Do you ever feel bad....?

[snowflake311]

There are those people that think birds have no place in our homes. They should be free because they have wings they need to fly. They are wild animals and need to be in the wild. Blah blah blah. You know it all.

I am animal person. I love them all wild and domestics. I have a Crazy dog and I feel worst for her. She needs to RUN 2 miles a day to be happy and that does not always happen. So I see no real difference in keeping dogs and birds these days. Many pet dogs are on Drugs these days because they are neurotic due to neurotic owner and or lack of the basic need to run free. People forget that dogs are dogs and not fury humans. They have needs too the need to run free off leash. Oh the poor city dogs.

Enough about dogs. What about birds? Do you ever feel bad keeping a some what wild animal in your home? I am not going to lie I do feel bad at times. A part of me thinks they should be free. The other part of me knows that deforestation is real and the parrot hobby might be the only way we can keep these parrots for other generations to enjoy. I give my bird the best food and the most time I can. I give him out of cage time to explore and all the toys that I can fit in his cage. I give him love and I let mine fly.

I have had birds in my life since I was born. At the same times feel a little bad for a second. Do you ever?

 

[Kentuckienne]

Dogs are domesticated and have been for millennia. Dogs have literally evolved to live with humans, and it isn’t foreign to their nature. Parrots, on the other hand, are merely tame and not domesticated in the least. Their wild instincts are close to the surface. Some behaviorists think captivity itself may be the reason some parrots develop feather plucking disorders, which are never seen in the wild.

It’s extremely unlikely that captive bred parrots will be used to repopulate their original or any habitats. It’s more likely that many species will be extirpated in the wild, and exist only as captive specimens for human enjoyment.

That’s just what I believe. Because of this I feel bad for most captive parrots on some level. Yes, they may have easier access to food, get medical care and shelter that lets them live far longer than their wild brethren. In return, they give up the things they evolved to have - free flight, and the pleasure of living in a flock that if their own kind. I don’t believe they know this at all. Maybe they feel only a vague discontent, the way a migratory bird feels the pressure to move on.

All I can do personally is to do what I can for parrots. I live with a parrot, so I pay attention to him and do the best I can to meet his needs, at least as well as a non-parrot can figure them out. I contribute to people and organizations that rescue parrots from bad situations. I advocate for habitat preservation and contribute to groups that work to protect nature. I don’t kid myself that my work amounts to much, or that I make any difference in the world. Maybe I make a small difference in the life of a parrot or two. It’s nothing in the face of the need. But it’s all any of us can do. Recognize that we are part of a most one-sided relationship, and do what we can to make it as good for them as we know how.

 

[SailBoat]

I have never had a single moment that I felt that I was in anyway limiting the freedom of the many Amazons that have taken-over our home over the many years. If anything, they have all felt the joy of being loved.

There is a 'group' that has found that by using specific words they can cause guilt, even pain in those that 'care.' As a result, they gain power and influence, but more importantly to them: Money! The sad reality is that they have far too many examples of poor care of Animals that they are happy to exploit. But You Are Not One Of Those Examples!

Fall into their trap and you will be sending them Money and considering releasing your Parrots into forests that they are not prepared to survive, and they will soon die!

Someone recently Posted, we are in a position of, which came first; The Chicken or the Egg! The reality is, we are here, and with the falling numbers of Breeders, the available chicks are becoming ever more expensive and this discussion will come to a natural end.

Turn-off and tune-out the 'messages' and you will find that you will spend your time and money on your Parrots. Plus, you will be much Happier! And no longer be bothered by those who really care nothing about your Parrots! Once Again, they are in this for the: (You Place The Word(s) Here).

Enjoy! Life is too short and right now, your Parrot(s) need you! Right?

 

[MonicaMc]

If the information I was given is correct, I actually have a wild caught african ringneck! What's worse, is that she was imported May of 2013. That's 21 years *AFTER* the '92 Wild Bird Conservation Act made it illegal to import wild parrots... apparently, there's like possibly 3 species that are excluded? And she's one of them....

So ya... I feel bad that she's more than likely a wild caught bird stuck in captivity and there's no way I could put her back in the wild. At that, I don't know if she was captured as a chick or an adult... and even if I could release her, who's to say she wouldn't be captured again? Would she even know how to survive in the wild?


Charlie, my mitred, is a first gen captive raised parrot. That is, his parents are/were wild caught imports. I know he wouldn't be able to survive in the wild.


My first conure, Noel was a cherry head. If I could have released him, even if it was to the flock in San Francisco, and know he could survive with the flock, I probably would have been okay with that... except Noel couldn't fly... Noel was partially blind in one eye and was getting cataracts in both eyes... he was missing feathers on the back of his head and on his stomach.... and he had grip issues. It wasn't that I wanted to release him and let him go... I just wanted so badly to see him be what a conure *should* be... not some disabled creature with health issues... and seeing that flock in San Francisco is how I felt he should be. A creature that could fly, squawk as loudly as possible and be happy.



