Crop stasis/flushing the crop urgent!

[SilverSage]

I just posted, but this is a new question. I have a rescue batch of baby budgies that I just got out of a bad situation. We are concerned that they may have crop stasis, we have been told if they do we will need to flush their crops, but we dont know what we are looking for, or how to do it if we have to! They are from two clutches, the youngest looks 1.5-2 weeks, the oldest may be as old as 4 weeks (almost feathered but still tiny and acting like the others). I know it is hard to explain online but at this point I am willing to call strangers on the phone for help.

 

[Sterling1113]

Oh no. I just read this and your other post. I'm sorry you're going through this.
I don't have any advice, but I wanted to say please don't take it too personally if you can't save them- it sounds like they came to you(or you went to them?) in critical condition, you did a big thing by taking them into your care.
Wishing you the best. I'll be following your thread(s).

 

[SilverSage]

Update: We just finished feeding, the whole process took about 2 hours. We got lots of poop, though we were not able to verify that each one had gone. The 2 youngest were eager to feed and have very full crops, the 2 oldest we are very concerned about, and the 4 in the middle caught on eventually, though we expect a similar ordeal in 3-4 hours when we feed them again. We removed all the globbed on, hardened poop ball, some of which were bigger than the legs are long. We are not sure if the beak issues are caused by the poop caked on, or if the poop caked on because of the beak problems, but for now we have more immediate concerns. The good news is that everyone seems to have good use of their legs now that they are free, and most had good feeding responses. Now that it has been several hours we were able to see that each crop was less full than when we got them, though not all seemed as empty as we would have hoped.

This is going to be a long few weeks, neither I nor my friend (she is actually a member of this board, amjokai) has ever hand fed before, and we know that these birds may not make it. We were all prepared to lose them, or so we thought, but by the time I got all the poop off of them, I was too attached. Any support or advice anyone has to offer would be greatly appreciated.

Of course it goes without saying that we are keeping them far away from our other birds.

 

[Pinkbirdy]

Theirs info on the internet [I know they use baking soda ]. I don't know the amount . This is serious stuff . My macaw died from not being able to get into the vet for a day and a half [ I didnt due the flush). I would learn how to do it.

 

[henpecked]

Several important factors come to mind. I've never flush their crop. Temp of birds ,brooder , and food can determine how long it takes for food to digest. You want crop to empty at least once a day ( usually during the night). Crop should be empty at AM feeding. Food should be close 105 F ,with no "hot spots". before AM feeding when crop is empty, check for hard lumps in crop. This could be yeast deposits , also look for hard white lumps inside mouth area. Buy the book by Howard Voren / Rick Jordan " Parrots,handfeeding and nursery mangement". You can find it used on amazon.com for cheap. PS i don't normally check this section , you can always PM me if needed.

 

[Allee]

I just wanted to wish you the best, these little guys sound so fragile. It's impossible to take care of them and not get attached. I hope you find all the information and support you need to help them.

 

[SilverSage]

We got some advice from a local breeder, we added baking soda, cinnamon, and garlic to kill any yeast that might be growing in them from their horrible conditions. We just finished feeding number two, it is about 5:30 AM here in Hawaii. We got confirmed poops out of every bird, and every bird's crop was mostly empty, so we are encouraged. Also the two youngest fed right away and eagerly, and everyone is a lot more fiesty than they were last night. We are still concerned for the oldest two, they are really resisting. We have thermometers and humidity gauges, and we are committed, but so far each feeding has taken 2 hours with 2 people, myself and amjokai.

 

[Terry57]

I am so glad you have help with this, what a wonderful thing y'all are doing for these babies. Sending hopeful thoughts and prayers for the babies.

 

[Kiwibird]

Glad you were able to get some advice to help these poor babies. Hope they all pull through and come out healthy! Sounds like you're doing a great job given the situation

 

[SilverSage]

Thanks. We tried hard to not get attached, but that lasted all of about 5 minutes. We both cried as we left, we felt like we had just bought puppy mill puppies, taken the sick animals and left the owner behind to create more. He seemed honestly just elderly and wildly ignorant - he genuinely seemed to care about the birds, yet they were in horrible conditions. My friend went inside his house to use the bathroom and said it was clean, tidy, with no expensive things, the kind of house where they might have needed our money for food, but were not wasteful. And by our money, I mean almost $200... we may have left with a bunch of adult birds as well...

