Wanted: Hyacinth Macaw info

[alcmene]

We have become obsessed with hyacinth macaws. Am strongly considering getting one- but not soon. I want to know everything there is to know about hyacinths before making a decision. I researched for over a year before getting our sun conure!

Looking for people's advice/experiences. Tell me the good, but especially the bad and the ugly about hyacinths. I figure if i hear about hyacinths at their very worst, and it sounds like something i can live/deal with, then that bodes well for them being a good fit for our family.

A little background- i am aware of their price tag and can afford one. I am home pretty much 24/7. The only time my birds are locked in their cages is to sleep at night, so providing enough attention would also not be a problem. We own an 8,000 sq ft home on 2 acres, so no issues with disturbing the neighbors or not enough space.

Things i am especially interested in knowing:
-Is there a personality difference between males and females? If so, which make better pets, and why?
-What is the monthly budget for their upkeep (food, toys, etc)?
-What, specifically, do you feed them? As in, the specific ratio of macadamia nuts to veggies to pellets, etc
-What are the best places to buy things for them? Especially XXL steel cages, outdoor aviaries, appropriate toys, etc.

Thank you!

 

[Sterling1113]

I've never had a Hyacinth, and likely never will(fear of the beak!) but I'll share some of the "ugly" I've heard. (And it's not even their fault, they're just huge birds.)
Firstly, they're the biggest and most expensive of macaws. You said you can afford one, so I'll leave the price tag out.
You asked about males and females; I'm sure some people have a preference of either due to their own personal likes, but I personally would want a male no matter what the species, just because of the health risks that go with females. I have no experience/have heard nothing about the difference between males and females with Hyacinths though.
Secondly, the price tag of the cage. Unless you have a HUGE stainless steel cage, then the $900 you just spent on a generic powder coated cage is going straight out the window. They see everything as toys, and with the largest bite pressure of all the macs, they can snap the welds on your standard cage rather quickly.
Toys.. like I mentioned above, they have the biggest bite pressure, so you're going to need a TON of toys. (A ton in the cage, and extras to swap out for when the old ones are destroyed.) SteelyBird(you can find info on their products here on the forum) has some stainless steel toys that he uses for his Hyacinths, you can watch his videos and decide if you want to get a couple of those toys too. Just keep lots of wooden blocks handy for shredding.
Diet.. I know nothing about their diet. I imagine you could find some information searching on the internet, but I feel like it would be similar to most parrots, limited seeds and pellets and mostly fresh foods.
Where to buy things; SteelyBird has a selection that you could look through. Again, I feel like that would just be a bunch of online searching and comparing what you find.

Edit: ChaoticFun has stainless steel toys. I got mixed up. Here's a link to their thread: http://www.parrotforums.com/parrot-toys/39684-safe-indestructible-re-loadable-parrot-toys.html

 

[riddick07]

Hyacinths are beautiful and often the gentle giants. However, the minute you show fear/hesitation and forget to set boundaries it's over. There is a hyacinth rescue at the shelter that snapped the bone in his owners arm and is hard to handle because he realized his beak can be used to get his way. Then you have the owners of the rescues hyacinth macaw that is a real sweetheart and can be passed around with no worries. One was socialized right the other one was taught that he could do whatever he wanted which eventually lead to that snapped arm. I would recommend going to a shelter or a nearby owner of a macaw and getting to know some macaws and how to handle them.

We just adopted a blue and gold and he tests you quite a bit to see if you will fold. He is already learning it doesn't work like that and has started to either not bother testing us or testing us a much shorter period of time. These last couple days it seems like he just wants to be sure that he can't get his way... I'm guessing his previous owner would just go away if he acted up. Plus he has bonded to my mother strongly and so is a bit bratty with everyone else which is where socialization is key now before it is too late and much more dangerous.

Is your sun growing feathers back yet?

 

[JerseyWendy]

Alcmene, if I were you I'd email or message Dan @ Chaotic Fun. He has 2 of those gentle giants, and I'm sure he'll be more than happy to share his info on how to keep them healthy and happy.

You can NEVER go wrong with a Hy. They truly are the Cadillacs of the bird world, IMHO.

