Respiratory Infection/Vitamin A deficiency

[moni.k]

Yesterday morning, Nalani had a massive sneeze attack (20 minutes of non-stop sneezing) with discharge coming out of her nostril. I quickly grabbed my phone and called my avian vet for an appointment. The earliest time they could squeeze me in, was today at 2pm. I thought that her nostrils could be irritated from the dry air, as I have had the heater on all throughout the day. So I went out, got a cool moisture humidifier and had it running all day/night until her vet visit. This helped dramatically and her sneezing lessened along with the discharge from her nostril.

During Nalani's exam, the first thing the vet noticed was that her mouth showed early signs of vitamin A deficiency. Her breath sounds were slightly congested in her lungs and the vet believes Nalani's respiratory issue could either be a symptom of her nutritional deficiency, or an infection brought on by her suppressed immune system. Nalani was weighed at 363 grams, so her weight was not an issue.

I want to note, that she has always been given a variety of fruits and veggies (ie: apple, raspberry, blueberry, papaya, peach, kale, spinach, mango, chard, etc.) along with a soak/cook mix sold at my local bird store. However, the last 6-8 months I've noticed a lack of interest in her fresh food and she would wait until her cooked mix and evening seeds to munch away. I should have been more proactive and attentive to her picky eating, but I was distracted by the other factors going on in my life that I just shrugged it off (BAD idea...).​

Treatment: the vet flushed her nostril and sent the mucus chunks to the lab for analysis. She was also given an IM (intramuscular) injection of vitamin A/D/E and sent home with a broad spectrum antibiotic along with HEALx Booster (vitamin supplement made by Harrison's Bird food). Depending on what the lab results are, her antibiotic may or may not be discontinued. Luckily, this was caught in the early stages, so the vet believes she'll make a full recovery. However, if her condition worsens and there are signs of labored breathing and lethargy, Nalani will have to be hospitalized with a full avian blood panel and x-ray to determine if there are deeper underlying issues with her health.

*Here is a list of treatment and cost... this should NOT be used as a reference - every treatment/cost varies from different vets, location, etc. However, I'm listing it here for people to have an idea of what the costs could rack up to if you are in a similar situation. (this is in USD)

Office Exam - Avian/Exotic: 58.00
Avian - Flush Nostrils: 17.70
Aerobic C&S - Antech: 210.91
Collection fee - Culture: 6.10
Injection - I.M. (vitamin A/D/E): 40.52
Oral antibiotic - 30.50
HEALx Booster - 25.35

Total plus tax on the booster amounted to $391.36

So far, Nalani has taken her antibiotics and vitamin supplement with stride. I cooked some sweet potato (high in beta carotene - a precursor to vitamin A) with quinoa for her evening dinner and put her to bed with some Harrison's adult lifetime fine pellets (have them already at home because of my GCC).

My vet told me a very interesting fact: out of all the eclectus she has examined/treated in her career, she has rarely to never come across one with an issue of vitamin toxicity (too much vitamins). Though eclectus are more sensitive to the absorption of vitamins, picky eaters like Nalani, are often the usual patients she sees - vitamin deficient. So a slow, but definite transition from seeds to pellets and extra attention to fruits/veggies is key for any eclectus owners out there. By supplementing pellets instead of seeds in the evening (NOTE: this should only makeup 10-20% of their diet), they can get the additional nutrients that they may have missed during the day. So try to cut the seeds out of their diet completely - lesson hard learned!

I feel terrible that Nalani is suffering due to my lack of awareness. When she first showed signs of picky eating, I should have made more effort to encourage better eating habits. I hope that my oversight can be a lesson for the other parronts out there. Sometimes admitting and accepting mistakes can be hard, but it's the first step to change. I will keep you posted on her road to recovery.

 

[Doublete]

You did notice though and she's being treated accordingly

Although I think your example and experience is why I know I can't care for an eclectus. My little flock and I do just fine.

All my best to you and your girl!

 

[angie_robyn]

Don't beat yourself up. I agree with Doublete, you did notice something wrong and you did seek treatment. It's really something that could happen to any of us and even the best of us.


Yes vet treatments can add up! My brother is overseas and I had to rush his rabbit to the vet yesterday. Rafiki was in boarding and the boarder noticed him collapsed in his cage in the morning, so I rushed to pick him up, and took him to my avian vet, as they also treat rabbits. His regular vet was a bit too far. Anyway he is still in hospital and probably will be for a couple more days with a condition called 'floppy rabbit syndrome' believe it or not. The bill, which is on me until my bro gets back is so far $330. They had to anaesthetise him and do X-rays to rule out spinal injury. Plus there will be extra costs of whatever treatments they decide to do in the next couple of days and whatever take home medication he requires. Eek! At least I know my brother will remember this if we have to go away and he looks after my birds!

Anyway, I hope Nalani gets better soon!

