Newbie here

Hi newbie here.


I just adopted a pair of parrots, was told they are male and female. A mix of birds seeds and minerals came with them as well. I guess I'm fine before they run out.
I don't know what they called, the previous owner doesn't know much about them; their image is attached.
Since I don't have much experience keeping birds I need a help to identify them and to know about their maintenance and health care, food etc. Should I cover their cage with a cloth before they sleep at night?
I guess this is enough for start but later I will come up with more questions such as if they can set free in the room for certain hours a day etc...


Thank you in advance for your help!

Hello and welcome to the forum!
You have 2 beautiful Java Rice Finches (Java Rice Sparrows).
I have 2, and they eat a mix of canary,finch and budgie seed mixed with Zupreem pellets sized for very small birds. They also get veggies twice a day and love them! They always have access to a cuttlebone. I change their water at least twice a day (more if they make a mess in it), and they love to take baths. Mine have a glass pie plate I put in the bottom of the cage with a little water in the bottom and they go crazy bathing in there
They require a good sized cage, a flight cage is preferable since they like to fly..something like this:

https://www.amazon.com/Prevue-Products-Wrought-F040-31-Inch/dp/B00176F5L0/ref=sr_1_2?crid=2QU3TI9FKWU4P&keywords=flight+cage&qid=1560007162&s=gateway&sprefix=flight+cage%2Caps%2C247&sr=8-2

They need a variety of perches in their cage, they love natural branches from a bird safe tree. I would also recommend a small nail trimming perch, something like this:

https://sweetfeetandbeak.com/products/patented-safety-perch

Mine also like their swing like you have, too.

If you let them fly around the room, you will have to catch them to get them back in their cage if you don't want to wait for them to go back in their cage on their own.

I'm so glad you joined us and I look forward to hearing more about your new birds.

Thank you Terry for the detailed info.
So they are not parrots, their beaks looked like parrots . Anyway, its good to know they are finches or sparrows.
I don’t like a small cage and I wanted to give them more freedom, hence I asked about letting them out around the room. That big cage is perfect and I love the idea about natural branches, perches and bathing.
If I let them out around the room would they run into windows?

What type of veggies do you give them? They got this attached water container, should I change its water daily twice?

Do they twit a lot or can they be thought talking? How do I know if they are male and female?

Looks like this forum is all about parrots, is it ok post questions and discuss about finches?

You're very welcome!
They are softbills so you are correct in them not being parrots
Here is a link with some info on the differences between male & female:

Sexing Java Sparrows

Mine especially love green, leafy veggies such as kale. For that I just attach a leaf to the cage and they eat it up.
I give them a leaf once a week. They also get a finely chopped mix of the chop I give my parrots, alternating with different foods found on this list:

http://www.parrotforums.com/parrot-food-recipes-diet/24213-bird-safe-fresh-foods-toxic-food-lists-sprouts.html

They don't talk, but have this really cool sound they make, it talks about it in the link about sexing them.

It's perfectly fine to post about finches here! There are many of us who also have softbills, and the forum is open to all species of birds

Welcome! I apologize ahead of time for this long post, but as a new bird-owner, there is a lot to learn.

When have a bird, any sort of heated mechanism (anything that heats or is heated) and contains PTFE/PFOA/PFCs/Teflon will be out of the question (and most things that heat up or are intended to be heated DO contain these chemicals)--This includes things like pots, pans, cupcake trays, cookie sheets, cake pans etc, but it will also things like include hair-dryers, straighteners, curling irons, curlers, rice-cookers, SLOW COOKERS, popcorn poppers, air fryers, microwave meals (including certain types of microwave popcorn), steamers, irons, ironing board covers, electric skillets, griddles, George Foreman Grills, drip trays, toasters, toaster ovens, poaching pans, electric blankets, humidifiers, heat lamps, SPACE HEATERS, etc etc...
To find out what contains PTFE/PFOA/PFCs/Teflon, you have to call and be a bull about it over the phone (and in some cases, you won't get far). Almost always, it will take a few days for them to get back to you and you must provide the full chemical names, abbreviations and brand-names. Shopping when you have a bird is super annoying..You cannot visually ID these chemical coatings, as they can be colored, transparent, or mixed into metal/fabric during the manufacturing process. Teflon and chemically similar products have killed birds on separate floors with the doors shut. Similarly, while DuPont claims that off-gassing only occurs at higher heats, there have been myriad bird deaths (even within academic circles) at temperatures well within the 300 degree F range! There is a reason they used canaries in coal-mines and it is because they die very easily due to even low levels of fumes of any sort.

