birdtricks eclectus guide

[Skarila]

I've followed BirdTricks since 2010 and to be quite straightforward, I've never found myself aligning with much of what they say. Their training DVDs back then were just the two guys chatting for most of the DVD, with very quick example of clicker training. Then, Jamie got 4 conure chicks that, from my conure experience, should have still been spending most of their time in the incubator... but no, they were photo ops all throughout the house. ...one died of a bacterial infection. they also would pose the conure babies on their cat which is just SO BAD TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO DO.... because even the best cats can turn on a bird in a split second. A slight nail scratch from the bird, and the cat could turn around and bite it before it even knew what it did. Even scratches can be deadly because of the pasteurella. I am not saying they were bad people, but they were making their buck, and I just don't think they were the Gods that many people believed them to be.

Whoa, I didn't know that, I didn't follow them so much back (never really followed the channel, but would watch here an there)
Before I had 2 most docile cats I ever had the chance to meet and have. One was afraid of my IRN and would immediately leave the room and do her stuff. My other older cat just didn't care at all. He was always on ignore mode. Both of the cats had 0 hunting needs - I swear they snuggled with my pet mice, and once when one mouse escaped, they didn't even flinch when it ran past them. Heck, the younger cat loved that mouse, I still have a video somewhere of them snuggling. They were cats on drugs, I swear. But I was extremely young and oblivious of many things, thank God never anything happened to my bird with the cats, no injuries, nor illnesses. Only cat I'd trust having in the same house with parrots is a ragdoll for sure. Who is tested for Toxoplasmosis. Rest - Naw, hard pass. Don't think I get to see same docile cats as I had.

To get to the point of my reply, Toxoplasmosis is something that scares me. Many cats carry it, and even owners are probably infected by it but inhibiting with absolutely no symptoms, ever (VERY rare cases people actually get sick from it) However, this parasite is very much deadly for the birds. The idea of toxoplasmosis is to infect the rodent to change the behaviour, so the rodent gets rid of the fear of the cats, and the cats can catch the mice/rats without issues. In birds however, it's often fatal. There was one scientific article, I cannot remember which parrot it was (I think an amazon??) who somehow got infected by it and later on died, this was confirmed during the autopsy. Also raptors (birds of prey) are very much so successible to it as well. Worst part, the cat doesn't even need to get close to the bird - it's enough just for a bad hygiene in the house for the owner and bird to catch it. Cats are only the carriers of the parasites, so they never inhibit any symptoms.

Here's some good scientific articles on the stuff whoever is interested in it! Be careful, it's written in "nerd" language, can be hard to read and understand.

A review of toxoplasmosis in wild birds - PubMed

Toxoplasma gondii affects most species of warm-blooded animals, including birds. There is considerable confusion regarding the identity of T. gondii-like parasites and the diagnosis of toxoplasmosis in wild birds. In this review, T. gondii-like infections in different species of wild birds are...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Sorry for diverting the main topic :B Never hurts to learn something new!

 

[Skarila]

Whoa, I didn't know that, I didn't follow them so much back (never really followed the channel, but would watch here an there)
Before I had 2 most docile cats I ever had the chance to meet and have. One was afraid of my IRN and would immediately leave the room and do her stuff. My other older cat just didn't care at all. He was always on ignore mode. Both of the cats had 0 hunting needs - I swear they snuggled with my pet mice, and once when one mouse escaped, they didn't even flinch when it ran past them. Heck, the younger cat loved that mouse, I still have a video somewhere of them snuggling. They were cats on drugs, I swear. But I was extremely young and oblivious of many things, thank God never anything happened to my bird with the cats, no injuries, nor illnesses. Only cat I'd trust having in the same house with parrots is a ragdoll for sure. Who is tested for Toxoplasmosis. Rest - Naw, hard pass. Don't think I get to see same docile cats as I had.

