For Anyone Thinking of Hand-Feeding an Unweaned Baby Bird Without Experience

EllenD

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I happened to be watching an episode of "Dr. K's Exotic Animal ER" last night, and it featured a little Yellow-Sided Green Cheek Conure baby that the owner said was only 6 weeks old at the time, and that they had purchased from a breeder at the age of 3 weeks old, and had been hand-feeding her formula since. They had no prior experience hand-feeding or raising a baby bird, nor did they know anything about formula temperature or ambient temperature that a 3 week-old bird required. They had brought her into the Hospital to see Dr. K because she was "wheezing" as the owner described it, though it wasn't wheezing. This adorable little Green Cheek was actually sucking air into her beak/lungs in these tiny little gasps that were creating a high-pitch whistling sound...

Dr. K put the baby under quick gas sedation and then opened her beak/mouth up, and saw nothing but a thick, white/yellow plaque all over the back of the baby's throat and entrance to her Crop. After using a tiny Endoscope to look down her Trachea and Esophagus, Dr. K realized that this poor little baby had developed a Yeast Infection inside of her Crop due to the owner not being trained in hand-feeding a baby bird formula and not making sure the formula temperature was between 104-110 degrees F, but just "making sure it was warm", and at 3 weeks old with no outer feathers, not keeping her in a Brooder at 95 degrees F...But this Yeast Infection was never treated and she had had it for almost a month at this point, and it became so bad that it spread from her Crop right up to her mouth, and then down her Trachea, creating such a thick layer of Yeast that she only had about a pinhole-sized opening to breath through. Dr. K actually had to put a Cannula into her Abdominal Airsac and breath for her through this hole with a tube through it into her Abdomen. They started medications, gave her fluids, etc., and she started to get a bit better, though she couldn't breath on her own at all through her mouth/beak, and then they realized that the Yeast was so bad that it had actually clogged the Cannula already, and when they removed the Cannula because she was suffocating, she ended-up dying. It was horribly sad for everyone, including me.

This is the reason why you should never, ever, ever buy a baby bird who is not fully-weaned and only eating solid-food on their own. It's NOT EASY to hand-feed a baby bird, no matter what any "breeder", pet shop, or website tells you...
 

texsize

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I love watching Dr K. Even though I have seen many bad endings when treating birds..
Hard to watch but informative.
Next week episode will have a CAG that started plucking.
Going to be sure to watch that.
 
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EllenD

EllenD

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I love watching Dr K. Even though I have seen many bad endings when treating birds..
Hard to watch but informative.
Next week episode will have a CAG that started plucking.
Going to be sure to watch that.

It is always sad when they are treating a bird, because generally the birds die. CAV's all over the country refer their patients to Dr. K because she is one of the foremost-authorities in Avian Medicine in the country, specifically Avian Surgery, but with how sensitive birds are to Anesthesia, and then to the stress of being sick and in a hospital, the outcomes are generally very bad (she has developed the safest Anesthesia for birds to-date, and is working on a new one as we speak)...Did you see either of the episodes where she literally rebuilt the legs of two different baby Macaws? She's an artist. And both of those massive, long orthopedic surgeries were successes. But that is rare...Avian medicine is getting better every day, but it's nowhere near what it needs to be...

What I can tell you is that I lived anywhere even near Florida in-general, I would be taking my birds to Broward Avian & Exotic, without a doubt...
 

LaManuka

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Wonderful if very saddening post.

Perhaps worth turning into a “sticky”?
 

texsize

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I love watching Dr K. Even though I have seen many bad endings when treating birds..
Hard to watch but informative.
Next week episode will have a CAG that started plucking.
Going to be sure to watch that.

It is always sad when they are treating a bird, because generally the birds die. CAV's all over the country refer their patients to Dr. K because she is one of the foremost-authorities in Avian Medicine in the country, specifically Avian Surgery, but with how sensitive birds are to Anesthesia, and then to the stress of being sick and in a hospital, the outcomes are generally very bad (she has developed the safest Anesthesia for birds to-date, and is working on a new one as we speak)...Did you see either of the episodes where she literally rebuilt the legs of two different baby Macaws? She's an artist. And both of those massive, long orthopedic surgeries were successes. But that is rare...Avian medicine is getting better every day, but it's nowhere near what it needs to be...

What I can tell you is that I lived anywhere even near Florida in-general, I would be taking my birds to Broward Avian & Exotic, without a doubt...

Yes I saw that episode. Amazing job she did.
Also saw an episode where she was seeing an Amazon (YNA I think) that was owned by a medical Dr. Bird was way overweight and the owner did not want to listen to her advice . They always say Dr.'s make the worst patients.