 

[Flboy]

You did good, hindsight is always 2020..

 

[Anansi]

I'm so glad it was caught early! And to echo everyone else here, you really shouldn't beat yourself up. You acted as soon as you saw something was wrong, and now it's a lesson learned.

A few things, though. Seeds need not be completely eliminated from an ekkie's diet. Seeds are not inherently bad. Rather, it's the overuse of seeds that can be a problem.

For Maya and Jolly, I only allow a spoonful (what's that spoon between the sizes of a teaspoon and tablespoon? But basically 1.5 teaspoons) of seeds per day. This is always given AFTER they have finished off their evening meal to ensure that the full complement of the far more important fruits and veggies has been eaten.

Basically, seeds only make up between 3 and 5% of their diet. It's when seeds become a significant portion of their everyday diets that we run into problems. But in moderation, remember that seeds do have nutritional value.

Also, while your vet may not have come across too many issues of vitamin toxicity, that doesn't change the fact that it is an issue that affects quite a few eclectus parrots. That said, however, vitamin deficiency is also a dangerous issue that affects a significant number of our ekkies.

I've always maintained that an ekkie's complete dietary needs can be covered with a sufficiently varied fresh food diet. But as Moni.k has discovered with Nalani, this can be more difficult if your ekkie is a particularly picky eater.

I personally handle this by taking a few steps. For one, I don't free feed my ekkies. I don't have a problem with free feeding in general. I actually used to free feed my cockatiel. But for ekkies and their specific dietary needs, I do not. Instead, I give them 2 big meals of fresh fruits, veggies, sprouts, legumes, flowers, herbs, oats and grains (along with bee pollen, here and there). One meal in the morning, and one in the evening. In between they get training treats or foraging treats (usually pieces of nuts), but not enough to spoil their appetite for dinner.

In addition to this, I pay special attention to their likes and dislikes. And I use this knowledge to trick them into eating everything they're supposed to. For instance, neither of my ekkies is fond of either dandelions or carrots. Smh. This, of course, is unacceptable. Those two, along with sprouts, are nutritional juggernauts that cannot be ignored. Carrots for the beta carotene content, and dandelion also for the beta carotene, as well as calcium and more. So I grate the carrots into slivers and chop the dandelion into little pieces and mix them in with foods that they find irresistible. Like pomegranates, nearly any cooked legume, mixed in with oatmeal, etc.

Sometimes you'll have a miss with a particular combination. That's okay. Just note it and avoid said combo in the future.

All this said, however, I'm not railing against the use of pellets as a small percentage of the diet as your vet has suggested. I used to feed Bixby and Maya (before Jolly came to my home) 10 Harrison's Adult Coarse pellets per day. 5 in the morning, 5 in the evening. (This might seem rather small to you, Moni.k, but keep in mind that the Coarse style pellets are significantly larger than the Fine. If I'm remembering correctly, Fine looked like little granules.) I saw it as a bit of a top up measure, in case anything was missed with their fresh foods. But once I found that I was able to give them a complete diet without the pellets, I stopped.

But there were no ill effects with that small percentage of pellets at all.

Please keep us updated on Nalani's health. I'm hoping she makes a swift recovery.

 

[chris-md]

You're doing wonderfully moni.k. I'm glad nalani is doing better and getting the help she needs, great job catching it all!

The diet really is a funky thing with these birds, isn't it?

 

[moni.k]

Thanks for the support!!! Nalani's been amazing with her antibiotics and vitamin supplement, I think she may actually like the taste. But transitioning her to fresh fruit is proving to be much more of a challenge than I expected. I don't want to starve her and take seeds completely out of her diet all at once, so I'll take the advice and feed her in portions. Meal in the morning, meal in the evening and in between a little bit of seeds mixed with pellets. That's the only game plan I can think of to try and curb her VERY picky eating.

 

[chris-md]

You might also try melting some coconut oil and letting her watch you drizzle it on her food. That's my secret to getting Parker to try most stuff. He'll eat almost anything with coconut oil on it. I've also introduced walnut oil as well (rich in omega 3s, supposedly good to help maintain skin hydration). That works pretty well too.

Also try serving it in different ways. Won't eat a carrot slices? Try the matchsticks. Chucks the broccoli chunks? Chop it up really finely.

Play with food temp too. Warmed, cool, big chunks, chopped in a food processor...many different ways to play it.

 

[moni.k]

You might also try melting some coconut oil and letting her watch you drizzle it on her food. That's my secret to getting Parker to try most stuff. He'll eat almost anything with coconut oil on it. I've also introduced walnut oil as well (rich in omega 3s, supposedly good to help maintain skin hydration). That works pretty well too.

I never thought about adding coconut oil! That actually might work. She's been eating the healx booster without any issue and I know that contains palm oil (feel terrible about the orangutan situation whenever I think of palm oil... but I digress).

