After extensive tests over the past 5 years it is finally determined that my congo has epilepsy. Marvin had 2 years of seizures no more than 1 per month. Then it stopped for 2 years and I thought that it was caused from the sponges that I used to clean the water bowl. Then they started again. My avian vet ( who is awesome - DR. Kilgore ) has run every test possible and then referred me to Angell in boston to see Dr. Orcutt DVM, ABVP. She concluded that she felt that he had epilepsy also. The only other test to run was a cat scan, but she felt that it would not yeild any results. She is also treating 1 other congo for the same thing. That bird was seizuring daily. Marvin is now 2 to 4 times per month. So... I have just started him on meds and we will see how it goes. If anyone else has a seizuring congo ( if not caused from a lack of calcium ) I would be interested to hear about your bird.
Seizuring African Grey
- Thread starter L Greer
- Start date
- Status
- Dec 17, 2009
- 209
- 0
- Parrots
- Military's, African Greys, Blue and Gold, Goffin, conures, quaker, lovebird, senegal parrot
In all of the rescues and my own personal birds, I have never had the seizure problem, thank goodness, but I am curious as to did they put him on phenobarb and do they want to check bloodwork every 6 months like in other animals? Good luck!
They gave a parrot a cat scan? What were the results... nope, not a cat!
Sorry, couldn't resist that one. Had to beat BlueToast to it.
I don't have any experience with seizures in birds, but it sounds like he's in good hands. Many of the relevant meds take some time to work properly, and it may take time to find the right doses for Marvin. Stick with it and keep your vets informed of any changes (or lack thereof).
Sorry, couldn't resist that one. Had to beat BlueToast to it.
I don't have any experience with seizures in birds, but it sounds like he's in good hands. Many of the relevant meds take some time to work properly, and it may take time to find the right doses for Marvin. Stick with it and keep your vets informed of any changes (or lack thereof).
You sure have done all the right things. I have done extensive reading about seizure activity and other than stress or calcium deficiency there was no mention of epilepsy in birds. Safety would of course be a primary concern for the bird. Do you have to alter the cage environment? Please keep us posted.
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #5
They put him on levetiracetam with a common name of Keppra. They don't use phenobarb in birds it seems. I have ruled out everything from the food... to his cage. The vet does not believe that it is caused from environmental issues. We bought a new house and moved during the time period, so I know that it wasn't even the other house. The bird room is close to our bedroom... so I always hear him if he has an attack. It is funny the things that wake you up out a sound sleep. I am a sound sleeper, but I have always heard him. I think that I will get a baby monitor just incase. If he has an attack I have him sleep in his travel cage on my nightstand. I have some of his brothers and sisters... different clutches and they are all fine. I will keep looking for answers thanks for your thoughts.
There is a good article on birds with seizures on the Winged Wisdom site. Hope it helps.
- Dec 17, 2009
- 209
- 0
- Parrots
- Military's, African Greys, Blue and Gold, Goffin, conures, quaker, lovebird, senegal parrot
I was wondering about the Phenobarb and birds. I know they are using Keppra as a secondary with Phenobarb in dogs now. Seizure activity can be caused by so many things. I wish you the best of luck.
Hi L Greer
Read through all the above posts, how dreadful for poor Marvin.
Wish I could assist, all above posts seem to have covered it.
Sounds like you are doing a fantastic job, caring for Marvin.
Praying the seizures stop altogether.
Let us know who Marvin is doing.
Take care
Read through all the above posts, how dreadful for poor Marvin.
Wish I could assist, all above posts seem to have covered it.
Sounds like you are doing a fantastic job, caring for Marvin.
Praying the seizures stop altogether.
Let us know who Marvin is doing.
Take care
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #10
Well Marvin was on the med for 4 days and last night he had his first seizure since being on the med. I did ask the Vet to start him at a lower dose.... so there is plenty of room to increase. I was just hoping that I could decrease it... not increase it. But it looks like an increase is in his future.
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #11
I did find this interesting article written by a dvm... see below
*This article does talk about phenobarb but I think it references it due to keppra was either not around or not used in birds yet.
Seizures in African Grey Parrots
African Grey parrots are known to have problems with seizures, most commonly related to hypocalcemia. Do not rule out hypocalcemia problems based on one blood test showing a calcium level in the normal range. Calcium levels dip and rise according to circadian rhythm. Normal calcium levels for psittacines range from 8.0-13.0 mg/dl. Running an ionized calcium level may be diagnostic; however reference ranges for the different species are not yet established or published for many species.
If a grey is feather picking, or is clumsy, or has had a seizure, try treating with calcium in the drinking water (Neo-CalgluconTM Sanzoz, calcium glubionate 23 mg/30 ml drinking water or 23 mg/kg PO q24h), supplementing with TumsTM (calcium carbonate) and having the owner offer more high calcium food (cottage cheese, cheese, yogurt and almonds).