All the others... they were born in captivity so they wouldn't know how to live in the wild.

 

[cnyguy]

My answer is a flat no. I do not feel bad about keeping companion parrots nor do I feel guilty for keeping them in a home instead of allowing them to live in the wild. I provide my parrots with a comfortable, safe environment, give them good care, good food and lots of attention. These are captive-bred parrots, meant to live as companion parrots, and were never intended to live in the wild. While they undoubtedly have many of the natural instincts common to wild parrots, they are still not equipped to survive in the wild.

 

[PrimorandMoxi]

Yes, I do feel terribly sorry for ME!
I am the one that is kept captive by my three parrots.

the rest of my life will be devoted to making sure they are well taken care of now, and when I "shuffle off this mortal coil."

 

[FlyBirdiesFly]

I do not feel bad for companion parrots. These parrots were bred in captivity and cannot ever be released in the wild, so they need us. If they were suddenly set free, they would be frightened and confused, and eventually they would either starve to death, freeze in winter or get eaten by predators. My birds are given huge cages, lots of attention, a healthy diet, vet care, and are fully flighted and enjoy flying within the house. I do feel bad for those birds who are kept in a small cage, forgotten in the corner, not given any interaction, and never get to fly.

 

[Kiwibird]

I wish parrots were never removed from the wild in the first place, but we did and we now must deal with what our predecessors have done in a responsible manner by providing captive individuals with lifetime care. It saddens me Kiwi will never have a mate or chicks and is reliant on us for his every need instead of the opportunity to meet his own needs in his natural habitat and to pass on his genes if his genetics and luck were good enough. Just because his overall survival odds are better in my home doesn't necessarily mean that makes up for denying him a natural existence or that it's better than a natural existence in the opinion of a parrot. I'm sure if I were abducted by kind aliens who took pretty good care of me, I'd adapt and possibly even become rather content in their home but I'm not sure I'd ever prefer being the companion animal to a more advanced species to the lifestyle I could have as a free citizen of the earth. Nor am I sure that my children born into captivity for the aliens would be better off being designated as a "breeder" or a "pet", sold off to some random alien and have no choice in their destiny even if they were born into it and knew no difference.

 

[Jottlebot]

No, I never feel bad. I understand the arguments for feeling bad/not keeping birds as pets, but it doesn't add up to me. I don't buy the 1000s of years domesticated argument. I don't think canine instincts have dulled at all! It's opportunity or necessity that wake instincts up, not whether your 14 x great grandmother lived in a kennel or a forest. If it were then surely every bird that flew away from a human home would survive as long as the weather was OK, because all their barely contained instincts would suddenly be freed?! I just don't think so. If the ability to find food and avoid being eaten aren't instincts then I don't know what could be.

Natural behaviours are vital because the creature has evolved to do these things. These would have been decided by need to find food, escape predators, stay fit enough to hunt, etc...not doing them makes animals physically and mentally ill, just like it does us and since we're the blighters that invented 'domestication' you can't get more domesticated than us!

I think it comes down to choice perhaps. We can choose to keep other animals in our lives and nothing else can (or at least does as far as I know). It seems wrong to impose our will on something else maybe? I don't know, we're just cleverer animals and some of us get joy from being around other animals and some of them do to!

My Mum HATES being in my front room with my birds, she'd rather stay outside with her (genetically engineered through at least 100s of years of breeding) dog... on a lead... with... a ... coat...on... because she "can't bear" so see an animal treated so unnaturally!!!!

 

[MooshieBird]

I disagree with how many parrots have been harvested for the pet trade in the wild. I disagree with all the bad information and dangerous bird items and poor quality diets touted by companies and people who are supposed to be bird "experts". I disagree with breeders and businesses who treat who treat bird as simply a commodity. I disagree with owners that get a bird and stick it in a cage and ignore it for the rest of the birds life. I don't feel bad at all about what I am doing, or what any responsible caring bird owner is doing.

I think we often attribute human emotion to our animals to try to understand them better. Mushka is incredibly smart and is constantly amazing me with her ability to associate and communicate. I have never encountered an animal with her level of emotional intelligence. But she is a bird. She sees, hears, smells, and tastes the world very differently than I do. Flying through the Congo is just as foreign to her as running across the savanna is to me. She doesn't miss it because it is not anything she has ever experienced. Me trying to attribute human thoughts, emotions, and actions to a bird is an exorcise in futility. She is a bird, she is different from me in every way and does not "miss" flying free in the wild. She doesn't know what that is. I want to teach her to fly on a harness because I believe it will make her life better. I am sure she currently has no opinion on the matter, and may disagree with me when the time comes.