 

[MacawLoverOf3]

Several years ago I came across an ad for a Hy for sale, not too far from me. I asked a friend (she was at the time) to come with as she also had quite a few birds herself and so she came along with. When we first saw Koko he was in his cage. I asked him to step up for me but he would have none of that. Sharon said she would take him out, which she did, and I remember seeing him bite her when she did but did not realize just how bad the bite was.

The decision was that I would buy him after spending a little time with him but we looked back and realized that when I went to the van for the carrier, Koko had already chosen Sharon as his person who he would fight to the death for and I am not kidding.

When Koko and cage were packed in the van and I started up the engine, that is when Sharon said she did not have feeling in that hand he bite. Took two weeks, but the feeling did come back.

In about a month's time I was doing a bicycling/ship cruise to Hawaii and still had not been out on my bike so Sharon and I figured she would just keep him until after my trip. I saw him several times in-between my buying him and the trip but every time I was with that little xxxx he was after my blood. He would bit, and not just little bites either. He meant business. Longer story shortened, once the SS cage was delivered and set up and everything was ready, I laid in bed that one Saturday morning realizing that Koko was going to hate me for taking him away from his chosen one, Sharon, and it would end up that I would be afraid to take him out. Talked to Sharon and she really did not want him leaving either so we worked out a deal.

When I came over, we put a stand between the couch I sat on and the rocker chair Sharon sits on and I told Koko that he was going to have to stay with Sharon, not because he bit the poop out of me (would not let him know he won by doing that) just that he would stay there.

If I was not the one to see it with my own eyes I would never believe that he climbed off that stand that he was on, came over to me and cuddled with me. He was fine from that point on where we could play together and he would not purposely put holes in my cloths or go after a pint of blood, from me.

Now for another story of a different Hy. The wife was pregnant with child #1 when they bought Mac. When baby #3 was 22 months old, baby put hand in cage, bird bit hand and there were 9 stitches in that small little hand. The couple rehomed Mac but about 1-1/2 years later the lady got a call to come get that bird NOW as it bit the second owners hand and she lost 1/2 of the thumb nail. I always wondered what happened to the other half. The first owner goes over to take Mac back but while trying to get him out of the cage he bit her too and so for the next 4 years Mac was only taken out of the cage about once a week and I can totally understand her for being gun shy with him after the bite. The original owners realized this was not good for Mac and found him another home. Mac did nail that lady once but he is not going anywhere as she has Macaw experience and knows a bite is part and parcel with owning a large bird. Mac now enjoys being loved on and it is really wonderful to see him cuddle up on her and just soaking it all up.

I would have to see evidence that a Macaw, even a Hyacinth actually breaking a bone, even an ulnar or radius bone. The beaks are large, but to grab on and actually break a bone in an adult, I want to see documentation (ER records) before I can believe that one. Now if the claim was an open would with nerve and muscle damage, that I would believe instantaneously.

Male/female I have a friend who has breed Hy's in the past and she swears that males are better but keep in mind both Koko and Mac are male. I know of a little female that is just so sweet and doesn't have a mean feather in her body. I had talked to a few other breeders and they claim to go with a female as males can get nasty when hormones hit.

You want to go with an Expandable Habitats cage as no Hy will pop the welds when the cage is double welded. The people who make the cages are in Illinois and not over in China. They produce quality cages and the service you can't beat,

Hyacinths are BIG birds but what I had seen when I was searching for one was low weights and when I would ask what the birds were fed, 9.5 times out of ten the reply back was pellets and of coarse nuts. If you plan on getting a baby, make sure the baby is introduced to fresh foods. A breeder who will take the time to feed out the bird properly and not just take the short cut of using pellets, is to me, a much better breeder who is in it for the birds, not just to make $$$

If I was looking for a breeder my choices would be Rita at Avian Adventures Aviary or Kashmir Csaky. You want a breeder who really spends time with the babies and gives one on one attention to the babies. Babies that are raised properly will be much better birds later on in life.

For SS toys check out Avian Stainless. Doris and her hubby make and sell toys and they will be reopening the site with more of the larger size toys appropriate for Hy's. Avian Stainless Bird Toys

 

[alcmene]

Is your sun growing feathers back yet?

Yes! You were right, she was just freaked out by my mother's dog. As soon as that little yapper left, Lucy never touched her feathers again.

