Amazon - possible fractured femur

Providers come in all forms. I have seen good chiropractors. Especially for individuals who individuals who don't want invasive treatments. I wonder why that one was intimidated. They have to undergo around 7 years of education and pass state exam. So a reason should have been easily given.
 
I'm the go to person in my family for all things medical. What I don't already know I will research and learn. I never give information without being sure I know what I'm talking about. They trust me.
I myself cant. I had a family member who told me they had gerd, and severe issues. She told me she was on the best medications to date. She had an upper endoscopy, and it came back with nothing. No scar tissue on the throat, no thrust on tongue, no fatty liver disease. There was nothing found. So she moved on to chest pains. She said her heart rate was up. She went into the ER, they did an EKG which more nothing was found. They had her wear a heart monitor, and thoroughly evaluated the situation. I knew from the beginning that it was anxiety, and her being premenopausal. I tried to explain the entire situation, and that surgeons aren’t mean but they cannot perform surgery when nothing is found. It’s a huge liability. She hates that surgeon, and nothing I can say will make it better. She already told family members she was having surgery because she was meeting with a surgeon, and it was documented as possible heart issues but more than likely anxiety. Everyone went for the worst case scenario besides me.
 
Providers come in all forms. I have seen good chiropractors. Especially for individuals who individuals who don't want invasive treatments. I wonder why that one was intimidated. They have to undergo around 7 years of education and pass state exam. So a reason should have been easily given.
Theres nothing objective about a chiropractor. It’s pseudoscience. I don’t agree with the practice myself but will respect if something thinks it’s helping them.
 
It helps if the people you're dealing with are not having psych issues. I wouldn't even try to talk medical sense with someone with issues that prevent them from seeing reality.
 
This is all very interesting but let's get back to Geslina and poor Max with the fractured femur. We all want Max to recover. Broken bones happen to birds in the wild, and even if their injuries doesn't cause fatal internal bleeding or infection, injured birds usually succumb because they are at least temporarily disabled from finding food and keeping themselves safe from predators. We provide our injured birds with plentiful nutritious food and ensure their safety during the healing process and after if their bodies don't function quite as well as they used to. Maybe they limp. Maybe they can't fly anymore. But they can still lead happy lives with their humans. If Max has so far survived his fracture and he's still eating, drinking and pooping, all he may need now is good nutrition and a safe place to rest and heal. Give him a habitat that minimizes climbing, which would put stress on his healing femur, and provide low perches and a cushioned floor so he can't fall and reinjure himself. That and lots of love and attention.
 
I ran home from work at 8:30p to check on him and he was up on the food bowl holder thing again. I have to switch cages, or get one of those acrylic boxes, he is determined to perch.

Before work I had put some of his favorite foods in the cage, along with some nutriberries, and as of 8:30p, he didn’t eat any of it. Not even the pistachios. So I put some peanut butter on wheat bread, he loves that, but when I got home from work, it didn’t look like he did more than just move it around. I heated up some spaghetti and cut up a green apple and he did wind up eating a little of both…so I was at least able to give him some of the tramadol and the inflammatory med, both of which say he needs to take with food.

I am going to call my vet in the morning. She isn’t an avian vet, but she has parrots herself…see what she says. Then I am going to call Penn Vets in Philadelphia, part of the Pennsylvania University veterinary school, and supposedly the best place around.

I did not know the femur was in the pelvis. That is scary. And I don’t remember if the vet told me what kind of a fracture it is, and the paperwork only says ā€œsignificant,ā€ not sure exactly what that means. In 31 years, I have never seen him fall, until yesterday, which was after I noticed he was injured. Could he have just had a minor injury, causing him to not want to bear weight on that foot, and then that caused him to fall yesterday, causing the fracture, right in front of me? As for not doing anything, just giving him time to heal..that sounds so appealing. He is still able to move around well, and even uses that foot, tonight he picked up a piece of apple with it…I just don’t know what the downside of doing that will be. Sure there is one.
This is all very interesting but let's get back to Geslina and poor Max with the fractured femur. We all want Max to recover. Broken bones happen to birds in the wild, and even if their injuries doesn't cause fatal internal bleeding or infection, injured birds usually succumb because they are at least temporarily disabled from finding food and keeping themselves safe from predators. We provide our injured birds with plentiful nutritious food and ensure their safety during the healing process and after if their bodies don't function quite as well as they used to. Maybe they limp. Maybe they can't fly anymore. But they can still lead happy lives with their humans. If Max has so far survived his fracture and he's still eating, drinking and pooping, all he may need now is good nutrition and a safe place to rest and heal. Give him a habitat that minimizes climbing, which would put stress on his healing femur, and provide low perches and a cushioned floor so he can't fall and reinjure himself. That and lots of love and attention.
Funny you say that, I was just thinking about wild birds this morning, what happens when they break a bone. You are right, it is probably a death sentence. Though I see geese and ducks sometimes with missing feet…probably snapping turtles to blame…and they seem to do ok.