I don't know everything she thinks or wants but I do try hard to figure it out. I give her what I know is a happy, healthy, and loved life and she returns it to me. I feel proud of my relationship with Mushka, and you should be proud for giving your bird the same thing.

My two cents.

 

[snowflake311]

I know everyone says "My bird was raised in captivity and could never live in the wild." I think this is wrong. As long at the climate is right and there are plenty of fruit trees/food. Yes your captive bred bird can learn to live and thrive in the wild. Just look at the Conures of Telegraph hill or the many many parrots that live in round So Cal and FL. The Ringnecks have taken over Englands bird feeders.

As long as our birds are given a happy stress free life and are given all they need. It is good. I have kept birds all my life. My little Sprinkles knows nothing more than living as a pet so he is happy and well adjusted.

Has anyone ever seen the kids movie Rio. It is the best. One macaw is a pet and likes it. The other is wild. It puts a nice perspective on it.

 

[AmyMyBlueFront]

At times, I do feel bad. My Smokey was a wild caught,probably YANKED out of her nest by some big monster hand with a glove on that terrified the c*** out of her.
In her 28 years,she NEVER learned to like hands,would fly off mine as soon as she had the slightest opportunity,but she was well cared for,and loved by everyone in my family,and she SEEMED to be well adjusted and happy,playing with toys and eating well,and being taken care of medically immediately when times arised. Thinking about it,she may have been "happier" in the wild,and that saddens me,because she was a great joy in my life,and loved deeply and unconditionally.

I THINK Amy was also wild caught. He does have an open band on his leg,and the breeder/person that I got him from,had a huge house with at least 18 BF's climbing and scrambling around,and his house had no breeders there,so I am assuming he purchased a "flock" of these beautiful creatures.

The only thing I feel "bad" about,is not letting her fledge and learn to fly (which I am working on now). When I see You Tube vid's of Parrots free flying, I can imagine them saying "WEEEEEE!!! LOOK AT ME!!!! I'M FLYING!!!!" at that hits me hard,hence the reason for wanting Amy to experience what he was born/made to do...FLY!

But,he is happy I'm sure where he is. When we go for rides in the car,and go places,I SEE IT in his face,how he reacts,and literally thanks me for taking him along on our little jaunts,how he nuzzles up to my cheek and preens my beard,and gives out sweet soft Amazon sounds..his way of saying Thanks Dad for taking me with you today.

I don't know if he would be happier in the wild,honestly.




Jim

 

[texsize]

I don't feel bad about keeping my birds.
In a way keeping birds is how I am making up for my bad mistakes I made a child.
I have tried to write about that a number of times but I just can't bring myself to do it.

texsize

 

[Carl_Power]

As long as they get lots of time out of their cage, love and attention and toys ect to mimic what they do in the wild and maybe other Parrots to socialise with, i cant see any cruelty in domestic Parrots at all if they are looked after properly.

No predators, longer life spans, vet care ect are some positives x

 

[SailBoat]

I know everyone says "My bird was raised in captivity and could never live in the wild." I think this is wrong. As long at the climate is right and there are plenty of fruit trees/food. Yes your captive bred bird can learn to live and thrive in the wild. Just look at the Conures of Telegraph hill or the many many parrots that live in round So Cal and FL. The Ringnecks have taken over Englands bird feeders.

As long as our birds are given a happy stress free life and are given all they need. It is good. I have kept birds all my life. My little Sprinkles knows nothing more than living as a pet so he is happy and well adjusted.

Has anyone ever seen the kids movie Rio. It is the best. One macaw is a pet and likes it. The other is wild. It puts a nice perspective on it.

I have never taken the opportunity to have a hand raised Baby, from a chosen Breeder like Henpecked, or like excellent Breeder. ALL of my Amazons have been out-cases, yesterdays trash, most on the edge of or looking at death's door.

The first five had all been wild caught and with the exception of two, each had been abused by individuals that should have never gotten any Parrot in the first place. Since that group, all have been hatched in North America from Breeds that clearly knew what they where doing, but like above, four of that group of five should have never had Parrots.

At present, yes that would be number eleven, for those who are counting. He was hatched at an excellent Breeder, the first Owners knew what they where doing. The only error was that they believed their three Adult children would care for him. Ten years later, The dad died and at that time mom was slipping quickly and the care person abused the Amazon for near five years. Upon mom's death, the kids show-up and after a quick trip to Pet Smart, for a near total lose of Wing feathers was followed by a quick trip to the Vets clinic for surgery of a split open rump!

There is a very large number of members and likely viewers that also have Rescued, rehomed Parrots!!! And to each and everyone of you: My Deepest Thanks For What You Are Doing!!!! None of You Should For One Moment 'Feel Bad!' For IMHO, Each Of You Are Saints!!!

For the BAD ACTORS, their turn in coming - likely not in this world! But, I truly believe it will come!