You were also right about the most important thing- we are totally bird people, we just didn't know it yet lol!

How is Folger doing? I heart him.

 

[Kiwibird]

I held a hy once (more it insisted on climbing on my arm when I offered it a treat) for a couple minutes and it was a VERY big bird with a beak the size of a saucer. I was shocked at the size when I saw this one in person for the first time, even the "large" macaws don't hold a candle to a hyacinth. The one I held was a merciful macaw and did not amputate any fingers, but it was honestly intimidating (even to someone who's been around pretty big parrots my whole life). The owner had the bird since it was a chick (I think he said around 20/25 years, something like that), and did have quite a few scars on his arm from his 'friend'.

They are very beautiful birds, but probably needs the most advanced parrot experience of them all. Beyond the special cage, they need the special diet that is rich in selenium, which comes from eating large quantities of a certain nut and I would imagine a healthy, active hy would probably destroy even large toys within a day (figuring $20/$30+ a toy, thats a lot of upkeep costs). And even if you can afford the long term care costs associated with the bird, you still have to come to terms with the fact when a bird that size gets in a pissy mood, they aren't going to just remove a chunk of flesh, they are going to do serious (possibly permanent) damage. My mom has had to have stitches and has permanent nerve damage in her hand from a goffin cockatoo. Everyone in the family bears scars from that bird. My BFA bit my lip once, and the area was numb for several weeks, he took a sizable chunk out of my nose once and he's left a few scars on my hands and arms too. And those are relatively small beaks by comparison and have still done serious damages. More than money, that would be the biggest point I would consider before getting a hy- the potential for serious injury. I just have to ask, have you ever been bitten by a bird larger than your conure? I would think this over VERY carefully before proceeding.

 

[thekarens]

I wouldn't think beak size is as big of an issue as temperament. Some birds (regardless of size) are known to be nippy and the big macs are generally known to be gentle as long as they are socialized well and trained.

 

[Sambamama]

Hi all,

I will respectfuly chime in... The OP seems to have no issue with $, so a good Hy cage and outright purchase is not an issue! This is not the case for most folks. so one or two issues are already addressed and the next issue is to address bird size.

If the OP has the mindset to handle a big macaw, then they should go for it! I vote male for the lack of egg laying issues.FWIW, the female Hy that I interact with is much lighter in weight than my male B&G. Her beak is not as intimidating as the B&G when he is in a snotty mood, so do not let size intimidate. It's all about behavior and attitude. If either bird were to attack it wouldn't matter the breed, they could all do damage!

OP, you should get what you are able to afford, and what you are able to handle. Each bird is an individual and remeber that one can find anything from a devilish budgie to a soggy noodle Hy. It all depends, so if you are financially stable and able to give any large bird the next 70 years of your life then go of it!

I have had the worse, most vicious, bites from Quakers. So don't let size dictate your purchase. JMO of course, but I have only known sweet Hys.if I weren't already owned by another macaw I would seek out a Hy too.

K

 

[alcmene]

Thanks everybody so far!

Are there any members that anyone knows of that have Hy's? I'd like to message them to ask about their birds. The more people I can talk to with direct first hand experience, the better!

Anyone know of any breeders they recommend (I'm already in contact with Rita and Kashmir)? Anyone know of any breeders they DON'T recommend (you can PM me if you don't want to discuss it publically)? Thanks again everybody!

 

[JerseyWendy]

Yes Laura (luvmytooo) has a Hy. Unfortunately she hasn't' been online for a while, but you could still try PMing her.

Then there is Dan from Chaotic Fun.

 

[alcmene]

Yes Laura (luvmytooo) has a Hy. Unfortunately she hasn't' been online for a while, but you could still try PMing her.

Then there is Dan from Chaotic Fun.

I sent an email to Dan already. I will reach out to Laura too. Thanks!

 

[Birdman666]

A friend of mine used to breed with these, so I got to play with them... ahem... "help socialize" them. (Yeah, right, cuz we know how anti-social a Hy-Hy is!)

I honestly have never noticed much of a difference between male and female behaviors UNLESS the male had a female on eggs in the nest box. EVEN THERE, I think I'd rather take on a Hy, than say, a dominant greenwing...

