Leg ID Band???

[Aussie Ben]

Stumbled across this video, thought you guys might find it informative - especially those of you over in the states. It discusses leg banding and micro chipping.

YouTube - Bird Care - What to Use to Identify Your Bird

 

[Bobby34231]

Thanks Ben, spot on with what we've been discussing!......Bob

 

[Beilana]

Very informative! What about the alcohol she sprayed on him, when he goes to preen his feathers. I hope they wash that off!

 

[Birdamor]

Well, the info given in the video is not completely accurate. For one thing, it's not always entirely up to the breeder which information goes on the chip because there are states that require you put their two letter abreviation on the chip to indicate that the bird was born there. And then there are national associations that require you purchase their own bands which would contain certain information they require be put there -like the Spanish Timbrado's, for example- and who keep track of all birds of that particular species or breed (in this case, it's a breed).

Here are a few links that discuss the dangers of microchipping animals:

This one is a recap of a 52 page report:
http://www.antichips.com/cancer/albrecht-microchip-cancer-synopsis.pdf

This is the 52 page report:
http://www.antichips.com/cancer/albrecht-microchip-cancer-full-paper.pdf

This is an article in the Washington Post:
Chip Implants Linked to Animal Tumors - washingtonpost.com

This is about a chihuahua who bled to death from the implant procedure:
Natural Health News: Dog Bleeds to Death After "Routine" Microchip Implant

 

[Mel]

Here in Sydney when a vet chips an animal the vet fills out his/her details, the animals details and the breeder fills out thier details. one copy is kept by the vet, one is sent to the registry and the other is given to the breeder. When the animal is sold the breeder fills out the new owners details and sends it in to the office.

As for the anti-chipping article the one study that mentioned dogs did not say how many where chipped, they used lab rats and mice - they are prone to tumours and the Washington post article stated in the finding of the studies they used... "none of the studies had a control group of animals that did not get chips, the normal rate of tumors cannot be determined and compared to the rate with chips implanted." so I am not conviced. The poor dog that bled to death was terrible but the vet did say that they may have nicked the muscle, as I mentioned before I have never seen or heard of any adverse reactions following correct proceedures (we chipped thousands & thousands of dogs and cats over the years as it is a legal requirement here).

Again I'm only talking about dogs and cats. I don't have any plans on chipping my girls at this point more due to trauma and stress of the proceedure. Just another note I do agree with the owners of "Charlie" I don't think it should be the law.

 

[Mel]

Stumbled across this video, thought you guys might find it informative - especially those of you over in the states. It discusses leg banding and micro chipping.

YouTube - Bird Care - What to Use to Identify Your Bird

Very interesting Ben ... thanks

Very informative! What about the alcohol she sprayed on him, when he goes to preen his feathers. I hope they wash that off!

Alcohol dries very quickly so shouldn't be an issue.

 

[Bobby34231]

while finding those articles on incidents of cancer in relation to microchipping interesting and informative, I also find them somewhat confusing ,while the results being found in the field of science, most results were not found scientificly, as I read it, the discovery of cancer in micochipped mice was discovered in test subjects undergoing other experiments not related to the microchips, another thing that stood out to me was the big difference in the percentage of those mice that contracted cancer among the different reports, ranging from roughly 1% to a high of 10%,showing that these are random results, not scientific results, scientific results would be blind studies where you took like 1000 mice and randomly implanted 500, treat them all the same, ie food water,shelter ect for a period of time, then at the end of the study check your findings.
I did notice in report article that they did do specific testing in relation to microchipping and cancer for a year, the incidents of cancer in mice and dogs seemed very low according to the statistics they showed, microchipping in animals has been around for over 15 years now,i dont know the exact count of animals chipped, but one would have to think it would be in the 10's of millions world wide by now, I think back a couple of years ago to the dog food produced in China and how quickly the problem was found and remedied, that was just after a few months and a small percentage of dogs becoming sick, some actually dying, I would truely hope that if microchips were as dangerous as those articles made them out to be(think about it 10% of millions of animals would be an epidemic) they would have been pulled off the market long ago.....

 

[Birdamor]

Well, when it comes to carcinogens, you need to realize there is a problem first, then do the specific studies. There have been countless carcinogens that were not identified as such for many years because they were slow acting or simply because nobody put two and two together. Animal microchipping has only been around since the 90s so we are not talking about a whole lot of time from a historical point of view, and cancer been so very common nowadays in dogs and cats, it could be a matter of vets just diagnosing and treating the cancer without looking for a cause (I don't know any who would bother). I also don't think there are THAT many microchipped dogs and cats (I don't count farm animals because they are not that closely monitored). This could be a misperception as I live in the country (I assume it's more common in the cities) but none of my animals are and I don't know that many people who have had their animals done either - and I do know A LOT of people with dogs and cats and have access to information on hundreds of them because I also run a dog and cat shelter (we don't microchip).