Sleep=essential to hormonal and immune function. Different species have different requirements, but you have to figure out what these are and stick to them. This means that someone must be there to cover and uncover the bird at the same time each night and that your home must be conducive to sleep.

Make sure you aren't using any unsafe products around the bird. This is pretty much everything with a scent (and some things without).

No perfume, carpet cleaner, flea shampoo, aerosols, solvents, air fresheners, paints, smoke of any kind, vaping, sunscreen, bugspray, candles of any kind (organic or non), insecticides, certain soaps/shampoos, fire-places, burning or heated oil/fat, self-cleaning ovens, gas and any household cleaners (e.g., bleach, windex, lysol, fabreeze, scrubbing bubbles, kaboom, pine-sol etc)...You will seriously have to re-think your entire home and your cleaning routine will change a ton.
NEVER use the self-cleaning oven function or try to season cast iron around birds.
The list goes on. Birds have VERY sensitive respiratory systems. Essential oils are also fairly unsafe due to their ability to be absorbed into the blood-stream and due to a bird's sensitive air sacs.

This also makes traveling with a bird complicated, as it is very unsafe to bring your bird with you into a location where teflon or chemical cleaners are being used. Unless you are visiting close family and you can give them a 30 hour instructional course on eliminating respiratory dangers from their homes before you get there, it is going to be a bad idea to take your bird (and no one wants to be a pushy guest!).

Generally, you should only pet birds on the head/neck and you should not allow any shadowy spaces in the cage (boxes, bedding, crumbled paper, tents, blankets, low furniture, in clothing etc)...and so are tents/huts/hammocks etc. These things are hormonal triggers and they can cause health and behavior problems.

I would recommend getting an air purifier (non-ozone producing/non-ionizing) to help with dust/mold etc (which can harm birds). Please note- a purifier will not protect birds from cigarette smoke, vaping fumes, teflon/ptfe/pfoa etc. It will only help increase the quality of the air to some extent. You cannot use unsafe chemicals around the bird just because you have a purifier.

Last thing-- Birds hide illness like crazy, so there is nothing intuitive about their diseases. You have to be ready to study your birds poop and behavior daily, because even the slightest change can be a huge indicator. Blood work must be done yearly and should be done soon after you get a new bird. They can spread deadly diseases without showing symptoms---it's a giant pain. Make sure that you have a certified avian vet (CAV) near you. Exotics vets who see birds are not the same thing. If you don't have a CAV near you, your life will be much more anxiety-ridden than if you do (and the difference between a CAV and an exotics vet can mean the difference between life and death for your bird in certain instances).

Oh- and birds are very sensitive to temperature changes and drafts. Any temperature change of 10 degrees or more puts significant stress on their systems. If you have to take your bird out in the cold, make sure you carefully cover the cage and pre-warm the car. Also, make sure you don't have any air-fresheners in the car. Extreme heat can also be harmful. Over time, birds can adjust to a wide ranger of temperatures, but this adjustment has to take place over a long period of time. Anything too quick is going to shock their systems.

I've never seen this species before, they're beautiful. Do they have names yet? I keep looking at them and thinking Osiris and Ishtar and almost want a pair just so I can call them that! Somehow only names from ancient civilisations can do justice to that striking appearance in my mind, haha.

Welcome! You have already met Terry. The best start possible!

Gorgeous birds.