I did run into one male who lost his mate, and he went from the happiest and friendliest bird you ever met to miserable to deal with for a time... (it took about two years.)

I was never personally involved in anything other than "socializing" these birds. So, I never got involved in the day to day costs, but Macadamia nuts and palm nuts ain't exactly cheap. My advice would be find a place where you can buy in bulk.

Your breeder should be able to give you breed specific advice.

Stainless steel cages are not optional with these guys. Somewhere on this site, I posted a video of a hyacinth ripping apart an "ordinary" large macaw cage. I've watched them pop cage welds, and it's pretty effortless.

Their personalities are pretty mellow. They are the mushiest by nature. BUT even mush macs can and will throw an occasional tantrum. You have to be able to discipline them when they do. Other than that, they are actually one of the easiest macaws to work with in my opinion.

I'll take a Hy over a Scarlett temperment any day of the week.

These guys pretty much start out mushy, and playful. As long as you don't mess that up, they pretty much stay that way. They are lover-birds.

 

[GW.Joe]

they are actually one of the easiest macaws to work with in my opinion.

I'll take a Hy over a Scarlett temperment any day of the week.

These guys pretty much start out mushy, and playful. As long as you don't mess that up, they pretty much stay that way. They are lover-birds.

Completely Agree, That's why I'm getting the "Po Mans Hyacinth"

A Greenwing

 

[Birdman666]

they are actually one of the easiest macaws to work with in my opinion.

I'll take a Hy over a Scarlett temperment any day of the week.

These guys pretty much start out mushy, and playful. As long as you don't mess that up, they pretty much stay that way. They are lover-birds.

Completely Agree, That's why I'm getting the "Po Mans Hyacinth"

A Greenwing

My Greenwing is as MUSHY as they come... I couldn't, and wouldn't trade her for anything! That bird is my baby!

BUT I have worked with a few Greenwings that had dominance issues, that people were stupid enough to reinforce... and those birds took a very firm hand.

ANY macaw that gets socialized and handled extensively should turn into a mushball with feathers...

In my opinion THE ONLY MAJOR DIFFERENCE are breed specific "beakiness" and "overbonding/pair bond" issues. (With Scarletts, buffons and severe macaws probably being the most difficult. Hys, Greenwings & B&G/Catalina's the furthest on the "mushy" end of the scale.)

 

[Birdman666]

Hyacinths are beautiful and often the gentle giants. However, the minute you show fear/hesitation and forget to set boundaries it's over. There is a hyacinth rescue at the shelter that snapped the bone in his owners arm and is hard to handle because he realized his beak can be used to get his way. Then you have the owners of the rescues hyacinth macaw that is a real sweetheart and can be passed around with no worries. One was socialized right the other one was taught that he could do whatever he wanted which eventually lead to that snapped arm. I would recommend going to a shelter or a nearby owner of a macaw and getting to know some macaws and how to handle them.

We just adopted a blue and gold and he tests you quite a bit to see if you will fold. He is already learning it doesn't work like that and has started to either not bother testing us or testing us a much shorter period of time. These last couple days it seems like he just wants to be sure that he can't get his way... I'm guessing his previous owner would just go away if he acted up. Plus he has bonded to my mother strongly and so is a bit bratty with everyone else which is where socialization is key now before it is too late and much more dangerous.

Is your sun growing feathers back yet?

I always figured they could snap an arm bone... this confirms it. (After watching my greenwing snap blocks of wood in two, since wood is denser than arm, I figure she wouldn't but she could... and a Hy is significantly more powerful than a GW)

Macaws are pair bond birds. In the wild you see them in flocks of 30 to 40 birds, but almost always 2 by 2. In captivity they tend to form these same pair bonds with a person. If socialized around lots of people, they will generally interact with lots of people.

One of those birds is usually the dominant of the pair. IF YOUR BIRD THINKS IT'S HIM... HE'S PROBABLY RIGHT!!! If allowed to overbond, they will.

Macaws are one of those animals that seem to know instinctively who CAN and who CAN'T control them. And they test you to make sure. If you CAN, they don't even try... If you CAN'T... you'll simply have a hard time handling them, and might not be able to handle them at all...