Often, however, calcium supplementation is not enough to control seizures in greys, and this is because there are several factors that control calcium homeostasis, including the uropygial gland, vitamin D3 levels, possible concurrent hypovitaminosis A, ultraviolet light exposure, secretions from the parathyroid glands and secretions from the ultimobranchial glands
For seizuring grey patients, ensure that the uropygial gland is functioning properly. Examination of the uropygial gland should be a routine part of every feather-picking and seizuring bird's physical examination. Test this by gently rolling the wick through your fingers, and then checking your fingers for a greasy spot). If no secretion is seen, then gently massage the gland (bilobed, heart-shaped) and then check the wick again. The normal uropygial gland produces vitamin D3 precursors that are preened onto the feathers. Upon exposure to ultraviolet light (particularly UVB), the precursors will be converted to active D3, which will then be ingested when the bird preens again. So, if an African Grey is suffering from seizures, always check the uropygial gland and make sure that it is producing a secretion.
Some birds with hypovitaminosis A will have squamous metaplasia of the uropygial gland, and it will not be functioning properly. Those birds should receive a supplement of beta-carotene to correct the squamous metaplasia. Beta-carotene capsules can be purchased at any pharmacy. It is provided in a capsule containing a red liquid. A hole can be poked in the end of the capsule, and the bird may then be given a drop orally twice per week, or as indicated. Since beta-carotene is converted to active vitamin A, and the rest will be excreted unchanged, it is very safe and non-toxic. Supplementation with vitamin A can result in overdose, which can be dangerous, even life-threatening. Red palm oil is another source of beta-carotene. Other birds may have plucked out the wick feathers, making extraction of the secretion difficult or impossible.
For activation of the uropygial gland secretion, a bird needs exposure to natural, unfiltered sunlight (not through glass or plastic) or exposure to a full-spectrum fluorescent light (changed regularly as recommended by the manufacturer and placed within 18 inches of the cage). While formulated diets should contain adequate amounts of vitamin D3, any birds, especially greys, with calcium problems should always have the uropygial gland evaluated, and it should be recommended that they receive some sunlight or full-spectrum artificial lighting. Some species of psittacines do not possess an uropygial gland (including Amazon parrots, hyacinth macaws) and emus, ostriches, cassowaries, bustards, frogmouths, many pigeons and woodpeckers do not possess one, either.
It has been observed that African Greys living outdoors (and exposed to natural sunlight) rarely suffer from seizures, so it seems clear that the interrelation between the uropygial gland, ultraviolet light and vitamin D3 are responsible for normal calcium homeostasis in the African Grey parrots, and most likely in other African species.
Instead of initially treating the seizures with an anticonvulsant, I recommend using a nutritional supplement called DMG (dimethylglycine). This supplement works by providing a methyl group, which acts in a similar manner as an antioxidant, however, DMG does so much more. It increases the threshold for seizures, and acts to provide many benefits to avian and exotic patients. It is available from Vetri-Science Lab, phone: 800-882-9993. Because it provides support for the nervous system, I have found it to be a valuable adjunct to therapy for many diseases, including PDD in birds, and E. cuniculi in rabbits. While some seizuring animals may still require anticonvulsant therapy, the dosage may be lower due to the positive effects of the DMG on the brain and CNS.
At this time, there are no reference values published for avian species for phenobarbital levels in avian species. Using DMG will most likely lessen the dosage of anticonvulsants needed, and may even preclude their use, which is much safer for avian and exotic patients.
*This article does talk about phenobarb but I think it references it due to keppra was either not around or not used in birds yet.
Seizures in African Grey Parrots
African Grey parrots are known to have problems with seizures, most commonly related to hypocalcemia. Do not rule out hypocalcemia problems based on one blood test showing a calcium level in the normal range. Calcium levels dip and rise according to circadian rhythm. Normal calcium levels for psittacines range from 8.0-13.0 mg/dl. Running an ionized calcium level may be diagnostic; however reference ranges for the different species are not yet established or published for many species.
If a grey is feather picking, or is clumsy, or has had a seizure, try treating with calcium in the drinking water (Neo-CalgluconTM Sanzoz, calcium glubionate 23 mg/30 ml drinking water or 23 mg/kg PO q24h), supplementing with TumsTM (calcium carbonate) and having the owner offer more high calcium food (cottage cheese, cheese, yogurt and almonds).
Often, however, calcium supplementation is not enough to control seizures in greys, and this is because there are several factors that control calcium homeostasis, including the uropygial gland, vitamin D3 levels, possible concurrent hypovitaminosis A, ultraviolet light exposure, secretions from the parathyroid glands and secretions from the ultimobranchial glands
For seizuring grey patients, ensure that the uropygial gland is functioning properly. Examination of the uropygial gland should be a routine part of every feather-picking and seizuring bird's physical examination. Test this by gently rolling the wick through your fingers, and then checking your fingers for a greasy spot). If no secretion is seen, then gently massage the gland (bilobed, heart-shaped) and then check the wick again. The normal uropygial gland produces vitamin D3 precursors that are preened onto the feathers. Upon exposure to ultraviolet light (particularly UVB), the precursors will be converted to active D3, which will then be ingested when the bird preens again. So, if an African Grey is suffering from seizures, always check the uropygial gland and make sure that it is producing a secretion.
