Speech training gone terribly wrong

I swear Parker has some nasty Amazon in him:

Parker has a stunning vocabulary but is a closet talker, only talks for attention when you aren't in the room. I've been determined to get his talking into the open, and I got my chance tonight to reinforce he hell out of it.

Parkers been talking a bit lately at night as I'm putting him to bed, kind of a "I don't wanna go to bed dad!" I was pulling him to go sit on the shower rod while I shower, a dark route from the living room this time of night. He must have thought he was going to bed because he started talking. I happen to be in the kitchen...BINGO!!! I grabbed some spaghetti noodles from dinner that he was going nuts over earlier and gave him some whenever he said something, and he had plenty to say. We had a real rapport going until...

I pull him to his play stand, he says "up up!" So I put him on his playstand. He repeats,"up up!", I hold my hand out to pick him up (teaching context!) he grabs me with one foot, then THE LITTLE *ISH* NAILS ME ON MY THUMB KNUCKLE! Full beak-full all the way around the knuckle. Needless to say he was thrown into his cage for the night. Little bastard...

I thought only amazons pulled that trickery crap! And this was the second time he bit me today, first time in months. Maybe hormones are kicking in or something. Lord, if he starts this "come pick me up! I bite you now!" crap he'll find himself on a spit with worstershire sauce.

Pumpkin does that to people. He says"com'eer" no warning signs, and so the poor person reaches over - only to get nailed with a sharp little beak..... Jerk. I think he does it on purpose.

Oh no poor Chris . Naughty boy Parker!

He was acting more like what African species do. It's them you have to watch out for lol.

chris-md said:

I swear Parker has some nasty Amazon in him:

Parker has a stunning vocabulary but is a closet talker, only talks for attention when you aren't in the room. I've been determined to get his talking into the open, and I got my chance tonight to reinforce he hell out of it.

Parkers been talking a bit lately at night as I'm putting him to bed, kind of a "I don't wanna go to bed dad!" I was pulling him to go sit on the shower rod while I shower, a dark route from the living room this time of night. He must have thought he was going to bed because he started talking. I happen to be in the kitchen...BINGO!!! I grabbed some spaghetti noodles from dinner that he was going nuts over earlier and gave him some whenever he said something, and he had plenty to say. We had a real rapport going until...

I pull him to his play stand, he says "up up!" So I put him on his playstand. He repeats,"up up!", I hold my hand out to pick him up (teaching context!) he grabs me with one foot, then THE LITTLE *ISH* NAILS ME ON MY THUMB KNUCKLE! Full beak-full all the way around the knuckle. Needless to say he was thrown into his cage for the night. Little bastard...

I thought only amazons pulled that trickery crap! And this was the second time he bit me today, first time in months. Maybe hormones are kicking in or something. Lord, if he starts this "come pick me up! I bite you now!" crap he'll find himself on a spit with worstershire sauce.

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Little what? Surely not!

See you push too hard and they kick back!

Should I contact the animal cruelty people now? LOL

Doubt it's hormonal but more than likely behavioral. Look for the signs they are there!

Hope your knuckles heal soon

I didn't mean to giggle, I promise. Must be the way you told the story, Chris.

Sorry to hear about your knuckle. Yes, Amazons can do this, too, but ALWAYS with a warning sign first. :54:

Glad all you did was giggle. I cracked up laughing.

OOPS sorry lol

Well, that's no fun! Sometimes I wish birds could truly speak English so we could simply ask them why they do these things!

Hope your thumb is feeling better this morning.

Maybe he wasn't digging the noodles? Hahaha!

Ah, Parker! So wrong!

Hormonal switch flip aside, great way to grab the opportunity to encourage more open talking. I hope he didn't nail you too bad, Chris.

I knew you all would get a kick out of it! Knuckle is fine, no blood drawn. But it was shocking for sure. That little turd...

It's weird. I don't know what I'm cueing in to, but last night aside I'm coming to realize I don't fully trust Parker when he talks. I sense a volatility or unpredictability from him when he does, and I'm put on guard immediately if he's on my hand. Maybe it's his insanely pinning eyes. His eyes are mostly black, but when he talks his pupils become and stay TINY until he's done.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid and imagining things.

Stephen, are maya and/or jolly starting to show any spring hormonal behaviors yet?

Not really... unless you count the time around a month ago when Maya bit me for the very first time. I'm the only person she never bites, so it was a complete shocker. But nothing since.

And Jolly hasn't shown any signs at all, though he won't even be 3 until September.

Wow, if Parker stays pinning until he's done talking, I don't blame you for staying on guard. At that level of excitement, his biting you might be almost as much a surprise to him as it is to you. Lol!

chris-md said:

I knew you all would get a kick out of it! Knuckle is fine, no blood drawn. But it was shocking for sure. That little turd...

It's weird. I don't know what I'm cueing in to, but last night aside I'm coming to realize I don't fully trust Parker when he talks. I sense a volatility or unpredictability from him when he does, and I'm put on guard immediately if he's on my hand. Maybe it's his insanely pinning eyes. His eyes are mostly black, but when he talks his pupils become and stay TINY until he's done.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid and imagining things.

