20ish year old male Amazon

[CFellows]

Ok all you amazon people out there, I need your help. I know a lady who wants me to take her Amazon. She is in a tough spot and can no longer keep him. He is around 20 years old and never been handled. She rescued him from a breeder, who no longer wanted him after his mate died. The lady said the bird will take treats from her hand and is very sweet. I have never been around amazons, so i would like to know what you guys think? Would it be possable to tame and train him at this age. Do you think he would get along with my Conure(both adult males)? Any advice would be great, thank you. +=?

 

[Amanda_Bennett]

I don't have much experience with amazons, but Zilla is 28, came from a pretty bad environment, has some health issues.

I've had her just 2 months now and she has come a long ways from what she was when I got her. I could barely get her to step up or take treats from my hand and now she won't get off me! I never thought she would be a "touchy, snugly bird" but she really just wants to be on me, with me and "help" me do everything now.

I know there are more experienced zon people on here and I'm sure they can be more help than me, I just had to give my 2 cents.

Good luck!

 

[Dopey]

I'm not much help either. Cause I'm a sucker and I'd take the Zon. I've got a person asking me to take another Zon right now and I'm having a hard time saying "no." It's really a decision you have to make for yourself. I would never tell you not to do it.

 

[Amanda_Bennett]

I'm not much help either. Cause I'm a sucker and I'd take the Zon. I've got a person asking me to take another Zon right now and I'm having a hard time saying "no." It's really a decision you have to make for yourself. I would never tell you not to do it.

I'm with Dopey on this one!

I'd take it in a heartbeat! I've been visiting a 6 year old male yellow fronted at the bird hut and if he is still there when Zilla can have a friend in the house I will probably go get him!

 

[Kiwibird]

I'm also a big zon fan. Ours was about 10 when we adopted him, never handled, rather vicious and 'hated women'. As you can see in my profile picture, that is no longer the case They are flock creatures, and when shown love and respect, they want nothing more than to be a part of their human 'flock'. Many zons are not cuddly, and are not known for being a cuddly species in general. Zons are great parrots overall though, just require a little special handling around their breeding season (as they tend to get tad aggressive with hormonal fluctuations in the spring).

Edit: What species of amazon is he BTW?

 

[CFellows]

I'm also a big zon fan. Ours was about 10 when we adopted him, never handled, rather vicious and 'hated women'. As you can see in my profile picture, that is no longer the case They are flock creatures, and when shown love and respect, they want nothing more than to be a part of their human 'flock'. Many zons are not cuddly, and are not known for being a cuddly species in general. Zons are great parrots overall though, just require a little special handling around their breeding season (as they tend to get tad aggressive with hormonal fluctuations in the spring).

Edit: What species of amazon is he BTW?

He is a blue fronted amazon

 

[Dopey]

If you do get it...you won't regret it.

 

[CFellows]

Ok everyone, I told the lady I would go meet him on the first, if she had not found him a home by then. I will keep you informed on what happens.

 

[Birdman666]

Ok all you amazon people out there, I need your help. I know a lady who wants me to take her Amazon. She is in a tough spot and can no longer keep him. He is around 20 years old and never been handled. She rescued him from a breeder, who no longer wanted him after his mate died. The lady said the bird will take treats from her hand and is very sweet. I have never been around amazons, so i would like to know what you guys think? Would it be possable to tame and train him at this age. Do you think he would get along with my Conure(both adult males)? Any advice would be great, thank you. +=?

This bird is not tame. If you take it, don't expect it to ever become tame. You can try, and there are ways to do it, but don't count on it happening. It is possible, and yes, I've done it. How difficult it is depends on the bird. My "rule of thumb" on breeder birds that have never been handled is to treat them from the get go as wild birds that are not now, and have never been tame. You are starting from scratch, quite possibly with a bird that does not wish to be handled. That is what you are taking on. This bird may not be, and may never be pet quality.

Do you know the taming and training protocols for taming down wild birds? This is old school here... there was a time when all there was were wild birds... go back to the old school on this one.

As for your conure: Big bird little bird, little bird ALWAYS loses. And Amazons can be quite territorial. So, if the zon is aggressive, that might not be such a great fit for your conure. If the zon is a perch potato, it might not matter at all... Mine were socialized together and they got along, but my birds were tame, and I did not permit big birds to become bullies.