I also saw an episode of Dr Pohl where he trimmed the beak of a parrot (don't remember the type but it was large) with a nail clipper. I was horrified to see someone so knowable in general vet care do that.:blue1:
 

ChristaNL

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LOL Doctor Poll is an "every animal vet" who got his schooling a long long time ago and does not have the time to surf the net because he is too darn busy working.
He is of the generation 'if it works it ain't stupid' ;)
and if I had to choose between clippers and an lungful of beakdust-by-powertool ...

I met someone who trimmed the overgrown upper beak of her parrot (african grey) with pruning shears. For decades. (I saw/met the beak, it was a no-brainer ..)

We have a lot op Doctor Poll on tv, Dr. K not so much (havent seen her yet), maybe in a few years or so... sometimes these series get here so slow I swear they row them across the Atlantic episode by episode!
 
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EllenD

EllenD

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I've never watched Dr. Poll...Dr. K is a Certified Avian Vet and an Avian Surgical Specialist, so it's a weird situation in that she owns and runs an Exotic Animal Hospital that treat every species except dogs and cats. She personally treats most of the birds, unless it's something simple, and I like to see that her now-partner Dr. Thelan, who is not a CAV but rather a General Vet, has been learning from Dr. K. You can see the huge difference between a General Vet being taught by a CAV and a General Vet who just decides to start treating "Exotics". It's huge.

I saw that episode where that old, retired human doctor refused to even give his Amazon an anti-inflammatory when she diagnosed him with severe arthritis...Then she showed him his bird's x-ray with his HUGE liver and prescribed medication and a special diet and he refused...That poor Amazon was so obese that he was covered head to toe in Fatty Cysts, they were all over his body, and just from walking across the room he was open-mouth breathing and "squeaking" when he breathed. And when Dr. K mentioned that he was struggling to breath after just walking across the room that guy was like "It's nothing. He always does that. That's not why we brought him, we brought him for his injured knee.", which wasn't injured at all, it was just crumbling to bits under the bird's weight...That guy really pissed me off, that poor Amazon was so obese, and 29 years old if I remember correctly...
 

LordTriggs

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see stuff like that is why I could never be a vet. I'd be in a practice for minutes before I ended up assaulting someone
 

ChristaNL

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see stuff like that is why I could never be a vet. I'd be in a practice for minutes before I ended up assaulting someone
... and I would be right behind you to back you up.
 
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EllenD

EllenD

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Yeah, I wanted to crack the guy in the face too...He actually got really angry with Dr. K because she said "If your wife had arthritis and taking an Advil made her pain go away, wouldn't you want her to have it?"...He flipped then and said "I don't want anything! He's fine! He doesn't need anything!", and that was while he was staring at the x-ray of his bird's massive liver and horribly arthritic joints (all of them), and he's a doctor so he can read an x-ray...By the way, the original reason that they brought their Amazon in to begin with was because he had started limping badly like a month beforehand...That's how bad this poor, obese Amazon's arthritis was, he was like dragging his one leg at the knee...
 

texsize

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Yeah, I wanted to crack the guy in the face too...He actually got really angry with Dr. K because she said "If your wife had arthritis and taking an Advil made her pain go away, wouldn't you want her to have it?"...He flipped then and said "I don't want anything! He's fine! He doesn't need anything!", and that was while he was staring at the x-ray of his bird's massive liver and horribly arthritic joints (all of them), and he's a doctor so he can read an x-ray...By the way, the original reason that they brought their Amazon in to begin with was because he had started limping badly like a month beforehand...That's how bad this poor, obese Amazon's arthritis was, he was like dragging his one leg at the knee...

Yes, that was the episode I was thinking of. You remember it much better than I do. Just reading your description gets me worked up all over again.:mad:
 

LordTriggs

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Yeah, I wanted to crack the guy in the face too...He actually got really angry with Dr. K because she said "If your wife had arthritis and taking an Advil made her pain go away, wouldn't you want her to have it?"...He flipped then and said "I don't want anything! He's fine! He doesn't need anything!", and that was while he was staring at the x-ray of his bird's massive liver and horribly arthritic joints (all of them), and he's a doctor so he can read an x-ray...By the way, the original reason that they brought their Amazon in to begin with was because he had started limping badly like a month beforehand...That's how bad this poor, obese Amazon's arthritis was, he was like dragging his one leg at the knee...

see personally I feel refusing to follow treatments for pets should be considered animal cruelty. That person to put it bluntly knows a darn sight more than the mook walking in. It's why you walk into the vet office in the first place! To then have a fully qualified vet tell you what is wrong and then refuse them is completely ridiculous
 

chris-md

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Yep I watch this show as well and saw this episode. Heartbreaking. I find myself misting up on this shadow more than I should be.
 