Unfortunately, today wasn't much of a success. She barely touch her fresh chopped mix and her cooked veggies/sweet potato mix. I had to resort to giving her some seeds to hold her over. Her stool was runny with a lot of water and not a lot of fecal matter, which is indicating that she isn't getting much food in her system. Trying to find the right balance of getting her to try new things, but wean her off of seeds without dramatic weight loss. Not trying to be too forceful with her current condition.

Because of her nutritional deficiencies, I was considering giving her some hand-feeding formula. Just as a small supplement to go along with her fresh/cook mix. That way she'll at least get some food and nutrition in her system while she's battling her infection. What do you guys think? - any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

JUVENILE HAND-FEEDING FORMULA-Harrison's Bird Foods

 

[Eitak579]

Right after adopting Johnny I brought him in for a checkup, his previous owners had him eating primarily nutriberries and seeds. He was diagnosed with Vitamin A deficiency so we were off to a bad start there. Needless to say the nutriberries and seeds he came with became squirrel food and he started off here on an all fresh diet. Pickiest bird ever! It is VERY difficult to get him to eat your typical Vitamin A dense foods (though I thank you all for so many creative suggestions, many have worked). One thing he will do flips over is Gogi Berries (link below), they're packed with Vitamin A and other nutrients. A bit pricey but I mix them in with other foods and use them as treats. Just a suggestion that has helped us immensely. Good luck!

[ame=http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BPX4OPS?keywords=gogi%20berry&qid=1454259267&ref_=sr_1_3&sr=8-3]Robot Check[/ame]

 

[chris-md]

Right after adopting Johnny I brought him in for a checkup, his previous owners had him eating primarily nutriberries and seeds. He was diagnosed with Vitamin A deficiency so we were off to a bad start there. Needless to say the nutriberries and seeds he came with became squirrel food and he started off here on an all fresh diet. Pickiest bird ever! It is VERY difficult to get him to eat your typical Vitamin A dense foods (though I thank you all for so many creative suggestions, many have worked). One thing he will do flips over is Gogi Berries (link below), they're packed with Vitamin A and other nutrients. A bit pricey but I mix them in with other foods and use them as treats. Just a suggestion that has helped us immensely. Good luck!

Robot Check

Too funny! Parker wouldn't touch goji berries with a 6" feather! Fortunately, sweet red and orange peppers are also rich in vitamin A, and he devours those. Especially when they are stuffed with things

 

[Eitak579]

Agreed on the peppers, sweet peppers are the ONLY veggie he actually gets excited about, I have to sneak everything else in :20:

 

[moni.k]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I don't recall giving Goji berries a try in the past, so I'll have to stop by my local Trader Joe's or Sprouts and pick some up. If she doesn't eat them, I certainly will!!

Nalani USED to be a fan of sweet peppers. She liked them sliced into thin sticks, but she hasn't shown much interest this time around. Hmm, maybe I'll try putting them into an empty toilet paper roll... She LOVES playing and shredding up used toilet rolls.

On a different note:
I found a white bump on the side of Nalani's tongue today while I was syringe feeding her medication. Internet sources are saying it could be a virus, bacterial, yeast infection or vitamin A deficiency... OR possibly an abscess. I know she's vitamin deficient, but could this also be a result from her respiratory infection?

My vet is closed today, so I can't call and ask for advice. She's been eating a little more today... gave her some bananas (her favorite) with her fresh chopped mix. We cuddled and played tug-a-war all morning and she showed no signs of distress or discomfort. I'm wondering if it will go away (if it is infection related) because of her antibiotics. But I'm also wondering if the vet has to aspirate it, if it is an abscess. I'm totally stumped!

Has anyone dealt with or heard of a similar situation?

Ugh, poor baby... I feel like once I find one issue, it's followed by a cascade of more problems. I'm relieved she hasn't showed any decrease in energy or change in personality, but poor girl just can't get a break!

 

[chris-md]

L if I were you I would not be concerned. My approach here would be to assume that it's merely a symptom of A condition you already know you have and are working to correct.

 

[moni.k]

L if I were you I would not be concerned. My approach here would be to assume that it's merely a symptom of A condition you already know you have and are working to correct.

Yea, she doesn't seem to be in any noticeable pain... which is a relief. I'll still give the vet a call tomorrow. I wish I knew more about avian medicine, feel like I'm shooting blind each time a new symptom occurs.

 

[chris-md]

It's not so much about knowing about medicine as it is just putting two and two together. You have a confirmed case of vitamin a deficiency, and by your own research this is often a symptom of it.

It's exactly like beings diagnosed with a cold based on sneezing, only to develop a cough the day after your diagnosis. Even if you didn't know a cough is a symptom of a cold, a Google search shows it is, and confirms what you already knew. The cold, whatever form it may take, will go away with proper care.

This too shall pass