Max isn’t eating that great, but he is eating. I think even with the Tramadol every 8 hours, he is still very uncomfortable. I think I have to put his food in dishes that are up higher, it might be more painful for him to lean downwards. But he is vocal, moving around, wants my attention, has been preening this morning, and is chewing on one of his rubber Kong toys right now. I put some very lightweight shoeboxes on top of his cage bowl holders, they crammed in there perfectly, so he has stopped trying to climb up there and perch. I also moved his cage to where he can get more direct sunlight, if he wants it (there is also a shady part of cage) I was reading somewhere about sunlight and vitamin D synthesis and all that for bone healing.

I found a surgeon who has experience with avian fracture repair, even though I will have to drive over an hour. The place has a great reputation, they work on zoo animals and some wildlife cases too. The emergency place I took him to on Saturday, it’s also a regular animal hospital, and they have a lot of students and residents there, more of them than regular ā€œrealā€ vets. I was there for over 8 hours, spent $705, and never even saw a vet. Just got a couple minute phone call with the X-ray results. I don’t want a student doing this surgery. I know they have to learn somewhere, but let them learn on someone else’s bird. So, this other place called me back right away, they are going to get his records and xrays from the emergency vet today, and see what they think. If I go with the surgery, it will range $5000 - $7000. I am actually surprised it is that low!! Will probably be getting an appt tomorrow, and then will discuss all the options with the vet - letting it heal on its own, having surgery, or amputation. If I go with surgery, likely I will have to leave Max there, I am sure they will want to do the surgery right away. I asked the emergency vet on Saturday what he would do when he told me what my choices were, and he said that if money was no object, he would do the surgery, that it was his best chance of returning to normal, or at least close to normal. I don’t want Max to be lame. I don’t want him disabled and not be able to do all the things he loves to do. If that happens, then of course I will deal with it….but it will break my heart. It is just so hard to know the right thing to do.

I really appreciate everyone’s replies, and by the way, I beleive in chiropractors 100% 😊

Please keep us in your thoughts and prayers, we really need them right now.
 
Sorry to read. I'm hoping for the best. We humans tend to over think these things. Please keep us informed.
 
Im so sorry for your beautiful Amazon parrot. I can tell by your posts how much he means to you. That is an expensive surgery. Thank you for sharing. I don’t blame you for wanting an educated surgeon. One thing I’d emphasize on is if you are going through with a surgery to not wait too long. With my parrots broken wings it became a systemic issue because no one brought them to a vet. Now he has muscle loss, and things that would complicate the surgery. Not to mention the recovery more challenging.
 
Im so sorry for your beautiful Amazon parrot. I can tell by your posts how much he means to you. That is an expensive surgery. Thank you for sharing. I don’t blame you for wanting an educated surgeon. One thing I’d emphasize on is if you are going through with a surgery to not wait too long. With my parrots broken wings it became a systemic issue because no one brought them to a vet. Now he has muscle loss, and things that would complicate the surgery. Not to mention the recovery more challenging.
Thank you, and yes, he means a lot to me. I can’t imagine being without him. We have never been apart, since 1993, except for an occasional vacation I took. One good thing is he is a tough bird. I used to move all the time, lived in some crazy places, and he has always just rolled with the punches. He has been healthy and vigorous all his life. I read somewhere that wild caught birds tend to be this way, they have the DNA of healthy parents who survived to successfully breed in the wild, and then if the bird as a chick survives the extremely stressful import process, it often means you have a strong, genetically healthy bird. I am hoping he is strong enough to make it through all this. I worry because in spite of all those things, he will be scared to death at the vets, and there is nothing I can do to make that better for him. And yes, you are right, have to move fast, sounds like the vet I chose is going to get me in tomorrow and if surgery is what we decide, it will be scheduled right away.
 
