yodel till he gets his scritches (he prefers schoulders, but my monitor will do just as well)

Even Frits (not my bird/ holliday visitor/the one who was taught to bite and was horribly insecure) some days decided he could not live without a good cuddle, and would just sidle over and faceplant himself somewhere (legs, couch anywhere) with his feathers up.


so yea...they adore being cuddled, but at their chosen time and place.
They are very catlike that way.


(the macaw is more puppy -> is there is live action, she wants to be there and about those cuddels ... Oh yess plze, keep m coming!)

Scott said:

A great start is to read this thread: http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/59366-cag-101-a.html

Greys are among the more intelligent of parrots, but many don't enjoy much physical contact to include cuddling. I'd encourage a thorough reading of member experiences as well as various themes including health care and diet.

Click to expand...

Thank you, that thread was very helpful.

The majority of the characteristics that follow apply to all large birds, but African Greys are smarter and therefore more easily upset by changes etc (as a rule)--they also aren't always huge on being handled.


Descriptors:
Expensive (vet, toys, cage, food, supplements, fresh produce, accessories, cage covers, travel cage, boarding fees, travel expenses, vacuums, humidifiers, splat-mats, filters, air purifiers that DO NOT ionize or produce ozone...the list goes on..think thousands and thousands over a lifetime...as in $50,000 + if they live as long as they should), messy- like...BEYOND belief...you could easily lose your security deposit, shrill noises at times, prone to neuroticism and feather plucking, not particularly cuddly but attention seeking nonetheless, the smartest of parrots, may or may not talk, often bond to one person, a new piece of furniture or a picture on the wall can set them into a spiral


A baby (human) being born can derail them if they are getting less attention---this can lead to jealousy,aggression and self-mutilation, as can the introduction of a spouse of girl/boyfriend. Their medical costs are huge if/when needed (and they hide illness until they are nearly dead, so you have to watch and research like crazy and spend even more on testing). If you have other pets, this could be an issue as well. Birds are a big risk in an apartment, so if you get noise complaints and an eviction warning, what happens then?
You will have to do a lot of bending to clean etc, so should mobility become an issue, you will struggle to care for your bird.
If, when you are older, you end up in a nursing home, that is another issue, as your bird will not be able to come with you.

You will likely need to put the bird in your will...they can live a VERY long time- 60 is average, but there are reports of 80+.
They are sensitive and can self-destruct if rehomed. Some never get over it...some have literally starved over the heart-break.


They need a specific amount of uninterrupted sleep. In your small apartment, you will either need a separate bird room, or a commitment to take phone-calls outside and watch TV with headphones. Sleep impacts mood and overall immune system function. Lack of sleep leads to feather plucking and increases the likelihood of aggression and self-mutilation. Forget sleeping in as well.


What happens if you get one and it hates everyone else? What if it picks someone else and hates you? (This happens often)
Who will care for it when you are away- what if it bites at them?
If you bring it along, what happens if they hate their travel cage? What if the hotel doesn't allow birds? What if you need to fly--that is a whole different ball of wax. If you drive, you can't leave a parrot in the car, so on a solo car-trip, you are either driving straight through, or bringing your bird to the bathroom.

I will post a separate list of things I just wrote down for another newowner...you will have to totally change the way you cook, clean and do your hair....Anything with a smell can kill them and plenty of things that are odorless are equally harmful to birds.
Also, should you ever move out of your apartment, your bird will have grown used to seeing and hearing you at all times. This will translate to problematic behavior in a larger house, as their attention will have been significantly reduced....The bird you see at the store is in a getting with A TON of stimulation. That bird would be 100% different in a quiet/home environment. Also, you don't know how it behaves with others after the novelty has worn off and you don't know what it took to get it there. Furthermore, YOU WILL BE BITTEN...a lot....as will your family....and your bird's mood may change on a dime. I love my bird, but I am telling you this because getting one is a bigger deal than having a kid or getting married. Human children are MUCH easier because fewer things kill them and most people do not fear them...they also can't fly and they eventually grow up. The bird will remain suspended in toddler-hood forever, with the spacial reasoning of a 4 year old.


Here is what I posted to another 1st time bird owner---
"Make sure you read all about the dangers of Teflon/PTFOA, PTFE--- can kill in as little as 5 minutes when heated and hides in LOTS of things besides no-stick pans.....popcorn makers, rice-cookers, blow-dryers, space-heaters, bake-in-a-bag meals, drip-trays, curling irons, humidifiers, self-cleaning ovens during self-cleaning cycle, irons, ironing boards, coffee makers etc.
There are accounts of birds fatally inhaling PTFE fumes from a different floor of the house.

Also, make sure you aren't using scented products (air-freshener, candles, lysol, windex, bleach, defusers, smoke, bbq grills right by the house etc).
When cleaning, use only avian approved cleaners or something like vinegar +water, or grapeseed extract. I use a veterinary product called F10 SC and I love it (as it kills more than vinegar and is relatively safe +avian approved)----fumes aren't an issue when diluted to the proper ratio. I do 2ml per 17oz of water in a chemically resistant spray bottle (labeled of course). You can get a 1 ml syringe at the pharmacy for free if you ask for one.

Avoid toxins like avocado, tomato, rhubarb, excess salt or sugar, alcohol, artificial sweetener, chocolate, caffeine etc. Birds are lactose-intolerant. They also should not consume a lot of fatty foods (including nuts). If you have an insect problem, ant killers and insecticides can also kill your bird. A bird may even be poisoned by eating a bug that has consumed chemicals. Fruit pits and apple-seeds are dangerous for birds due to cyanide content, but when the pit/seeds are not present, they are fine. Avoid excessively acidic foods and citrus fruits---too much citrus can cause iron poisoning because it disrupts their ability to eliminate it (Iron Storage Disease--- https://www.petmd.com/bird/condition...torage_Disease ). Avoid fortified cereals etc (not just because of the sugar, but due to added vitamins). Also, natural applesauce (unsweetened) still contains citric acid, so stuff like that should be given in moderation.