The aggressor was knocked off the playstand to the floor. Whether the conure was acting defensive and going after the Zon in a pre-emptive strike. (Stupid move, but they occasionally do that!) Or the big bird was tormenting the little bird. And I had separate playstands available to keep the big and little apart when they wanted to be.

So again, depends on the bird.

 

[4dugnlee]

When I got Sassy I looked at it as I may NEVER get her to step up or come to me, but I knew I would give her a better life and give her attention and she would be happier than where she was. Now she steps up all the time, every time, and last night I got a pic of her kissing me, which I totally trust her to do now! However, she was at one time tame, just not with the previous owner who had her for 4 years. If you are willing to take the chance that he may never be a hands on bird, then go for it. I would!

As for the conure, they may never get along...or maybe they will. There's no way to know ahead of time. I don't think I will EVER be able to have Sassy and Cisco out together, based on Sassy's aggressive attitude whenever she's near Cisco's cage. However, I can have Cisco and Peanut out together (at least right now), and I expect to be able to eventually have Sassy and Peanut out together, based on Sassy's non-aggressive attitude when she's by Peanut's cage. As long as you are prepared to divide your time with them in case they can't be out together. Good luck and keep us updated.

 

[Birdman666]

There's no way to know ahead of time.

Exactly! You do the work and take your chances... and base everything on how the bird responds. Most living things respond favorably to love...

Maybe this bird wasn't handled because no one was interested in handling it, and it was there to make them money. Maybe you are finding a diamond of a birdie personality.

MY MOST BONDED BIRD EVER WAS A BFA THAT SOMEONE DUMPED BY THE GARBAGE AT LUCKY'S...

 

[Kiwibird]

Do you know the taming and training protocols for taming down wild birds? This is old school here... there was a time when all there was were wild birds... go back to the old school on this one.

This is a such an excellent point here Mark! Some of the more modern 'positive reinforcement' methods are tailored towards hand-reared young birds who were hatched in an incubator and raised by humans. Those more 'touchy feely' techniques aren't necessarily the best for birds on the 'feral' side. Though if the bird accepts treats from a hand, he is probably not the worst kind of 'wild' and probably has some positive experiences/level of trust in humans. A PO'd, untrained zon is a force to be reckoned with, and can be quite intimidating. Using sticks, gloves and being familiar with toweling an aggressive bird may be necessary. Expecting a few nasty bites as you become 'familiar' with each other is also a risk you have to be willing to take. Understanding the body language of any amazon is essential to preventing bites and some individuals may need to be handled on sticks or with gloves during the breeding season (though over time, you can hopefully implement measures to control hormones).

To be perfectly honest, our big, feisty male BFA scared the crap out of me when we got him (after growing up with parrots and being more than comfortable around bigger birds, especially zons). He had it out for me from the second we got him home and it took some real 'overcoming my fears', a few nasty bites and some serious patience to coax the nice boy out of him. He was older and not tame. It would have been very easy to give up on him and rehome him again. I remained dedicated to keeping him, found working with him a rewarding experience overall and absolutely adore him! There was in fact a nice bird deep down there somewhere Coming up on his 6th 'adoption day' soon, and he is not the same bird we brought home! I think any bird can be tamed personally, but it can take serious effort and total dedication to keeping the bird.

 

[Birdman666]

Well, there is a whole different way of approaching a wild bird. Their instincts are different. They are more defensive and more on edge. And you actually have to make an effort to do the exercises to tame them down first. It isn't go directly to step up practice...

A wild/ferral bird will never in a million years let you walk up to it and get close enough to step up. So the behavior mods with these guys start with the base level of desensitization and then goes through stepping up and touching. There is a lot to it... This is generally a months long project, where things move along in baby steps.

Believe it or not though, the tame birds actually bite harder, in my opinion. (A wild bird doesn't know whether or not you're going to kill it for biting you. And usually only fires a warning shot across your bow. A tame bird just gets mad and lets you have it, without regard to bite pressure, unless trained to control bite pressure. You're more likely to be injured by a pissed off/territorial tame bird.) Wild birds just dive bomb you to drive you off...

Tame birds do - pretty much what that violin guy got... remember that one?! Get that thing away from me, or I will rip your lips off!!!