To get to the point of my reply, Toxoplasmosis is something that scares me. Many cats carry it, and even owners are probably infected by it but inhibiting with absolutely no symptoms, ever (VERY rare cases people actually get sick from it) However, this parasite is very much deadly for the birds. The idea of toxoplasmosis is to infect the rodent to change the behaviour, so the rodent gets rid of the fear of the cats, and the cats can catch the mice/rats without issues. In birds however, it's often fatal. There was one scientific article, I cannot remember which parrot it was (I think an amazon??) who somehow got infected by it and later on died, this was confirmed during the autopsy. Also raptors (birds of prey) are very much so successible to it as well. Worst part, the cat doesn't even need to get close to the bird - it's enough just for a bad hygiene in the house for the owner and bird to catch it. Cats are only the carriers of the parasites, so they never inhibit any symptoms.

Here's some good scientific articles on the stuff whoever is interested in it! Be careful, it's written in "nerd" language, can be hard to read and understand.

A review of toxoplasmosis in wild birds - PubMed

Toxoplasma gondii affects most species of warm-blooded animals, including birds. There is considerable confusion regarding the identity of T. gondii-like parasites and the diagnosis of toxoplasmosis in wild birds. In this review, T. gondii-like infections in different species of wild birds are...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Sorry for diverting the main topic :B Never hurts to learn something new!

Okay, Bingo, Found the article. I was right - it was a wild Amazon parrot, which is super scary to find out.

Fatal Toxoplasmosis in a Vinaceous Amazon Parrot (Amazona vinacea)

Toxoplasmosis was diagnosed in a vinaceous Amazon parrot based on histopathology and immunohistochemistry. The bird was prostrate on the bottom of the cage and died. Necropsy revealed edema and congestion of the lungs, cloudy air sacs, and mild hepatomegaly. Histopathology revealed severe...

bioone.org

 

[theparrotcafe]

thats what i thought! plus isnt there evidence to show that freeze dried food has like 50% of the nutrients cooked out or something?

jamie just tiks me off sometimes, she didnt give any evidence for the fruit statement other than her assurance that they dont need it when its their main diet in the wild? and the whole video just felt like an advertisment for their overpriced products (im not saying shes wrong about everything but she has such a large audience and gives herself no wiggle room to back up if she makes a mistake and advertises her products very heavily) im sure shes lovely and has lots of relevant knowledge but simply saying everyone else is wrong (including those who have had eclectus for decades???) and practically shunning people who dont spend all day with their birds (due to work/school)
and kept a budgie alone for like a year or more (in a fairly small cage for someone who advocates for aviaries!)

other youtubers like marlene mcohen and tyler rugge make sure that everthing they says is backed up or has some supporting evidence even if its just their experience (and they clarify this), jamie has taken in two eclectus in the last few months and its none of my business (especially since i have only ever had chickens and quail but hope to have a parrot one day so am researching!) but what if one day shes wrong and others are hurt by it?

does anyone else feel this way or is it just me, sorry if this is too controversial, im not trying to start anything just want to know if others feel the same way or have different opinions to me (im always up to listen to a sensible argument) and maybe im making a whole thing out of this just it goes against most of what ive read about ekkies

anyways thankyou for replying skarila

 

[theparrotcafe]

thats what i thought! plus isnt there evidence to show that freeze dried food has like 50% of the nutrients cooked out or something?

jamie just tiks me off sometimes, she didnt give any evidence for the fruit statement other than her assurance that they dont need it when its their main diet in the wild? and the whole video just felt like an advertisment for their overpriced products (im not saying shes wrong about everything but she has such a large audience and gives herself no wiggle room to back up if she makes a mistake and advertises her products very heavily) im sure shes lovely and has lots of relevant knowledge but simply saying everyone else is wrong (including those who have had eclectus for decades???) and practically shunning people who dont spend all day with their birds (due to work/school)
and kept a budgie alone for like a year or more (in a fairly small cage for someone who advocates for aviaries!)

