clipped wings after being fully flighted for almost a year

[nicolee003]

Yogi will be a year old in a week. I brought him home when he was six weeks old and he has been flying since then. Well the past month he changed in a bad way. He would bite (attack) us multiple times a day and would draw blood every time. It would just be out of no where. He would be snuggling up with me then attack me out of nowhere. The past few days he has been flying at us and attacking our necks and faces . It was to the point that we were scared to walk around the house. He got me right next to my eye and if it were a little over he could have blinded me. I talked to a local family owned bird store and she suggested clipping him. (Shecalled it an attitude adjustment) It's been 3 days and he is completely different. I feel likeiI went and exchanged him for another bird. He is so sweet and wants to snuggle all the time. I made sure to buy more toys to keep him busy and he hasn't bit at all I guess he just got too spoiled . He had 4 cages/play stands around the house and was never locked up because one of us is almost always here. I felt so bad to clip him but I felt like we were out of options. The day before we got him clipped he was literally in his cage all day because of biting . We put him in it after he bit me in the morning then every time I tried to let him out he would attack me. I guess having him clipped is better than having him stuck in his cage all day

 

[MikeyTN]

Fly attack can be very dangerous, I take it he's old enough to go through his hormone changes??

 

[faeryphoebe1]

I know that some people here may pounce all over me for saying this, but you've got to do what's right for you and your family. There have been times when I've seriously considered having my GCC's wings clipped, too. The vet tech said the same thing about attitude adjustment a few months ago.

Trixie has become much more aggressive since becoming fully flighted, though she's not at the level of aggression that yours was at. She flies to my husband and bites hard enough to draw blood. If we try to take her away, then she bites us. So far we put her back in her cage when she does this, but it's cutting down on her out of cage time.

My husband doesn't interact with our birds because he didn't grow up with animals. He only interacts with our dog, so I don't know if Trixie senses some apprehension on his part and then tests him? Not sure. Anyhow, I'm glad that your little one is sweet again.

 

[Featheredsamurai]

I'm glad that worked for him, but be prepared for more hormonal aggression. The clipping will only work for so long. You should start trick training & touch training if you havn't already, it's a great way to redirect hormonal aggression.

 

[faeryphoebe1]

Like the other posters, I was also thinking that this might be hormonally driven behavior.

 

[MikeyTN]

When they do fly attack, when it can cause you serious injury, this is the time I usually will clip a bird without hesitation. Cause once they do some major damage to one of the family member, then you would think twice about keeping them. It's best to prevent before it actually happens. It's not a fun thing to go through either, I know that first hand when Java the U2 flew across the room towards my partner trying to attack. My partner ran into the bathroom and shut the door while I retrieve Java. Clicker and treat training does not apply to Java. When he sees or hear the clicker, he wants to kill it and ignore all treats. During hormone, even with my other birds, treats doesn't cut it. I usually just let them run their course until it's over. Then they become sweet babies once again.

 

[faeryphoebe1]

Maybe I need to look into trick training or clicker training. I don't really know how it works or where to start. My hubby is sometimes the "scapegoat". If I'm cleaning Trixie's cage she will fly to him, land near him and begin biting his arm, lol. I know that it's really not funny but that bird is a riot!

 

[MonicaMc]

For a bird who has suddenly become aggressive, I would recommend clicker training/positive reinforcement training before I would suggest clipping the bird.

 

[faeryphoebe1]

Any good videos out there for clicker training/positive reinforcement? We're not gonna clip her. She's just such a handful, lol.

 

[MikeyTN]

There's MANY clicker training videos all over YouTube you can watch all day long....all are basically the same so any one of those will give you the idea on how to do it...

 

[faeryphoebe1]

Thanks, Mikey, Monica & Copper. It's time for me to help her out more (and stop laughing at my husband's expense).

 

[MikeyTN]

Oh...Tell him to buy more toys and treats before the end of the expense report....

 

[nicolee003]

Thanks everyone for all the info/suggestions. We were working on the training but he wants nothing to do with it before we got him clipped. He HATED the clicks. He attacks that too. I understand this may be a hormonal change but I gave it over a month and it was just getting worse. I am such as animal person and have never thought of getting rid of any pet but it was getting to the point where I started thinking of my options. Clipping was my last resort before thinking of revoking him and I'm happy with my choice. I'm going to work more on the training now that he's actually manageable. He is mostly potty trained though . When he molts and his flight feathers grow back I won't clip them unless he starts attacking again. For those who think clipping was wrong, what would you have suggested other than training since he wanted nothing to do with that?