Allee

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Years ago I learned to always leave room for an exception. While I fully agree making the decision to hand feed a baby bird is a responsibility that can go tragically wrong in at least a hundred different ways, it's more complicated than that.

On one hand, we probably agree, it's morally wrong to support breeders with less than the best motivations and practices. Selling an unweaned baby bird obviously speaks poorly of the breeders character......and yet......when you see a clutch of fledglings caught up in the sleazier side of the parrot trade through no fault of their own how can you not step back and take a closer look? Transitions aren't easy, what we consider abuse today was once common practice, hopefully we learn and move forward. In a perfect world no breeder would consider selling an unweaned baby parrot but our world is filled with lovely imperfections. Sometimes we choose to rise up and do the right thing to the very best of our abilities. I chose to hand feed a baby quaker parrot and I had no prior experience. My beautiful mistake is a two year old adult blue quaker parrot named Wilson, he's a beloved family member. That said, I scienced the hell out of hand feeding before I brought Wilson home and I would not have hesitated to consult an Av-Vet at the first sign of trouble. I'm sure if you look, Wilson isn't the only hand feeding success.
 
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Rudustin

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Oh boy do I know what that’s like. I bought a Hyacinth from someone that needed quick cash and the bird was only seven months old. Hyacinths can take a year to fledge and to wean! My kitchen was a mess because we spoon fed him his baby food every four hours for another seven months!!!!! It was incredibly difficult. I was not experienced but we made it through and I had him for twenty five years until I put him into a breeding program. He was like a giant, feathered puppy. I think anyone attempting to hand feed a bird regardless of size should really think about not doing it unless you are very experienced. I am bringing home in ten days a Golden Conure. The breeder told me today that he has weaned early but I am not taking him yet because I want to be assured he is definitely weaned. Don’t rush to get your new bird home from a breeder. Wait and really research what kind of bird it is and how long in the wild does it take for a baby bird to wean. Then research several breeders and get a consensus about how long it takes for that type of bird to wean and then make the decision, regardless of what the breeder tells you, to bring your new baby home.
 

TiredOldMan

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Oh boy do I know what that’s like. I bought a Hyacinth from someone that needed quick cash and the bird was only seven months old. Hyacinths can take a year to fledge and to wean! My kitchen was a mess because we spoon fed him his baby food every four hours for another seven months!!!!! It was incredibly difficult. I was not experienced but we made it through and I had him for twenty five years until I put him into a breeding program. He was like a giant, feathered puppy. I think anyone attempting to hand feed a bird regardless of size should really think about not doing it unless you are very experienced. I am bringing home in ten days a Golden Conure. The breeder told me today that he has weaned early but I am not taking him yet because I want to be assured he is definitely weaned. Don’t rush to get your new bird home from a breeder. Wait and really research what kind of bird it is and how long in the wild does it take for a baby bird to wean. Then research several breeders and get a consensus about how long it takes for that type of bird to wean and then make the decision, regardless of what the breeder tells you, to bring your new baby home.

Absolute excellent advice from a new member of our flock. This is what we all on this site preach(for lack of a better description!).WELCOME
 

Scott

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As dear friend Allee eloquently stated, there are always exceptions!

My mom hand-fed three baby Goffins from separate clutches, each abandoned by their parents after 3 to 5 days. First time the chick was discovered cold and bluish third day post hatching. Made the decision to permanently remove after discussion with a breeder friend. Thankfully mom was a quick-study and her boss permitted copious feeding breaks at work! All thrived and 23 years later are happy and healthy.

A fully dependent Gabby:
VKAhWUq.jpg
 

ChristaNL

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LOL I am going to sound like a broken record here: handfeeding should only been done to save a life - not at as 'the norm'. Because the parrotparents (almost) always wll do a far superior job than any human can and with propper human-world-socialisation the normal fledging bird will be just as tame (or even more so because it will have less unnatural behaviourpatterns) as a nestpulled one.


People have been bringing me their found /broken birds ever since I was 7 or 8 years old, I am sick and tired of seeing them die unnecessarily because the humans just could not let them be.
 

Allee

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As dear friend Allee eloquently stated, there are always exceptions!

My mom hand-fed three baby Goffins from separate clutches, each abandoned by their parents after 3 to 5 days. First time the chick was discovered cold and bluish third day post hatching. Made the decision to permanently remove after discussion with a breeder friend. Thankfully mom was a quick-study and her boss permitted copious feeding breaks at work! All thrived and 23 years later are happy and healthy.

A fully dependent Gabby:
VKAhWUq.jpg

I love this story and photo. Your mom is amazing and so is your flock.
 

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