I'd ask the vet show you the xray so you can see for yourself where the fracture is and whether the ends of the broken bone are lined up or displaced.
 
Thank you, and yes, he means a lot to me. I can’t imagine being without him. We have never been apart, since 1993, except for an occasional vacation I took. One good thing is he is a tough bird. I used to move all the time, lived in some crazy places, and he has always just rolled with the punches. He has been healthy and vigorous all his life. I read somewhere that wild caught birds tend to be this way, they have the DNA of healthy parents who survived to successfully breed in the wild, and then if the bird as a chick survives the extremely stressful import process, it often means you have a strong, genetically healthy bird. I am hoping he is strong enough to make it through all this. I worry because in spite of all those things, he will be scared to death at the vets, and there is nothing I can do to make that better for him. And yes, you are right, have to move fast, sounds like the vet I chose is going to get me in tomorrow and if surgery is what we decide, it will be scheduled right away.

@Geslina, you are doing everything humanly possible for Max, every companion parrot out there should be blessed to have a parront as loving as you are. It hits us so hard when they are unwell, and I pray that Max pulls through. šŸ™
 
I'd ask the vet show you the xray so you can see for yourself where the fracture is and whether the ends of the broken bone are lined up or displaced.
I talked to the office today, after they saw the X-rays. The price they quoted me for surgery this morning, $5000-$7000, went up. It’s now $7300-$9300. So I am thinking the fracture is more serious than the average fracture. (Or did the price go up because I so quickly agreed to the first price?) you are right, I definitely should be shown the X-ray, and have everything explained to me. Have an appt tomorrow 8:30AM (ugh, I usually don’t even get to bed until 5am.) They said that at 38, Max is considered a senior, and his physical condition will determine what we can do. Probably he will get bloodwork, and be examined. If surgery seems the best option, I will be taking him back on Thursday.

So, up early, long drive, and stressful day tomorrow!
 
I talked to the office today, after they saw the X-rays. The price they quoted me for surgery this morning, $5000-$7000, went up. It’s now $7300-$9300. So I am thinking the fracture is more serious than the average fracture. (Or did the price go up because I so quickly agreed to the first price?) you are right, I definitely should be shown the X-ray, and have everything explained to me. Have an appt tomorrow 8:30AM (ugh, I usually don’t even get to bed until 5am.) They said that at 38, Max is considered a senior, and his physical condition will determine what we can do. Probably he will get bloodwork, and be examined. If surgery seems the best option, I will be taking him back on Thursday.

So, up early, long drive, and stressful day tomorrow!
I'll be thinking of you and Max, @Geslina, I hope everything goes well!
 
I'd ask the vet show you the xray so you can see for yourself where the fracture is and whether the ends of the broken bone are lined up or displaced.
I do agree with this. I do things like this at many appointments that I personally have. Just make sure it’s to the surgeon themselves. They are less prone to be emotionally reactive, and generally if you tell them I just want to make sure I’m not going to have surgical complications they don’t want that either so they are much more understanding. I tend to hurt primary cares feelings. I get calls, and hate mail from administrators at health care facilities when I do these things in primary care.

I will keep your Amazon in my thoughts.
 
I hate my new primary care NP. She's a know it all who knows very little. I argue with her at every visit. My old NP I loved moved out of state and I got this stupid person. She doesn't like me much either.
 
I hate my new primary care NP. She's a know it all who knows very little. I argue with her at every visit. My old NP I loved moved out of state and I got this stupid person. She doesn't like me much either.
Im sorry you are having issues in primary care. They are behaviorists regardless of the initials behind their name. I dont argue with them because they dont understand what I’m arguing anyway. I did in the past, and I only found myself frustrated. Then I’d argue for a refund as I felt they werent comprehensive enough to ā€œmanageā€ health care anyway.
 
Geslina, where are you located? Those prices especially the second ones seem exorbitantly high. Plus major surgery on 38 yr old parrot.... I would get more opinions.
 
It's horrible how much these people think they should charge for surgery on a parrot that would take about an hour. Taking advantage of people who love their bird is cruel. And what if Max doesn't make it? Imagine being saddled with a vet bill like that!
 

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