Some birds with hypovitaminosis A will have squamous metaplasia of the uropygial gland, and it will not be functioning properly. Those birds should receive a supplement of beta-carotene to correct the squamous metaplasia. Beta-carotene capsules can be purchased at any pharmacy. It is provided in a capsule containing a red liquid. A hole can be poked in the end of the capsule, and the bird may then be given a drop orally twice per week, or as indicated. Since beta-carotene is converted to active vitamin A, and the rest will be excreted unchanged, it is very safe and non-toxic. Supplementation with vitamin A can result in overdose, which can be dangerous, even life-threatening. Red palm oil is another source of beta-carotene. Other birds may have plucked out the wick feathers, making extraction of the secretion difficult or impossible.
For activation of the uropygial gland secretion, a bird needs exposure to natural, unfiltered sunlight (not through glass or plastic) or exposure to a full-spectrum fluorescent light (changed regularly as recommended by the manufacturer and placed within 18 inches of the cage). While formulated diets should contain adequate amounts of vitamin D3, any birds, especially greys, with calcium problems should always have the uropygial gland evaluated, and it should be recommended that they receive some sunlight or full-spectrum artificial lighting. Some species of psittacines do not possess an uropygial gland (including Amazon parrots, hyacinth macaws) and emus, ostriches, cassowaries, bustards, frogmouths, many pigeons and woodpeckers do not possess one, either.
It has been observed that African Greys living outdoors (and exposed to natural sunlight) rarely suffer from seizures, so it seems clear that the interrelation between the uropygial gland, ultraviolet light and vitamin D3 are responsible for normal calcium homeostasis in the African Grey parrots, and most likely in other African species.
Instead of initially treating the seizures with an anticonvulsant, I recommend using a nutritional supplement called DMG (dimethylglycine). This supplement works by providing a methyl group, which acts in a similar manner as an antioxidant, however, DMG does so much more. It increases the threshold for seizures, and acts to provide many benefits to avian and exotic patients. It is available from Vetri-Science Lab, phone: 800-882-9993. Because it provides support for the nervous system, I have found it to be a valuable adjunct to therapy for many diseases, including PDD in birds, and E. cuniculi in rabbits. While some seizuring animals may still require anticonvulsant therapy, the dosage may be lower due to the positive effects of the DMG on the brain and CNS.
At this time, there are no reference values published for avian species for phenobarbital levels in avian species. Using DMG will most likely lessen the dosage of anticonvulsants needed, and may even preclude their use, which is much safer for avian and exotic patients.
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #12
Still having some seizures and everything still checks out. They are less intense since he has been on the Keppra. The vet just increased his dose so we will see how that goes. My DVM checked his uropygial gland and that is fine also. May go to boston and do an Ionized calcuim on him but both vets feel that his calcium is good. It is the only test that I have not run. Seizures seem to be late at night or early in the morning. Added Necton S to his diet and the herb salad. He does not bother with it much. Next step I will be looking into DMG - dimethylglycine. I discussed it with my vet and she said that it would not hurt to try it.
parrotqueen
New member
Please, keep us all updated. I'd like to know how this turns out!
Hope all goes well, and your little guy starts feeling better soon.
Hope all goes well, and your little guy starts feeling better soon.
Hope the seizures stop altogether.
Praying a solution is found
Keep us updated
Praying a solution is found
Keep us updated
Greetings! Found this message thread looking for information on seizures in African Greys. We too have an african grey (Bibi) who has seizures at night. Never has she had a seizure while awake in the middle of the day. She has been to three different avian vets and calcium deficiency has been ruled out. Our vets have had her on Potasium Bromide and DMG. Unfortunately she still is having seizures 2-3 times a month or so... at times she will have them several days in a row. I wanted to find out how Marvin was doing on Keppra and if you have been able to control the seizures. Have there been any adverse effects or behavior changes after being on the medication?
Bibi does have a webcam if you are curious. You can see her live most days between 9am and 8pm central at BibiSteps.com.
Bibi does have a webcam if you are curious. You can see her live most days between 9am and 8pm central at BibiSteps.com.
oled
New member
So sad but with you he can have good life
Beebs
New member
- Jul 30, 2013
- 1
- 0
- Parrots
-
7 year-old Congo African Grey.
10-ish year-old Congo African Grey (rehomed).
I wanted to check in to see how Marvin is doing. Also, what is the dosage of Keppra? We are just now starting Bibi on keppra.
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