To the OP, It is your choice to feel however you chose! That's all part of that Free Speech Thing!

That Said, please do not attempt to place it (even as a concept) upon others! There are truly Wonderful Members Here That Are Daily Assure A Forever Life, For Their Parrots!!!

Each and everyone of the ten (10) now past members of our household is deeply missed. But each one was Truly Loved and They Know That They Are Still Loved and Missed Deeply!

I am Very Sorry if I sound in anyway harsh! But, to have anyone state that what I have done and what others here have done and today or are doing should cause any of us to 'Feel Bad!' Sorry, but that just hurts deeply.

My deepest prays for each member here that has Loved and Lost a Dear Member of your home. It is because of the Members here that daily express Deep Love for Your Dear Family Members that I had first come here and why I daily chose to be part of this Group of Parrot Loving Members!

Again, I am very sorry if this sound harsh! To me, its just heartbreaking ...

 

[Kentuckienne]

Sailboat always has a good perspective. He and his wife both give new lives to the Amazons who come to them. I wish there were more people like that.

I’ve been reflecting on the question. I don’t feel bad for the way I treat Gus. I do feel bad that the situation is what it is: a world where parrots are poached, captured, smuggled, tormented, have habitat destroyed, are sold, are owned by people who shouldn’t have them. I don’t see anything in that equation that weighs in favor of the birds. It’s all about humans: the humans want the money they get for the bird, or they want the prestige of owning one, or see the bird as an embellishment. In my mind, I can’t separate the happy bird in the living room from the unfortunate ones that are an inseparable part of the chain.

I’m glad that a parrot named Alex lived for thirty years in a cage, because he helped teach us just how intelligent parrots are. He helped show that humans aren’t completely different from the rest of life - we have more in common with parrots than we knew. That bird was well cared for, well treated as a colleague and not a lab subject, and he had a degree of control of his life. The benefit to both humans and parrots was enormous. What’s bad is that for every Alex, there must be a thousand unfortunate cases. I do feel bad about that.

 

[Scott]

I know everyone says "My bird was raised in captivity and could never live in the wild." I think this is wrong. As long at the climate is right and there are plenty of fruit trees/food. Yes your captive bred bird can learn to live and thrive in the wild. Just look at the Conures of Telegraph hill or the many many parrots that live in round So Cal and FL. The Ringnecks have taken over Englands bird feeders.

Nobody really knows whether an individual captive-bred parrot can successfully adapt to the wild. While there are anecdotal flocks in major cities, there are likely far more carcasses of failed attempts at integration. Predation, disease, exclusionary flock members, and the elements conspire against a reasonably assured life of happiness.

I offer rebuttal not to diminish the conversation, which is to date productive and respectful, but to dissuade folks from considering a release to the wild of their "problem" fids. My first reaction was the quote might in some way influence more members than I can count on one hand to see this as solution. Please do not, the odds are poor.

 

[Terry57]

I offer rebuttal not to diminish the conversation, which is to date productive and respectful, but to dissuade folks from considering a release to the wild of their "problem" fids. My first reaction was the quote might in some way influence more members than I can count on one hand to see this as solution. Please do not, the odds are poor.

I completely agree, Scott. Thank you for posting this!
Today it is -35 outside here...I can't see any of my parrots being able to survive that.
I don't feel bad at all in having my birds as members of our family, they are safe, warm, loved and well taken care of.

 

[snowflake311]

I was just interested in what other bird owners felt. I by no means was saying we should never have birds. I never said that. I have a conure I grew up with birds all my life. I Just wanted to see what others thought about it all. I have had this talk with my Aunt who I love and she is a crazy bird lady.

I respect and admire anyone that does parrot rescue and rehab. I think that is great. I guess you took my question the wrong way I did not mean to up set anyone. I just had a question.

I know My bird would die if he got out here where I live in the high sierras because of lack of food and the cold. Also predators. I was just saying there are many parrots that have gone back to their wild ways it happens in the right conditions. Introduced species are bad you should never let fish or animals of any kind go into a place where they are not from. On the Flip side There is a flock of wild little birds living inside JFK airport. They moved inside by choice.

I enjoyed reading all that everyone had to say.

 

[psychocircus91]

It is a complicated question.

I feel bad regarding the whole pet parrot trade, as a whole. The fact of the matter is, most people are not cut out for parrot ownership. Many people fail to do the proper research. Several parrots do not have proper diets, toys, exercise, and interaction.

However, it is hard to feel bad about my ownership of birds. I know I am providing proper husbandry, diet, and care. Two out of the three were rescued, and regardless once they were born into captivity, they were placed there to stay. They have a better home with me than they would many, many other places. Do their species as a whole have more happiness in the wild? Maybe. Would my particular birds be happier in the wild? Absolutely not.