it can display dominance... But until then it will display that as it needs to find its place amongst ranks this is natural behavior of many animals....
I never said blame the issues on dominace or hormones...
First thing that comes to mind... is that like a girl being "'kind of' pregnant"?
People often do blame it on dominance or hormones. I'm more likely to believe hormones than dominance, but I've been reading a lot lately about people blaming hormones because it's spring and their birds are being extra nippy... but I really wonder, how many birds are actually hormonal? Or is it because of different changes other than hormones causing the bites? And how many birds out there are being "left alone" during the "hormonal time" rather than working with the bird? If a bird is truly hormonal, then the owner can train and encourage non-hormonal behaviors to avoid aggressive situations.
if youd watch wild parrots there is a thing called a pecking order and that is nothing other then dominace, so they do search for some one to dominant and an alpha...
There is no alpha in parrots. Yes, they fight and they bicker, but one bird may win a fight and lose another. Just because they won one fight does not mean that they are then the "alpha".
Natural Encounters, Inc.
To fully understand captive bird behavior people should begin with an understanding of wild bird behavior. Through personal observations, discussions with many parrot field researchers (personal communications: Brice, February, 1994, Munn, July 1998, Gilardi, February, 1999, English, November, 2000, May, May 15, 2001) and review of literature, we have found no evidence of flock hierarchies in wild parrots. The field researchers all attest to aggression and disputes among parrots.
However, the aggressors are not consistent from one incident to another. A bird that loses a confrontation with one bird may just as well win a confrontation with the same bird later. It could be said that the winners of these confrontations are dominant over the losers. However, the dominant position is limited to each specific incident and does not carry over to future encounters. There is no evidence of social hierarchies in flocks of wild parrots that resemble social hierarchies commonly found in many mammal species. If dominance hierarchies exist in wild parrots they are most likely limited to family groups.
as do dogs with the fact they look for the pack leader this is all about dominace amongst the pack.
What if I were to tell you that the "dominance theory" is based on wolves within captivity?
De-Bunking the "Alpha Dog" Theory - Whole Dog Journal Article
The erroneous approach to canine social behavior known as dominance theory (two million-plus Google hits) is based on a study of captive zoo wolves conducted in the 1930s and 1940s by Swiss animal behaviorist Rudolph Schenkel, in which the scientist concluded that wolves in a pack fight to gain dominance, and the winner is the alpha wolf.
Graduate Student/Post-doctoral Fellows Openings - L. David Mech
Schenkel’s Classic Wolf Behavior Study Available in English
Below you can download a pdf version of Schenkel’s 1947 “Expressions Studies on Wolves.” This is the study that gave rise to the now outmoded notion of alpha wolves. That concept was based on the old idea that wolves fight within a pack to gain dominance and that the winner is the “alpha” wolf. Today we understand that most wolf packs consist of a pair of adults called “parents” or “breeders,” (not “alphas”), and their offspring.
And then, what if I were to say that captivity breeds unnatural behaviors???
Natural Encounters, Inc.
So, why do parrots bite in captivity? First, if you put an animal in an unnatural environment you can expect some unnatural behavior. Second, all behavior is a product of instinct or experience.
The Man Who Cried Alpha | Dog Star Daily
At the time, to study wolves, a group was formed by combining wolves from various zoos. These wolves had no relationship with each other, so like any other social group, a sort of hierarchy had to be worked out. This was the situation that Schenkel observed before releasing his famous publication that described wolf behavior, pack order, and the “alpha pair.” Thanks to Mech’s book and other publications that then dispersed this information, the idea of an “alpha” trickled down to the general public.
Since Schenkel’s time, scientists have realized that the story of how wolves form and maintain packs is different than originally thought. The real story is this: A male and female wolf find each other, court, mate, and soon have offspring. The parents affectionately guide the offspring, teach them necessarily life skills, and keep them safe. Those pups, at about a year of age, become older siblings to the next litter, and like human siblings, dominate the new pups—but there is no “fighting for rank.” The rank is obvious. The parents are still in charge, period. Eventually, the offspring will disperse and eventually form their own packs.
Does any of this sound familiar? Does the accurate information about wolf packs sound more like wild animals constantly having to fight for rank, suppressing each other’s behavior, and rolling each other on their backs to prove dominance? Or does it sound more like human family structure
Wolf Status and Dominance in Packs -Alpha Status
If it is dispaying those issues you must work through them as they do exist and then you therefore become the alpha and they defiantly do follow and believe in you.
"your inability to train the bird at the current time" - I like that, and I believe it true.
But to say that dominance exists in the wild when there has been no actual proof that it exists is misleading... and to try and "assert" yourself as "alpha" may lead to problems down the road with the animals. Training a parrot to do as you ask (not demand) is not dominance, it is training, pure and simple.
Birds don't follow humans because humans are the "alpha member" - they follow humans because they associate good things with humans. A bird who does not associate good things with humans is not likely to "follow" them or enjoy interacting with them.
Living With Parrots Cage Free: My Bird Knows When She Is Bad, Right?? !! (Hmmm)...
Im guesssing you have never worked and or managed a large group of birds that have similar bonds of that to a flock?
I may not have as much experience as you handling a variety of parrots and in large quantities, but this is one topic I will not back down on!
That said, I do have a flock. This flock consists of four cockatiels and a bourke parakeet. NOT ONCE have I seen any bird "assert" dominance over any other bird! Yes, they bicker and quarrel over food dishes and perches, but no one bird is dominant over another! Out of this entire flock, I have only one male cockatiel... and he is bonded with a female cockatiel... so that should make them the alpha birds, right? Nope! Pistachio, the male, does like to "bully" the other birds around, making them move off of perches and dishes that he wants to be at. At the same time as saying that, the bourke parakeet (who's 1/3 his size and is *NOT* an aggressive species like a lovebird is, actually quite passive, like cockatiels!) will come up right behind him and attack his tail feathers until he moves! Does this then make her dominant over him? Again, not at all! Just because she may have one that quarrel doesn't mean that she'll win the next one with him... and these quarrels do not make them the "alpha bird" - the entire flock has various quarrels and squabbles with each other and each quarrel between them does not always end the same.
This, to me, sounds much more "natural" (as natural as a captive flock can be) than believing in dominance that hasn't even been proven to exist in wild populations of wolves or parrots.
Rabster, sorry for taking this "off topic", but to say that it's a pet peeve of mine that parrots are supposedly dominant creatures may be an understatement! :xmas_lol2