Thank you all for your warm welcome.
Good to know I can alternate different types of food and even fruits.
I cannot identify just looking at them because they look the same in beak color and eye patches , but that's fine I can hide and listen to when the male starts calling.

I'll keep in mind about the household items, air pollution and their sleep routine etc, good to know about them...

sono said:

I cannot identify just looking at them because they look the same in beak color and eye patches , but that's fine I can hide and listen to when the male starts calling.

Click to expand...

It looks like one of them has a narrower beak than the other.

welcome those finches look amazing

Hello and welcome to you!

Got a bigger cage per Terry's advice and you know what one of them immediately took a bath and stays in it. The other one is more curious checking every corner and branches in the cage.

I gave them today apple and lettuce, first they were a little suspicious then just gorged on them.

I still can't identify just looking at them, they are identical to my untrained eyes. I attached their close up image, perhaps Aspie or anyone who is more experienced can tell me more. The one to the right or smaller one got a bigger beak?

sono said:

Got a bigger cage per Terry's advice and you know what one of them immediately took a bath and stays in it. The other one is more curious checking every corner and branches in the cage.

I gave them today apple and lettuce, first they were a little suspicious then just gorged on them.

I still can't identify just looking at them, they are identical to my untrained eyes. I attached their close up image, perhaps Aspie or anyone who is more experienced can tell me more.

Click to expand...

Birds move in slow motion, so you are doing fine. Make sure you focus on giving dark green lettuce- ice-burg lettuce can lead to malnutrition, as it is full of fiber and water and will fill them up without providing nutrients. Also, remember that a grape for a small bird is equal to like 300+ grapes in a human, so keep fruit portion sizes very small. Vegetables are better than fruit, but fruit in moderation is fine---it just is quite sugary and can lead to diabetes, hyperactivity, and obesity if too much is given.
Seeds shouldn't be their whole diet and you need to watch the types of seeds they are getting---
https://vcahospitals.com/know-your-pet/finches-feeding --according to this source, there are even finch pellets out there (I know parrots more than finches though). DO NOT SUPPLEMENT WITH VITAMINS without a certified avian vet's close supervision. It can be deadly.

Also- try to get some perches that have a variety of textures. NOT THE PAPER-COVERED SANDPAPER ONES-- but perches like sweet-feet pumice perches (for keeping nails in check etc) and then more natural wooden textures for the rest (as opposed to the dowel rods).You don't want the width to be uniform all the way across the perch-- you want some bumps and wider portions to work-out the foot muscles and vary pressure points. If you have to wait a week or so, it isn't the end of the world, but you will want to look into making changes to the perches (at least some of them).
Birds (including finches) can get a disease called bumble=foot from standing on dowel rod perches too often (if they sleep on them etc). It is basically like a bed-sore or a blister on the bottom of the foot due to the foot contacting the same points all of the time and it can impact muscle tone etc as well (it can progress and cause deformities). Try looking up manzanita or dragonwood perches--"natural wood perches" is another Google phrase that might help. The ParrotWizard also sells a bunch of good wooden perches on Amazon, but you can get custom-made cross-cage perches on the website (https://parrotwizard.com/Perch/).
Some people make their own textured perches, but if you do that, you must make sure that the wood you use is non-toxic, non-pressure blasted, and untreated. Not all lumber is safe, and wood from your yard is also risky due to the potential for toxic wood, fungus, bacteria, past herbicide use, etc etc--if you find safe, untreated wood that was growing away from run-off and sidewalk salt etc (that has never been treated with fertilizer/herbicides etc), you can use it but you have to bake it and wash it).
There are all sorts of good online sources for selecting appropriate perch width, but basically, you don't want it to be too wide or too small (toes shouldn't touch, but feet should still curve around it). "As a general rule, a bird's foot should wrap itself around about 2/3 of the perch. The perch should never be so small that the bird's front toes meet or overlap the back toe(s)." You can have a few perches that are wider than others, but it is especially important that their sleep perch fit their feet correctly (+natural wood texture).