 

[henpecked]

The older babies may have been parent raised and it will take longer for them to adjust to handfeeding. You'll figure out the handfeeding , you'll get your own "system" and it'll get easier. (you really should look for a copy of that book, i'm sure it will save you some babies)

 

[SilverSage]

I will definitely look for that book! So far everyone seems to be doing well, all crops emptying and most babies feeding better. amjokai has them at her house for the weekend (we were both there, it was a joint thing) and I will have them starting monday, though we did the first two feedings together. It would be better to have just one person doing it, but neither of us planned this out ahead of time, it was a last minute dire choice when we saw the state they were in.

 

[Allee]

I'm glad to hear you are getting your feeding system worked out and the babies seem to be doing better already. So good of you to work so hard for these little ones.

 

[SilverSage]

The older babies may have been parent raised and it will take longer for them to adjust to handfeeding. You'll figure out the handfeeding , you'll get your own "system" and it'll get easier. (you really should look for a copy of that book, i'm sure it will save you some babies)

I know this is a super old post but I am digging up the old threads for a new member here, the mommy of all the surviving baby budgies from this ordeal! She goes by ArmyofBirds here

I just wanted to say, I did order that book. It took a very long time to arrive, and we ended up losing two babies. I believe that if I had had that book to begin with, they would have lived. It was very informative and went far beyond what I was able to find on the Internet.

 

[EllenD]

As far as the chick that is already in Crop-Stasis, if he's still alive,]you need to buy a bottle of unflavored Pedialyte (as he will dehydrate extremely fast at his size if he misses even one feeding, so he needs the electrolytes, as do the other 2 chicks), as well as a bottle of Avian Probiotic Powder at Petco/Petsmart (they both sell bottles of Qwiko Avian Probiotics for $10), OR a much better option that will save him if he's still alive at this point, but even if he's not it will save the other 2 chicks as long as you get the temperature corrected immediately, Walmart sells a Probiotic Supplement for humans that costs only $5.96 a bottle (I'm close, it's right under $6 a bottle), made by Spring Valley supplements/vitamins company (Walmart sells all of their supplements and vitamins in the human vitamin aisle, the Spring Valley bottles are dark green and have bright yellow caps and labels), that is called "Multi-Enzyme Digestive Formulawith Probiotics"...The reason that this is a much better option for this issue is because it not only contains multiple strains of Probiotics, which will help to add a ton of beneficial-bacteria to their GI Tracts, which will immediately start to get the yeast under control, but it also contains ALL of the naturally-occuring Digestive-Enzymes that are normally found in their Crops and throughout the rest of the GI Tracts, and they will help to immediately get their Crops moving again, or in the case of the other 2 chicks, if they haven't reached the Slow-Crop or Crop-Stasis stage yet, this will keep it from happening. I always keep Probiotics as well as Digestive-Enzymes on-hand whenever I'm hand-feeding a clutch, because even though my formula temperature and my Brooder temperature is always correct, it's still quite possible for chicks who are only 2 or 3 weeks-old to develop yeast infections or simply develop Slow-Crop or Crop-Stasis for some other reason...