Of course, when you talk about carcinogens, you always talk about statistics (not everybody who smokes get cancer and not every woman after 35 who is on the pill gets breast cancer) and it is true that the studies are not that specific and the numbers don't appear to be that reliable but, the way I look at it is that if there is a chance in a million of something completely unnecessary harming any of my animals, I just won't risk it. And that's why I will not microchip or recommend it. Plenty of bad stuff out there that I can do nothing about, why add an 'iffy' to it?

 

[Bobby34231]

I'm not really sure on the number of chipped animals either, I did read an article that stated since 1989 there were over 7 million dogs and cats chipped, with registrations of new animals at about 8,000 a week, it didn't mention if that was world wide or just the U.S.,and it wasn't dated so I don't have any idea how old the info was, I have noticed in the past few years more and more dog breeders are microchipping on their own, feeling it makes for a better selling tool, I also noticed that many shelters today, in addition to spaying and neutering of adoptable pets they too are microchipping, then as you mentioned, farmers and ranchers chipping their livestock, as well as zoos around the world that now chip their charges, so I guess with about 20 years and millions of test subjects available, better studies and statistics could be had, thats if anyone wanted to spend the time and money needed, but with an attitude of hey their only animals who cares, the facts may not come to light for many years to come, i think the only reason there is any discussion now is because they want to know the dangers of human implantation, all in all I guess it comes down to personal choice, with one having to weigh the advantages against the possible side effects............
Bob.

 

[Mel]

I guess it's a bit like vaccinations of which I think the possible side effects are much more common than microchipping. Weigh up the pros and cons and go with what you fell is best for you and your bird

 

[Bobby34231]

Yup I'm with you Mel, it pretty much comes down to what we feel is best for our birdie buddies, I found this thread very informitive and stimulating, thanks to all that contributed, even if we did kind of hijack and spin it a bit from the original content.....lol

Bob

 

[Mel]

Yup I'm with you Mel, it pretty much comes down to what we feel is best for our birdie buddies, I found this thread very informitive and stimulating, thanks to all that contributed, even if we did kind of hijack and spin it a bit from the original content.....lol

Bob

Yes we did didn't we...... that tends to happen here. Nothing like a good "discussion"!

 

[caneschica]

speaking of vaccinations-there are MANY more studies done on the harmful effects of yearly vaccines (rabies included) for dogs/cats than there are for microchipping.

the high-kill shelter here in Miami, they chip the dogs/cats before they go home to their forever home, because not only is it helpful in finding the animal if they ever go missing, but it's also proved helpful in cruelty cases as well.

Anyways, aside from that, I joined the Yahoo group that's specifically for getting info on legbands for birds, and I wasn't really given much of a helpful answer, lol. I understand how to read a legband, and when I submitted what is on the band of my Nanday Conure, I was told basically what each part meant........I am not my Nanday's first owner, his first owner took him to a pet store and basically wanted money for him, so the guy sold him to the pet store for the cash and I ended up seeing him there a few days later and i got him. His band does mention that he was born in Florida, but I would really like to know who the breeder/aviary/etc is. I have to double check the initials tomm morning when Tiki (my Nanday's name) is awake, because he is fast asleep now, lol, and hopefully this time around in this forum i wil have better luck, LOL!!
(there needs to be a Nanday icon!!! lol)

 

[MomtoPatti]

Now, my conure doesn't have an ID Band, and i know why it would be helpful, but i have a couple questions...

1.Where would I get one for him and how much are they
2.Are they really any useful if you are not letting them free fly outside, or let him outside for that matter the most I'd do is bring him out for 5 minutes, once or twice a week with a harness...

Where to buy: you can look up legband manufacturers on the internet. Or if you want, you can ask your local DNR for a legband, so that if your baby ever comes up missing, you can at least ID your baby via the legband.

Legbands are very important. Although my baby girl's isn't helping me find her, it will help me ID her if she is ever found. You may think your baby will never get out and come up missing, but mine did. My baby girl. I have reason to believe someone grabbed her up, because of the fact that usually when she'd get outside, she'd sit in the grass and squawk, letting me know where she was. June 5, 2011, she got outside. I've been searching for her ever since. I am heartbroken, nearly 6 mos pregnant and not eating or sleeping, until I am about ready to drop over. My home is in chaos without her. People do break into homes and steal birds as well.

In these times, you can never be too careful. For the love of your baby, get him/her a band, please? It will bring you a little more peace of mind.

 

[xreinx]

every animal that goes threw the shelter nowdays is microchiped, Id do it to myself if it were allowed and people accually scanned for that kind of stuff. the needle might be big, but its harmless and compleatly sanatary as it comes out of the package compleatly sterile. (ive chipped over 1000 dogs and cats total, Ive never had one bleed like in the link)

To say you would never recomend it is alittle harsh, its up to the person. Personally Id do it for every one of my animals because the chances of getting my bird back is that much higher if its chiped.