other youtubers like marlene mcohen and tyler rugge make sure that everthing they says is backed up or has some supporting evidence even if its just their experience (and they clarify this), jamie has taken in two eclectus in the last few months and its none of my business (especially since i have only ever had chickens and quail but hope to have a parrot one day so am researching!) but what if one day shes wrong and others are hurt by it?

does anyone else feel this way or is it just me, sorry if this is too controversial, im not trying to start anything just want to know if others feel the same way or have different opinions to me (im always up to listen to a sensible argument) and maybe im making a whole thing out of this just it goes against most of what ive read about ekkies

anyways thankyou for replying skarila

Your thinking of DEHYDRATED food. Dehydrated food only keeps up to 60 % if it’s nutritional value. FREEZE DRIED food keeps 97% of its nutritional value.

 

[Talaya]

She has just taken on a 6 month old female Ekkie called Fennel and whilst I am interested in the progress, I was slightly surprised by some of her comments. I have already learnt in just a short time not all of what she says is necessarily good/relevant for Ekkies. whilst They might appear to be good ‘ trick trainers‘ their bred specific knowledge seems to be lacking, she was surprised at a messy eater .. didn’t she see the mess on the wall/cage? and then gave all pellets as one of the feeds. Anyway watch Fennel on their channel if you’re interested .

 

[izzieschickies]

Your thinking of DEHYDRATED food. Dehydrated food only keeps up to 60 % if it’s nutritional value. FREEZE DRIED food keeps 97% of its nutritional value.

my mistake 👍

 

[kme3388]

I'm late to the punch here but my ekkie has been to a vet who had to refer him to another vet who is more specialized for his medical issues. Neither of them said that he has to be on a chop diet, or fruit/veggie diet only. Nico is on a prescription pellet diet now that helps him easily digest his food. He does still get his almonds. He loves pecans. I also make him a chop. He gets birdie bread. He gets a sweet potato cookie. Surprisingly he isn't into fruits that much unless I'm eating them then he wants to eat them with me.

I myself have never given Nico human food, but he does beg for it as a dog would. He will snatch food off a plate if you leave it out with in reach. My assumption is that in his past he was given people food. (Nico was adopted, and I wasn't given a lot of information about his past as not much was known).

 

[chris-md]

They wouldn’t tell you, would they? Vets are not up to date on the specialized nature of eclectus needs, and are typically the worst people to take advice from on eclectus husbandry. My one avian vet pushed heavily enriched pellets on me, saying “you will miss micronutrients”. I politely told her we won’t be doing that knowing we were perfectly covered by the diversity of food Parker gets.

Even avian vets still lump ekkies in with all other parrots, and I think you know enough to realize you simply can’t do that. it’s like, perhaps overstated but apt, comparing toucans to parrots. Doesn’t work.

Also says nothing of the e financial incentive avian vets have to push pellets.

 

[kme3388]

They wouldn’t tell you, would they? Vets are not up to date on the specialized nature of eclectus needs, and are typically the worst people to take advice from on eclectus husbandry. My one avian vet pushed heavily enriched pellets on me, saying “you will miss micronutrients”. I politely told her we won’t be doing that knowing we were perfectly covered by the diversity of food Parker gets.

Even avian vets still lump ekkies in with all other parrots, and I think you know enough to realize you simply can’t do that. it’s like, perhaps overstated but apt, comparing toucans to parrots. Doesn’t work.

Also says nothing of the e financial incentive avian vets have to push pellets.

I really do like to debate with the best of them. I try not to as I've been told "It's not nice". In messages, or in forums it really comes across wrong as facial expressions can't be seen. I never mean any harm.

You are correct. You cannot group a toucan in with other parrots, and feed them the same diet. Doing so will kill them. They have been brought into captivity, and all we've done is caused them harm unfortunately. People have brought toucans into captivity with the best of intentions, and have meant well I will add. I am not saying that we have people that are intentionally killing them. Ekkies are in the same boat from what I've gathered. Some parrots may not do well in captivity. Before making these lovely birds pets more research needs to be done.