 

[Pajarita]

My dear, I am not trying to make you feel bad but if you were not able to train your bird, the fault lies with you and not the bird. All animals are trainable, the trick is to do it the way it's going to work with that particular species and that particular animal. And target training (you don't really need to use the clicker) works for all parrots (even wild-caught).

I don't believe in clipping under any circumstances (and yes, I deal with aggressive birds every single day so I know what you are talking about -only mine are male wild-caught amazons- but I also had a very aggressive 2 year old male GCC I took in from the sister of the original owner and he turned out to be just fine in a matter of a few weeks). I did clip one bird years ago after more than two years of constant aggression and although he could no longer attack me in flight -which was a relief- I regretted it almost immediately precisely because of the change in 'attitude' - he went from an assertive, self-assured bird to one that obviously felt very insecure and vulnerable (he actually hid for days) and I took this as a personal failure on my part.

Please insist on the training. It will take two whole years for him to be the way he was before you clipped him so you have plenty of time to figure out how to make it work with him.

 

[MonicaMc]

Any good videos out there for clicker training/positive reinforcement? We're not gonna clip her. She's just such a handful, lol.

Actually, they are not all the same. The concept is the same, but not everyone knows how to do it correctly.

I would recommend Barbara Heidenreich, Lara Joseph, Susan Friedman, Karen Pryor, Melinda Johnson, Jim McKendry, Steve Martin.... Perhaps even Pamela Clark and Kelly Balance.

Thanks everyone for all the info/suggestions. We were working on the training but he wants nothing to do with it before we got him clipped. He HATED the clicks. He attacks that too. I understand this may be a hormonal change but I gave it over a month and it was just getting worse. I am such as animal person and have never thought of getting rid of any pet but it was getting to the point where I started thinking of my options. Clipping was my last resort before thinking of revoking him and I'm happy with my choice. I'm going to work more on the training now that he's actually manageable. He is mostly potty trained though . When he molts and his flight feathers grow back I won't clip them unless he starts attacking again. For those who think clipping was wrong, what would you have suggested other than training since he wanted nothing to do with that?

I agree with Pajarita. A clicker is not required. Even if it is often recommended, the same concept of training can be done without a clicker. You can even use a different item or a sound. Quite a few of the trainers and behaviorists that I mentioned don't use clickers.

 

[nicolee003]

My dear, I am not trying to make you feel bad but if you were not able to train your bird, the fault lies with you and not the bird. All animals are trainable, the trick is to do it the way it's going to work with that particular species and that particular animal. And target training (you don't really need to use the clicker) works for all parrots (even wild-caught).

I don't believe in clipping under any circumstances (and yes, I deal with aggressive birds every single day so I know what you are talking about -only mine are male wild-caught amazons- but I also had a very aggressive 2 year old male GCC I took in from the sister of the original owner and he turned out to be just fine in a matter of a few weeks). I did clip one bird years ago after more than two years of constant aggression and although he could no longer attack me in flight -which was a relief- I regretted it almost immediately precisely because of the change in 'attitude' - he went from an assertive, self-assured bird to one that obviously felt very insecure and vulnerable (he actually hid for days) and I took this as a personal failure on my part.

Please insist on the training. It will take two whole years for him to be the way he was before you clipped him so you have plenty of time to figure out how to make it work with him.

I have had 4 birds in my life and this one is much different than the others. I don't believe the fault is mine at all. I know how to deal with and train parrots. This one is much different and was very aggresive. Also, not all animals are trainable. I am very happy with my decision. He is not depressed at all and has been doing great since he was clipped. He hasn't bitten us one time and has been out of his cage all day every day. Also, birds flight feathers don't take two years to be back to normal, it takes six months. And at that point I will let them grow out and see if he goes back to biting or not. Clipping was a last resort. We have scabs and scars all over us, even our faces and he wouldn't learn so I felt like clipping him was the right thing to do. I was expecting people to be upset with my decision but I am satisfied with my choice.

 

[Pajarita]

My dear, I am not trying to make you feel bad but if you were not able to train your bird, the fault lies with you and not the bird. All animals are trainable, the trick is to do it the way it's going to work with that particular species and that particular animal. And target training (you don't really need to use the clicker) works for all parrots (even wild-caught).