If you ever have to give a bird meds and can't squirt it in, consider making a small batch of PLAIN oatmeal, sweetened with fruit. Test it on the bird ahead of time to make sure it is a hit. Then, if you need to give medicine, take a small amount of oatmeal and mix it in after the oatmeal has cooled (think baby bottle temp). If the quantity is small enough, this will allow you to ensure that they have eaten it all.

Wet foods should not be left in the cage for very long, as they are bacterial hazards...Within 2 hours, most should be moved, unless you are dealing with something like apple slices (harder fruits have a bit more wiggle room-- especially raw ones).

If heating foods or giving wet foods, beware that some birds have a hormonal response to these. Mine doesn't, but I have heard that in an already hormonal bird, these can make things worse.

When you are able to handle your bird, make sure you are not petting it in a way that is sexually stimulating. This can cause egg-laying, aggression etc. In cockatoos, anything other than the head is generally considered unsafe.

Peanuts can be dangerous because of the salt and fat content, but also because the shells contain a fungus that can infect the bird.

Do not allow the bird to chew on metal objects---zinc, copper and lead are very bad. Stainless steel is really the only safe metal.

Limit seeds-- especially sunflower seeds.
Make sure you find out how much sleep your bird needs and provide x hours of uninterrupted sleep in a quiet room. You may cover the cage, but depending on your bird, you should research cage covering and night-frights first. Don't cover with a heavy fabric (towels etc are not very breathable)

Place the cage in a spot away from drafts where at least one side of the cage is against a wall. A cage that is open on all sides makes birds feel too vulnerable to attack from all sides (they are prey animals)

If your bird is ever on the cage-floor without a purpose (playing etc) then this is the sign of a VERY ill bird....like EMERGENCY...
Birds hide illness and so at that point, it is a very bad situation. Keep an eye on your birds droppings (Google will help), look out for nasal secretions, the vent (butt-hole hahaha) should be free from debris. Breathing should be inaudible. Look out for tail bobbing when a bird is standing still/perched, as this is a sign of difficulty breathing in many cases. Any cracking, squeaking or wheezing is BAD when the bird breathes. Eyes should not be red, nor should they produce discharge or swelling. Take your bird to the vet if you notice any of these things or if your bird's behavior or eating/drinking suddenly changes. Look for a certified avian vet and get your bird checked ASAP because this will ensure that you are starting with a clean bill of health. Do not share food or toys among birds if at all possible.

Birds can be carriers of deadly illness without actually ever getting sick. For instance, the precursor to deadly PDD (also known as Macaw wasting disease) is a virus called ABV. This virus infects about 45% of birds, but most never show symptoms (even though they can still spread it--in vulnerable birds, it becomes PDD, which is terminal)---after exposure, it may take up to 10 years to show symptoms (if ever). Beak and Feather disease is another one that can spread easily and is deadly as well. SOOOO that is why you should avoid exposure to other birds in boarding facilities etc, unless you have no choice. Although there is testing available for these, carriers can erroneously test negative unless they are actively shedding the virus at the time of testing."

Thank you for that, it is a LOT to mull over. I have also been reading of how a lot of parrot owners have been keeping parrots they thought were male but later realized they were female. I also had no idea that female parrots can lay eggs without mating.

Fascinating stuff and stuff not to be taken lightly.

Hi and welcome. My CAG is Buzz. He’s up with the sun, singing and whistling, he’s messy, I keep a broom and dust bin close by. I let him roam on his and Buddy’s cage tops, he’s good about staying on them and boy does he love toys, toys he can shred. His favorite is alphabet blocks. He’s smart, so smart he unlocks Buddy’s cage doors and he has a puzzle drawer box he uses.

He doesn’t like to be touched but that is OK, we do have a good relationship and I do get close to him, interact with him with my hands and fingers so he does get contact. I interact with him every day multiple times a day especially verbally. Communication with the flock is important

Here is Buzz working on a new toothpick making project.



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"Here is Buzz working on a new toothpick making project. "

LOL, now that is funny !

I will chime in on my personal experience. I adopted a 25 year old Congo. I also was told that he did not like head scratches but in my three mandatory visits to the center, I was easily able to scratch his head and have him step up for me.
He wasn't noisy or loud and as sweet as could be...until I got him home.
The 2nd day, he chomped my hand and drew blood. This obviously killed the trust between us. For the next couple months we worked on building trust.

He also had a VERY loud whistle that he would do when he was looking for me. But, he also does this when I am sitting right next to him. Actually hurts my ears.

As others have mentioned, they can be very messy and dusty. My guy loves chewing cardboard, his favorite activity. I will make him a huge rope of cardboard pieces and within an hour...gone! He also will throw food around if he's mad at me. Did I say messy?

Don't misunderstand me, they are great companions. Will make you laugh a lot. When my phone rings, my guy will answer it in both a male and female voice. Also will talk to the TV if a program is on. Hysterical.
Just understand the work/expense involved before making a decision.

Caitnah said:

He also had a VERY loud whistle that he would do when he was looking for me. But, he also does this when I am sitting right next to him. Actually hurts my ears.

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I hate this whistle, Buzz does it daily and I know he does it at me. I say “Buzz sing something else.” The little smart booty then sings something else and goes back to that whistle. He does it on purpose too, I swear!



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