They can be prone to egg-binding, so since you have 2 in the same cage, you will need to be very aware of this and make sure that the female has proper nutrition (calcium etc) in the event that she attempts to lay an egg. I would not encourage egg-laying-- but even without a nest box, it could happen.

sono said:

I still can't identify just looking at them, they are identical to my untrained eyes. I attached their close up image, perhaps Aspie or anyone who is more experienced can tell me more. The one to the right or smaller one got a bigger beak?

Click to expand...

The one to the left has a smaller, flatter beak with less red in it. Try comparing the bases of their beak and the shapes the light makes as it falls on them, those are where the differences are the clearest.

Haha, what I lack in experience I make up in autism and the Spot the Difference prowess thereof.

sono said:

Got a bigger cage per Terry's advice and you know what one of them immediately took a bath and stays in it. The other one is more curious checking every corner and branches in the cage.

I gave them today apple and lettuce, first they were a little suspicious then just gorged on them.

I still can't identify just looking at them, they are identical to my untrained eyes. I attached their close up image, perhaps Aspie or anyone who is more experienced can tell me more. The one to the right or smaller one got a bigger beak?

Click to expand...

Based on the middle picture, the white part on the left bird's beak goes downward onto the bottom half of the beak (almost like a frown--kind of looks like the sideways head of a cartoon ghost-look at the image I posted, but imagine the whole picture (including the top part of the ghost's head) rotated to the right) lol!

whereas the white part on the right bird's beak goes straight back towards his/her face (almost in the shape of an arrowhead or a Freemason's symbol turned sideways to the right)


Also, the beak of the bird on the right with the "arrowhead"/"Freemason" marking seems a bit wider (with more of a curve), and the top of his/her head is flatter than the bird with the "frown"/ "ghost head" on the left (whose beak is longer but more triangular, with less of an arch at the bride).

LIGHT-BULB MOMENT!

If they don't already have names, left bird could be "Ghost" (unisex name fitting for a white bird) and right bird could be "Mason" or "Macy" lol (depending on gender).

As long as their beaks don't change significantly, you would always associate their names with their differences. I am a little pleased with this idea right now, not gonna lie haha!

Nice finches, but do get rid of that round cage as they will feel unsecured and scared.

sono said:

Hi newbie here.


I just adopted a pair of parrots, was told they are male and female. A mix of birds seeds and minerals came with them as well. I guess I'm fine before they run out.
I don't know what they called, the previous owner doesn't know much about them; their image is attached.
Since I don't have much experience keeping birds I need a help to identify them and to know about their maintenance and health care, food etc. Should I cover their cage with a cloth before they sleep at night?
I guess this is enough for start but later I will come up with more questions such as if they can set free in the room for certain hours a day etc...


Thank you in advance for your help!

Click to expand...

Now I want to see if my identification trick works. Is the bird in the foreground of your very first thumbnail posting the one I called Mason/Macy (AKA, the same bird pictured on the right in the most recent middle image)? If so, I am assuming the bird in the background is the one I called "ghost" based on beak length etc (AKA the bird on the left in the most recent middle image). It is a bit harder to tell when the beaks aren't as clearly pictured...hmmm...Pretty sure that is correct though...The roundness of their heads doesn't seem to help much with that original thumbnail.

PS: Your new cage looks 10x better than the old one. Just fix the perches when you can (to prevent bumblefoot).
What is that lower cup in the cage? I am concerned that they may try to use it as a nesting site, given the fact that they are a male and a female...You really don't want to have to deal with babies..It can get super violent and complicated at the drop of a hat...So if you must keep them together, I would do everything you can to keep them from getting "in the mood".

@Noodles123, never thought choosing right perches is that important. The wooden perches I had were smooth and polished so using a wood chisel and a sand paper I made sort of bumps and dents on them. The perches are wide enough not to overlap their toes. I attached the current image of the perches.

That nest looking cup was for bathing and I have no intention to breed them so I immediately removed it just in case.