I don't believe in clipping under any circumstances (and yes, I deal with aggressive birds every single day so I know what you are talking about -only mine are male wild-caught amazons- but I also had a very aggressive 2 year old male GCC I took in from the sister of the original owner and he turned out to be just fine in a matter of a few weeks). I did clip one bird years ago after more than two years of constant aggression and although he could no longer attack me in flight -which was a relief- I regretted it almost immediately precisely because of the change in 'attitude' - he went from an assertive, self-assured bird to one that obviously felt very insecure and vulnerable (he actually hid for days) and I took this as a personal failure on my part.

Please insist on the training. It will take two whole years for him to be the way he was before you clipped him so you have plenty of time to figure out how to make it work with him.

I have had 4 birds in my life and this one is much different than the others. I don't believe the fault is mine at all. I know how to deal with and train parrots. This one is much different and was very aggresive. Also, not all animals are trainable. I am very happy with my decision. He is not depressed at all and has been doing great since he was clipped. He hasn't bitten us one time and has been out of his cage all day every day. Also, birds flight feathers don't take two years to be back to normal, it takes six months. And at that point I will let them grow out and see if he goes back to biting or not. Clipping was a last resort. We have scabs and scars all over us, even our faces and he wouldn't learn so I felt like clipping him was the right thing to do. I was expecting people to be upset with my decision but I am satisfied with my choice.

I'm afraid you will be disappointed if you expect him to regain all his primaries in six months. Parrots have only one full molt a year (pet parrots would, sometimes, have a partial molt around January triggered by the lengthening of the days after the winter solstice) and they always molt half their feathers (too dangerous to molt them all, it would ground them and they would become sitting ducks to predators) so, if you clip this time of the year (when the annual molt is almost done), it would require two years for all his primaries to grow back. Check it out, you'll see I am right.

I've cared for hundreds of birds (I am not counting passerines or columbines, only psittacines) and I can assure you that all parrots are trainable. All of them without exception. Some of them are more difficult than others, that's all. I don't mean to antagonize you (I can tell that you are upset about my posting even though you said you expected negative comments and I am sorry about that) but if I can train a fully flighted, BIG and MEAN 30 year old wild-caught male amazon used as a breeder all his life not to attack me (and I am no Parrot Wizard!), I doubt your one year old GCC cannot. It's a matter of finding the right approach so, please, don't let your upset with my opinion influence you and keep on trying because everybody who knows anything about parrots will tell you that clipping does not make aggression disappear. It just makes the bird so vulnerable that he doesn't dare do anything (very old and sick birds never bite either).

 

[legal_eagle]

Don't feel bad ... you did exactly the right thing. By clipping his wings you stopped a bad trend that was probably going to become ingrained. And with his temporary dependence on you he will learn a new way of relating to you that will very likely carry over to when his flight feathers grow back.

 

[MikeyTN]

I actually have to agree with Pajarita! All parrots are trainable as it just depends on how you train them. Some may require a bit more expertise then what some people know how to do as they require some extensive training methods. It's not as simple as it may seem to train a bird.

 

[Echo]

Thanks everyone for all the info/suggestions. We were working on the training but he wants nothing to do with it before we got him clipped. He HATED the clicks. He attacks that too. I understand this may be a hormonal change but I gave it over a month and it was just getting worse. I am such as animal person and have never thought of getting rid of any pet but it was getting to the point where I started thinking of my options. Clipping was my last resort before thinking of revoking him and I'm happy with my choice. I'm going to work more on the training now that he's actually manageable. He is mostly potty trained though . When he molts and his flight feathers grow back I won't clip them unless he starts attacking again. For those who think clipping was wrong, what would you have suggested other than training since he wanted nothing to do with that?

There is no wrong, as far as I'm concerned, when it comes to clipping or not clipping. It depends on the bird and your situation.

No matter what, the bird's attitude plays a big part too. Some birds hate women for example, and that's that. Some hate glasses or colored hair. Some attack other birds or people when flighted because they know they can fly away fast, after doing the deed. Sometimes you just can't change that, no matter what.

Safety for all is first IMO. All my birds are flighted at the moment, however, I have clipped some of them because of aggression between them (and one Pionus flying at me to bite, multiple times). Each time the flight feathers grow back, they get another chance to get along, the same way they do when clipped. There is also absolutely no "flying and attacking us" behavior allowed.

Guess what, I have hormonal ups and down as well! And sometimes I want to hurt other humans!......However, I am told that even though I own a gun, I'm not allowed to use it on people......RATS!!! LOL