 

[CFellows]

Ok all you amazon people out there, I need your help. I know a lady who wants me to take her Amazon. She is in a tough spot and can no longer keep him. He is around 20 years old and never been handled. She rescued him from a breeder, who no longer wanted him after his mate died. The lady said the bird will take treats from her hand and is very sweet. I have never been around amazons, so i would like to know what you guys think? Would it be possable to tame and train him at this age. Do you think he would get along with my Conure(both adult males)? Any advice would be great, thank you. +=?

This bird is not tame. If you take it, don't expect it to ever become tame. You can try, and there are ways to do it, but don't count on it happening. It is possible, and yes, I've done it. How difficult it is depends on the bird. My "rule of thumb" on breeder birds that have never been handled is to treat them from the get go as wild birds that are not now, and have never been tame. You are starting from scratch, quite possibly with a bird that does not wish to be handled. That is what you are taking on. This bird may not be, and may never be pet quality.

Do you know the taming and training protocols for taming down wild birds? This is old school here... there was a time when all there was were wild birds... go back to the old school on this one.

As for your conure: Big bird little bird, little bird ALWAYS loses. And Amazons can be quite territorial. So, if the zon is aggressive, that might not be such a great fit for your conure. If the zon is a perch potato, it might not matter at all... Mine were socialized together and they got along, but my birds were tame, and I did not permit big birds to become bullies.

The aggressor was knocked off the playstand to the floor. Whether the conure was acting defensive and going after the Zon in a pre-emptive strike. (Stupid move, but they occasionally do that!) Or the big bird was tormenting the little bird. And I had separate playstands available to keep the big and little apart when they wanted to be.

So again, depends on the bird.

Thank you Birdman! This is exactly what I was woried about. My counure is flighted and out of his cage most of the day. I don't want to have to keep him locked up just so he does not go start something. From the sound of it the zon is more of a perch potato type. I have looked into taming a wild bird and I know it will not be fast or easy and might not work at all, but considering that he has to be rehomed I think I will meet with him and see how it feels, before I deside. I have plenty of time, and patients to put into him. If I do bring home the new zon I think I will put their cages in diferant rooms to start out.

 

[CFellows]

When I got Sassy I looked at it as I may NEVER get her to step up or come to me, but I knew I would give her a better life and give her attention and she would be happier than where she was. Now she steps up all the time, every time, and last night I got a pic of her kissing me, which I totally trust her to do now! However, she was at one time tame, just not with the previous owner who had her for 4 years. If you are willing to take the chance that he may never be a hands on bird, then go for it. I would!

As for the conure, they may never get along...or maybe they will. There's no way to know ahead of time. I don't think I will EVER be able to have Sassy and Cisco out together, based on Sassy's aggressive attitude whenever she's near Cisco's cage. However, I can have Cisco and Peanut out together (at least right now), and I expect to be able to eventually have Sassy and Peanut out together, based on Sassy's non-aggressive attitude when she's by Peanut's cage. As long as you are prepared to divide your time with them in case they can't be out together. Good luck and keep us updated.

Well said Dugnlee, I do know that at least the Amazon would have a happy healthy home here with us.

 

[CFellows]

To be perfectly honest, our big, feisty male BFA scared the crap out of me when we got him (after growing up with parrots and being more than comfortable around bigger birds, especially zons). He had it out for me from the second we got him home and it took some real 'overcoming my fears', a few nasty bites and some serious patience to coax the nice boy out of him. He was older and not tame. It would have been very easy to give up on him and rehome him again. I remained dedicated to keeping him, found working with him a rewarding experience overall and absolutely adore him! There was in fact a nice bird deep down there somewhere Coming up on his 6th 'adoption day' soon, and he is not the same bird we brought home! I think any bird can be tamed personally, but it can take serious effort and total dedication to keeping the bird.

This is about what I had in my mind. Something crazy and nerve racking at first, but with lots of time, something good could come of it. I could see how it would be very rewarding to see a bird like this make any progress, every little achevment would be so worth it.

 

[BlueFrontOwner]

This is my take on it.

If you are going to take the time to take in a bird who may very well be with you for many years then just get a bird you know will not have issues or get a baby bird.

It is not worth it to waste your time with a bird who may never be tame.

This may not come across right to everyone and may come across as selfish here but our lives as humans are short and precious and if we are going to take in a companion animal we might as well have the best we can.

I realized this when I wrote that my blue front amazon wanted too much head petting. Many people wrote that they wished they had that problem and their amazon wouldn't even let them pet their head.