I had to change the cage again because my wife didn't like the black color of it. But the new one comes with a nice container for bathing.

Now Aspie and with your help I pretty much figured them out, although it was a bit confusing , thank you!

Seems like its happenning, as Noodles123 warned about them getting in mood. The female occasionally sits for minute or two in a feeder cup now two days in a row. I don't have any nest or something similar in their cage except maybe the feeders (total of three).

Is she trying to lay eggs or what kind of behavior is this? I don't want to deal with babies if they get violent and get out of control; also I don't want to separate them. What can I do?

I have never owned finches personally, but, in my opinion, as long as they are in the same cage together, this will be a constant battle (because they will become stimulated and mate etc).
If eggs are laid, it is not as straightforward of a process as many would assume...It can lead to all sorts of issues and parents are sometimes terrible to their babies.

Suggestion A: get smaller food bowls or feed them on some sort of platform (?)--If you do use a platform, make sure it is high enough up not to cast a shadow (or they will just try to nest under it). Also, make sure food doesn't appear to be too plentiful. Times of excess increase the likelihood of your birds deciding that "now" would be a good time to raise a family. Avoid super fatty foods and squishy/warm foods as well (as these can also contribute). Oh--and make sure they don't have any of those grass-type shred toys, as they are showing hormonal behaviors already..These CAN be okay, but not in hormonal situations. Just because you do this, does not mean you will not have to deal with the egg issue, but it might discourage them slightly....Keep in mind: If they mate and an egg is on the way, it is going to come out somewhere--if it lands on the floor, then that's fine (as your intent is not to breed).

Suggestion B: Make sure they have access to cuddle-bone because if she is trying to lay an egg, she will need the nutrients therein to pass it etc. Keep a close eye on her behavior and if you see her straining, eating less or looking "pregnant" it could be a sign of egg-binding and she will need veterinary attention ASAP.

Suggestion C: If eggs show up, they will usually lay more than one over a short-ish span of time (in parrots, it can be take a few days for the whole clutch to show up)---If you allow the eggs to mature, then you will be faced with more birds and inbreeding issues (birds will mate with their siblings in captivity, and inbreeding can lead to health issues). Consequently, unless you have the setup to give each baby its own cage eventually, you probably shouldn't go this route. There are some sad ways of dealing with unwanted fertile eggs...You can't just take them away or the bird will immediately be stimulated to mate/lay again. You must leave them in the cage until the bird loses interest and decided they aren't hatching. Consequently, you have to make it so that the eggs don't hatch (even if sat upon) without removing them from the cage for more than a few minutes. You can A) replace them with dummy eggs (which may be hard to find...AND may or may not be convincing) OR, the alternative is to boil the eggs (like a hard-boiled egg) and return them to the cage as soon as they are cool enough to go back in safely. I know that sounds terrible, but that is what a lot of people do...
Babies are quite complicated and the parents can sometimes do some pretty nasty things (like kill them or reject them)....So nature makes it look pretty straightforward, but that's just because we don't see all of the nastiness that happens in reality....

Suggestion D: Make sure they are getting enough sleep and that they are getting it on a schedule. Too little sleep can lead to hormonal issues as well.
How much are they getting nightly?

Suggestion E: Separate them if you can (or if you want, try all of the other suggestions first and if they don't help, do this as a last resort)...The thing is, this will likely never stop being an issue when you have a male and female together. It can even be an issue when 2 birds of the same gender are together (minus the babies, but with the risk of egg-laying). Laying eggs is risky and laying fertile eggs is even more complicated...so....that is why I say to separate. You will never be totally out of the woods as long as they are living in the same cage. If you separate them, you could put them right next to each other (although they may become frustrated).... The proximity of the other bird is going to impact hormones, but the mating is definitely going to produce the strongest effect (which is why a barrier is important if breeding is an issue).

Final thought--- just because you haven't seen them "do the deed", does NOT mean that they haven't. It doesn't take long and unless you watch them 24/7 without ever using the bathroom etc, then you could easily miss it.