Stephen, are maya and/or jolly starting to show any spring hormonal behaviors yet?

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Sorry not everything comes down to hormones, focus less on this and more on the behaviour reasoning and things will improve IMO.

You are reading the signs just not interpreting them correctly and getting bound up in this hormone thing as an excuse. Perhaps he considers his talking time, a time to sit and chunter to himself, chill a bit and not be messed with. Ignore this at your peril.

Plumsmum, you misunderstand. He bit me twice (three times in three days overall), is luging more. THIS I attribute to possible hormones. One of the bites was while he was talking. That COULD be hormones given the timing.

However, my statement is much broader. The mistrust precedes any possible hormonal question marks. See statement re: eye pinning.

OK but isnt the eye pinning an indication of intent, a warning?

Can you distract from this if it is a warning? Change the course of action?

Not really/not always. With any bird it's a sign of excitement, whether positive or negative. He pins his eyes when I hand a rotini noodle over to him, but he would never rip off my finger off.

It could be a warning, but you just get to know your bird and the situation to determine if it's a concern. Move a hand around him too quickly? He'll pin his eyes, and you're at risk. I am a bit guarded when he talks but let's be honest, if I step back and think of things in perspective, I highly doubt talking of all things is a warning sign he's about to bite. One time out of over a month of sample time is telling.

I may just need to chill.

chris-md said:

Not really/not always. With any bird it's a sign of excitement, whether positive or negative. He pins his eyes when I hand a rotini noodle over to him, but he would never rip off my finger off.

It could be a warning, but you just get to know your bird and the situation to determine if it's a concern. Move a hand around him too quickly? He'll pin his eyes, and you're at risk. I am a bit guarded when he talks but let's be honest, if I step back and think of things in perspective, I highly doubt talking of all things is a warning sign he's about to bite. One time out of over a month of sample time is telling.

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No but it may be a time he's content just to be left to be.

So pinning is a good and bad reactor and it's up to you to process and eliminate the risk? Right?

Nailed it! I've never had one but I think amazons are some of the best for studying this concept. Maybe one of the Amazon owners here can expound on their experience.

I get tail flaring for the bad - the crest is unreliable marker as up and down like yoyo. Have you tried to say to Parker to behave or something similar - lets them know you have noticed and are on it. Plum will 'step down' when I tell him to behave so to speak.

Also you will get to know your bird better as time goes on and it becomes easier to read.

I still get bit - it part of having one.

Eye pinning just means that something has the intent attention of the bird, could be a good thing or a bad thing they are focusing on. Prey animals take in a wide field of view on each of their eyes - when the eye pins it is closing out some this wide field and allows the bird to focus on something. Could be a tasty morsel, could be something close and threatening, or something else the bird is focused on. Amazons give plenty of warning before they bite hard. Salty actually takes what ever is not pleasing him in his mouth and gently pushes it away. Continue, and the next use of the beak is to give a hard bite, but not a blood letting one. That is reserved for anyone/thing that continues, and THAT one is a blood drawing bite. His eyes are pinned and feathers out, but he is missing all but 1 tail feather so I cant tell how much he is spreading as the terror level goes up.

Ekkie body language is far less overt than most other parrots. Amazons, 'toos and 'tiels are pretty much on the opposite side of the spectrum in this regard. They give off bright, flashing neon light warnings before they go Krakatoa.

With the ekkies I've had, it's always been a very individual thing where you have to interpret in context. Jolly, for instance, is a VERY beaky fellow. Not in a nippy way. He just loves gently mouthing my fingers. Sometimes it's his way of showing affection, sometimes it's his way of signaling that he wants to play fight, and sometimes he's just grabbing your hand to tell you to stop doing something. The differences are subtle, but after a while I got attuned to him enough to always read which of the 3 he's trying to communicate.

And then there's Maya! When she gets beaky, it's an indication that she's done. Hahaha! Confuse her signs for Jolly's at the risk of a deep bite. And you never know, after the initial warning beaking, when she's actually going to bite. There's simply nothing to differentiate between the two. I've actually seen her in action against my wife and been caught by surprise when it happened.

She'll calmly reach over, no hunched posture, flared tail, or anything, put her mouth over a finger, and then begin her carving operation.

Even the eye pinning is no indication, as Maya pins for EVERYTHING! She just gets excited all the time. She pins if I look at her, talk to her, pick her up, pet her, put her down, etc. Lol.

So basically, you have to work with what little she gives in terms of indication. If she puts my wife's finger in her mouth, I just assume things are about to go horribly sideways and take her off her hand.

Bixby was easy. He'd just go predator still. Looking at you like, "Yeah. Do THAT again." Lol!

Thanks that was really interesting. Dont think i'll add an ekkie to my flock even though they look stunning. Not come across any called Jekyl and Hyde yet so anyone need any name suggestions?

It's not always about signs and signals though, when you get to know your bird you can sense when things are about to go ape sh$t. You pretty much got yours sussed and know the scenarios that cause the reaction.