I was one of the people down at the rescue that was charged with rehabbing the aggressive birds. Why? Because with me, and a handful of others, they weren't aggressive.

In fact, I have been in situations where a bird and a human were "arguing" and the argument stopped when I stepped in... [One of my CAG's favorite phrases, that he learned and uses in context is "KNOCK IT OFF!"] The bird's I worked with knew what that phrase meant. And they stopped. It's something that was absolutely reinforced.

People thought I was nuts, but I once stuck the top of my head between a dominant male greenwing, and an M2 that were arguing, rather vehemently, with their beaks, over a spot on the playstand... [Two dominant birds, one prime playstand spot. I still don't know set them both out there together, but I believe the first sentence out of my mouth was "WHAT DID YOU THINK WAS GOING TO HAPPEN WHEN YOU DID THAT?!" One on my hand, one on my opposite shoulder. The argument was over a perch spot, so now you're both coming with me. (They both lost...) THAT'S "KNOCK IT OFF!"

If you don't learn to control a bird this large and powerful, YOU MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO WHEN IT COUNTS! Even mushballs can, and will, throw tantrums. You deal with it the same way you deal with a human toddler.

Nurturing guidance, love, and discipline.

I don't care if it's a Hyacinth macaw or a green cheek conure. The same basic rules apply.

 

[Birdman666]

Incidentally, my introduction to Hyacinth macaws was as follows:

The largest and goofiest blue bird I had ever seen was out on a playstand, swinging by his beak from a branch. I walked up and watched him being goofy for a moment, and seeing that he had my complete attention, he interacted with me in such a way, that I came closer.

The next thing I knew, he swung high enough to let go of the branch and grab my shirt with both feet. NOW I had this giant bird standing on my chest looking down on me...

"Hello," He says, and then he put his head upside down on my forehead NOSE TO BEAK, "Head scratch?!" THAT WAS NOT A REQUEST. THAT WAS AN INSTRUCTION... GET BUSY! I played with that bird for two hours non-stop after that. In fact, his owner had to "bribe him" off my arm when it was time to go home because he latched on with both feet and his beak and did the full on "we shall not be moved" number...

Needless to say, I was hooked from that point on! Like I wasn't already a macaw addict...

 

[Jumpinslizzy]

I work at a shop and get to interact with 2 females. One is 15 years old and the other is about 2. I personally have a greenwing (our military passed about a year ago). The hyacinths are the goofiest of all our macaws(and we have quite a few). My recommendation when working with them is to stand your ground. This goes for any macaw, but much more so with these guys. Ours try to get on shoulders all the time, and if you let them, you can be in some trouble. The best advice is to be firm with these birds. Your way or the highway. They don't get to not step up if they don't feel like it. That's not to say that if a bird is showing fear and goes into extreme defense mode, it definitely should be left alone and you should come back later. Once they know that they make the decisions in the relationship, you're done. These are not for the timid. All birds bite, you will be bitten.

I know that there are a lot of birds out there that need to be rescued, but with something like this I would shoot for a baby. Preferably close by so that you can interact with it and possibly be involved with supervised handfeeding before the bird is weened. Hyacinths can take a year to fully ween so you have plenty of time to build that bond. Let me know if you have any other specific questions as I work with them every day and have handfed them as well.

I did want to add something about cages. It does depend on the bird. We have one of the hyacinth's in a stainless and one in a powder coated. Neither chew the bars. Don't get me wrong, stainless is nice. But if you get a powder coated with good welds you should be fine. I think there was a lot of hype over a YouTube video of one picking apart the bars. Again, not saying that it can't or won't happen, but ours is fine a powder coated macaw size cage.

 

[alcmene]

Where is your store?

I think my next step needs to be to meet in person as many Hyacinths as possible. But it's not like there's one of them on every street corner! I'm in Alabama. Does anybody have a hy (or know of one in a shop or something) within a day's drive of me that would be willing to let me visit?

 

[EnglishMuffin]

My suggestion would be go to any and all bird-specific pet stores and avian vets in your area and ask if they have any clients/customers with a hy and would they be willing to pass on your contact information. The tropical bird store and vet that I use for sootie sets up a network between their customers for these kinds of situations. It's a good place to start!