My cats have it, and the worse thing she suffers from, that I have no control over, Is hairballs. its the RV that I refuse to give her, injection sites of the Rabies often get hard lumps after a few weeks, that Scares me cause it can turn into canser.

To date, NONE of the chiped animals have come back with issues like that, though 5 cases of RV Lumps have been reported, and one had died of canser and Ive only been there a year and a half.

 

[Amber]

I didn't even know you could microchip birds...

Sure can! Alex is microchipped. Cost me $70AUD with anaesthetic since he is so tiny. It's a very good thing to have done. We travel a lot, and also live in a place where bird breeding, and as a result bird theft is rampant. A chip is one of the only foolproof ways to I.D your bird. Stolen birds will have their bands cut, but you can't see or remove a chip. It's very hard to prove ownership of a bird should he go missing or be stolen (just look at the number people claiming that that ekkie that made it onto the news thanks to his idiot owner was theirs),but chips can do that. Should you ever need to you can prove 100% that that is your bird.

Of course chips are only as useful as the shelters and vets the routinely scan birds to ensure they are not stolen or missing. I'm lucky that most to all places with a scanner here will scan exotic looking birds.

 

[Scotty T]

I'm not much of an expert on this topic but heres my 2 cents.

I grew up with a Parrot and a MaCaw. They never had bracelets.

I recently owned a green cheek with a girlfriend and it had a band. That was the first time I ever saw a band. I didn't really like it because of the dangers it could pose. This bird had it's wings clipped.

I just picked up my baby and it didn't have a band and I was concerned. My new baby is a flighted sun conure. I'm not going to clip it's wings. He loves following me from room to room and hanging out. It's an amazing experience.

I'm going to be especially careful, but also teach it to fly to me on command.

My final thoughts are if your bird flys away, you are pretty screwed and you better pray it figures out how to get back to you, I don't think a band is going to help that.

If you were not a bird owner, would you be able to get close enough to a pet bird outside and realize that it's someones pet?

If you were able to get close enough to this bird, would you know what the bracelet is let alone enough to even look at it without getting bitten being a stranger? And if you did know enough to do all that, who would you call?

It seems to me the chances of a bracelet being a savor are very small.

 

[Amber]

Little add on (I'm huge on microchipping, it returned a friends B&G macaw to her when she went 'missing' from her flight aviary -see, stolen-. Theft occured when her owner was home. She was reported missing to all pet stores and shelters and breeders in the area. Shown up a month later for sale at a pet store a few towns owner, a breeder noticed her and notified her owner. Petstore was very suss and refused to help her out, so she was scanned, and the police we're called to take her in as stolen property and return her to the owner. Without the chip the cops said they wouldn't have been able to do that as the owner couldn't prove the bird was hers.)

 

[Amber]

Another post. I'll shut up now.

I also find it hard to believe carcinogens could be a huge problem in chips, given the whole thing is coated in sterile glass. Any carcinogens in the mechanics of the chip itself are contained. Also many things are carcinogens. Plenty of the stuff we eat on a daily basis contains them. The makeup us women (and some of you guys :09 wear is full of them. Some of the preservatives in the pellets many of us feed our parrots are carcinogens. Carcinogen in most cases does not = cancer. It does mean an increased risk though. Sometimes very minor, like mineral oil (yep, that baby oil stuff you use on your kid. It's also allowed to be added to food, believe it or not) to major like asbestos.

In short, pretty much everything contributes to cell damage and cancer in the end.

But back to chipping! It comes down to weighing the pros and cons.

Cons being procedure risk (large needle into a small bird, anaesthetic being used, though both of these are minimal), finding an avian vet, and perhaps cost if you are not financially well off. Possibly other things like carcinogen could be included, but since no ones found a conclusive study on birds with clear results I think this is negligible at the moment.

Pros being a permanent, unmodifiable and non removable and lifelong form of I.D. which can be linked back to you nationwide (and depending on your chip 'ping back' frequency, world wide)

In my case with the high rate of bird theft in my area and because me and Alex travel alot, I decided the benefits of a chip greatly outweighed the small risk involved with the procedure since it gives us the greatest chance of being reunited should anything ever happen.

The procedure itself on a small bird (Alex is a Jenday conure, so this goes for anyone with similar sized bids) involved him being administered with a mild anaesthetic (If the bird cant remember what happened, he just waked up a little sore after all. I think this is important to avoid trauma) and the chip being inserted into the lower portion of the left breast muscle via syringe, pressure is then applied to stem any bleeding. Alex was kept in for observation for an hour, afterwards we were given a call to pick him up. He was happy and had no idea what had just happened apart from a sore spot on his chest. The chipping itself was done by a wonderful avian vet in near my town.

It's not for everyone, but in our case the pros outweighed the cons considering the rampant theft here and the large amount of travelling we do.

I also recommend checking out Introduction to Aviary Security and Theft Prevention at birdtheft.org on the topic of theft.