I always think about that and the fact that many people have amazons who they can't even trust to shoulder the bird. They are missing so much in my opinion as it is very nice to shoulder my amazon while she sits on my shoulder for hours.

Why would you want to buy a amazon where there is a good chance you may never do this with?

I don't know, that is just my way of thinking.

 

[henpecked]

Maybe because they already have a pet bird and now want to help a less fortunate bird out. I realize this is not the OPs case. However i think we should make an effort to give older rehomes a chance. I have many who've gone on to make great pets. BTW i find wild caught amazons MUCH easier to tame than aggressive xpets.

 

[4dugnlee]

This is my take on it.

If you are going to take the time to take in a bird who may very well be with you for many years then just get a bird you know will not have issues or get a baby bird.

It is not worth it to waste your time with a bird who may never be tame.

This may not come across right to everyone and may come across as selfish here but our lives as humans are short and precious and if we are going to take in a companion animal we might as well have the best we can.

I realized this when I wrote that my blue front amazon wanted too much head petting. Many people wrote that they wished they had that problem and their amazon wouldn't even let them pet their head.

I always think about that and the fact that many people have amazons who they can't even trust to shoulder the bird. They are missing so much in my opinion as it is very nice to shoulder my amazon while she sits on my shoulder for hours.

Why would you want to buy a amazon where there is a good chance you may never do this with?

I don't know, that is just my way of thinking.

I get what you're saying...somewhat...and for some people. I was one of the people who said I wish I had the problem of my BFA wanting head scritches. Now she gives kisses and is "beginning" to be able to be on my shoulder. I trust her completely! (with me...) It is rewarding beyond belief to see her come around and trust me! I can't even describe the bond I have with her! Now, I love Cisco just as much, but I realize that anyone could have taken him home and been fine, as he was already tame. I consider Sassy and Peanut my "rescues", and it is different. Every little bit of achievement they have just makes me want to cry with happiness.

I didn't know if I would ever be able to hold Sassy (or Peanut), but I knew that even if I couldn't they are so beautiful and they deserved a better life than where they were...and that is what makes it worth it...for me. Sassy did a complete turnaround and Peanut is coming slowly.

Is Cisco easier?...absolutely...do I regret having to spend precious time with taming Sassy and Peanut?....not one single second!

So, I do get what you are saying, for some people, who do not want to have to worry about the "taming". Wanting to get a companion bird that is already tame and stable is great...they all need homes! But some, like me, prefer to save the bird, and appreciate the challenge. I do not consider it a waste of time at all.

It doesn't make either stance wrong...like I said, they all need homes!

 

[Kiwibird]

This is my take on it.

If you are going to take the time to take in a bird who may very well be with you for many years then just get a bird you know will not have issues or get a baby bird.

It is not worth it to waste your time with a bird who may never be tame.

This may not come across right to everyone and may come across as selfish here but our lives as humans are short and precious and if we are going to take in a companion animal we might as well have the best we can.

I realized this when I wrote that my blue front amazon wanted too much head petting. Many people wrote that they wished they had that problem and their amazon wouldn't even let them pet their head.

I always think about that and the fact that many people have amazons who they can't even trust to shoulder the bird. They are missing so much in my opinion as it is very nice to shoulder my amazon while she sits on my shoulder for hours.

Why would you want to buy a amazon where there is a good chance you may never do this with?

I don't know, that is just my way of thinking.

I think that for some people, being able to 'raise' a bird from a young age is their way of going about it and there's nothing inherently wrong with it. As you pointed out, you do tend to get more positive results quicker with young birds, but that does not mean you can't earn the love and trust of an older bird. I know that despite being difficult and aggressive at first, Kiwi is an AMAZING bird now and I think he understands what we took him out of and just how much we love him. He is just so happy with us, and so wants to be a part of EVERYTHING we do, yet remains independent enough to entertain himself for a while if we are trying to work on something where a bird would be distracting... I personally feel working with a bird who went from feral and vicious to sweet and friendly because WE put in the effort to have been an highly rewarding experience! While it would be nice, I don't *need* my bird to accept petting to be my ideal companion animal. I also don't *need* or particularly want a bird on my shoulder personally. I'm glad he learned to keep off so we can focus on other interactions. I really couldn't ask for a better bird than my touch-shy, no shoulder Kiwi and if I could go back in time and know everything about him that I know now before bringing him home, I would STILL adopt him again!