What you want to do is crush one of the Spring Valley "Multi-Enzyme Digestive Formula with Probiotics" tablets into as fine a powder as you can get it (they crush easily) and then put the powder into a little baggie or small, plastic container so that you'll have it on-hand...Then you need to get a clean, microwave-safe container and pour 1 cup of unflavored Pedialyte (use a measuring cup) in the microwave-safe container...Then add 1 Teaspoon of the powdered Digestive-Enzymes/Probiotics tablet to the 1 cup of unflavored Pedialyte, and then mix it very, very well, until all of the powder is dissolved into the Pedialyte...Then you want to microwave this for 30 seconds, take it out, and then mix it up again very well...You'll have to use the cooking/candy thermometer to make sure that the temperature of this is also between 104 and 110 degrees F, and you're going to give this to each chick in-place of one of their hand-feedings of formula...You cannot just keep putting formula on top of the already-rotting formula that is sitting inside of the sick chick's Crop, and this mixture of the Digestive-Enzymes and Probiotics will typically start their Crops clearing within about 15-20 minutes of them getting it. They may or may not take it, sometimes getting a flavored Pedialyte like Grape, Cherry, Fruit Punch, etc. works better to get them to take it, but the chick who is already in Crop-Stasis should be very thirsty and hopefully you can get them all to take a good amount of the mix...I'd actually recommend getting a flavored Pedialyte instead of the unflavored now that I think about it, because they should be willing to take that more readily...You want to give them as much of this as they will willingly take OR 1cc/ml, whichever comes first...The you wait and watch the Crop to see if it is starting to empty...YOU CANNOT FEED THE SICK CHICK ANYMORE FORMULA UNTIL YOU SEE THEIR CROP START EMPTYING, BECAUSE YOU'LL JUST MAKE IT WORSE. So if you give the sick chick at least 1cc/ml of the Pedialyte/Digestive Enzyme/Probiotic mixture and it starts to empty but doesn't empty completely, then give that chick another feeding of the mixture until the Crop completely empties, and then you can give him a formula-feeding that contains some Apple Cider Vinegar mixed into it from now forward.

If the Crops of the other 2 chicks are still emptying fine, I would still give them one dose of the Pedialyte/Digestive Enzymes/Probiotic mix, let it work it's way through and wait for their Crops to again empty, then you can go back to feeding them the hand-feeding formula, but I would add some Apple-Cider Vinegar to the formula just in-case...I don't know how much formula you are mixing-up at one time, but you want to add 1 drop of Apple-Cider Vinegar to every 1ml/cc of hand-feeding formula they eat (you cannot keep already-mixed formula for more than 12-hours, even in the fridge, as it starts growing an enormous amount of harmful-Bacteria as soon as it cools, so you must throw any you have left out after 12-hours since you first mixed it up and make new)...I would not feed the chick with the Crop-Stasis anything but the Pedialyte/Digestive Enzyme/Probiotic mix for the rest of today/tonight and then tomorrow morning you could try a little bit of formula at the correct 104-110 degrees F, like maybe give him 1ml/cc of it first thing tomorrow morning that has 1 drop of Apple Cider Vinegar, make sure his Crop empties normally and he only has a small bit left in the bottom of his Crop after 2-3 hours, and then if it does then go back to normal hand-feeding times and amounts with 1 drop of ACV added for each ml/cc of formula...

 

[EllenD]

Just as a follow-up, if the chick with Crop-Stasis is still alive and if you give him a feeding of the Pedialyte/Digestive-Enzyme/Probiotic mix and his Crop empties at least a noticeable amount, then you want to give him another 1ml/cc of the mixture every 2-3 hours until his Crop empties COMPLETELY...Only then can you feed him 1ml/cc of hand-feeding formula that contains 1 drop of the Apple-Cider Vinegar, wait another 2-3 hours to see if his Crop is almost empty or completely empty, and then keep him on formula with 1 drop of ACV for every 1ml/cc of formula....

****If the Pedialyte/Digestive-Enzyme/Probiotic mixture doesn't seem to be helping to empty his Crop much, the next step is going to be giving him some of the Pedialyte mixed with a bit of a regular Alka-Seltzer tablet, which is another thing you should always have on-hand when planning to hand-feed chicks.

 

[chris-md]

Um, Ellen? Thread is 5 years old. I’m certain this has long since been resolved.

 

[SilverSage]

Um, Ellen? Thread is 5 years old. I’m certain this has long since been resolved.

There seem to be posts missing from yesterday; there was a new baby needing help.


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[chris-md]

Aaaaah. Gotcha!

 

[Flboy]

Um, Ellen? Thread is 5 years old. I’m certain this has long since been resolved.

There seem to be posts missing from yesterday; there was a new baby needing help.


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That explains a lot! I thought the forum was struggling, but I blamed the WiFi!