A definite bit of baptism by fire!

[UrbanLegend711]

I am a new member here; I have a working knowledge of parrot-keeping and do a lot of research, but I want to get to know other keepers and get help in this special case.

This past Friday, a friend of mine asked me if I could take her African grey parrot. It had originally been her mother's, but she lost interest and gave it to the grandmother, who moved in with Lisa and brought the bird with her. I could not get a very clear history on the bird, except that he/she had been with the family for 15-20 years...so I think he's between 20 and 30. The bird had not been handled in at least 5-10 years...he was living in a small cage. Lisa said he/she was friendly and curious and talked and took treats but bit hands.

I told her that I couldn't give a definite answer without discussing it with my fiance and meeting the bird to see how he/she reacted to us.

Lisa sent me some pictures of Baby and the cage she had for him/her:

I knew immediately that the cage was too small and empty. Lisa said they don't give Baby toys because "he just chews them up." He's a parrot...of course he will chew! One must have a sizable toy budget and buy toys specifically for them to chew!

So I went to meet Baby on Sunday...things were better in some ways than I expected when I went over to meet Baby, but worse in others. Baby bit me when I put my hand near him, but not hard and not until I was right next to him. He took treats from me through the cage bars, and talked to me and bobbed his head. However, the cage was not anywhere near ok. It was basically a parakeet cage....maybe 2 feet tall, 1.5 wide and a bit less deep. It was the kind with thin bars that clips onto a base. He'd been chewing up the walls around the cage. They were also pretty eager to get him out.

So, to make a long story short...he's here. Oh dear Lord he screamed so much when we tried to get him out of the old cage...the door was way too small for him to get out through, so we had to basically take the cage apart and gently grasp him in oven mitts. He was terrified and squawked and screamed. I found a proper parrot cage used for him that we grabbed on the way. It's 3 feet wide, 2 deep and 4 feet tall of interior space, with bars on the bottom that lift it up from the litter pan and a built-in stand. The whole thing stands almost 6 feet tall total. It has swing-out doors for food and water, and a large but narrow main door.

Baby's toenails are very overgrown, they are starting to wrap back around on themselves...his wings have not been clipped and his beak is overgrown because he had nothing to chew on except a cuttlefish bone he was ignoring. He now has a thick sand perch, a big piece of manzanita wood, a rope, and a dowel perch. He also has a rope swing and a yarn/wood/cardboard tear-apart toy.

He seems fine with hands being in the cage to fill bowls and such, but squawks and bolts up the sides of the cage when you get close. He does let me pet his feet when he's perched on the side of the cage though. I'm hopeful that he can be tamed down....I could not get a straight answer on his exact age, or when was the last time he'd been out of the cage or seen a vet. I called my vet and left a message on the way home that I need an appointment for him. His poop is very watery and green....not sure if that's just because he is stressed or if he had a bad diet. They gave me a huge amount of parrot food (pellet, nut, fruit, veggie mix stuff) that had been in jars in the kitchen. Lisa said the food was purchased last week. It looks a lot like Kaytee Fiesta type but I will try to find out. I also ordered 2 lbs of Dr. Harvey's Perfect Parrot food and have plenty of fresh veggies and fruit that my conure enjoys for Baby to also eat.

ALso, Baby seems insecure and unsteady traversing around the cage. He's very obviously not used to being able to move around much. I really hope that he settles in well and that he can be calmed down and accustomed to touch and being out of the cage. He was very protective of his old cage and very clearly didn't know that he could leave it.
Right now he seems utterly confused with what to do about all the space he has, but he's taken a baby carrot and a bit of broccoli stem from me, and comes right up to the front of the cage to watch us and mutter.

Here are the pictures I took of the cage I have for Baby now:

Any advice and pointers you guys can give me would be very much appreciated! I have always loved the greys and want to give this poor bird the best life that I can.

 

[Molcan2]

OH MY GOSH! Thank you sooooo much for taking this bird on, even if it doesn't work out, he needed to desperately get out of that situation. It makes me so angry that there are birds that still live that way . How sad. He is so lucky that you came along. Due to his age and his open band, he may be a wild caught bird (which makes me even angrier that - that still happens ). Good luck with him, I'm sure its just going to take a lot of time for him to get used to the changes. Thank you for helping this little guy out.

 

[Molcan2]

Oh, and welcome to the forum!

 

[friedsoup]

Ok he's gone through alot of changes new home, new house, new people, He needs time to understand that these changes are good a thing if you want him out just leave the cage door open while you sit and watch tv in a chair where you can watch him side glance and if he comes out just let him know you noticed but you want nothing for him he doesn't have to do anything but hang and be himself. Then you can move on from there and see how much he is willing to interact with you . remember he will be overcoming 5 to 10 years of neglect .

 

[wolf0994]

OMG wow, THANK YOU!!!! for giving that bird a home. Welcome to the forums and his life is already better. I want to give you some hope.

I adopted a 16 year old grey back in April. His cage situation was no where near what Baby's was. It was appropriate for a grey but he has been unhandleable without biting since his first year of life. They kept him in a cage with another parrot after he was a year old and he bonded to that cagemate. I was shown wounds that he had inflicted to the previous owners who had to use a dowel to get him up off the ground.

I have had him since April as I said before, since that time he has bitten twice, both in the first month, both drew blood but were really more like cat scratches that true bites. Since May no bites, he routinely gives kisses and lets us rub/pet/touch his beak. He is still leary of other parts of his body but it is coming along. He is cagebound meaning he does not like being off his cage. He has gotten down 3 times in 5 months. He will let me pick him up no problem at all from the ground, probably cuz he feels very vulnerable down there. But from his cage, forget it. But he is making progress. He will now reach out with one foot and touch your finger if he is inside his cage. If he is on top he will back away if your hand is closer than about 6 inches. All in all though, he is very loving, hilarious to watch, a joy to our house. And I am sure I will eventually be able to get him to step up from his cage, it will just take time. He had 15 years of rare human contact changed to daily contact.

So thank you again for giving your grey a good home and you will be able to undo some of that stress.

 

[UrbanLegend711]

Thank you, Wolf0994, that really gives me hope!
Today when I got home, Baby greeted me with a whoop-type whistle call and bobbed his head, so I said hello and told him what a good bird he was. I opened the door to put some fresh fruit in and figured he could get used to the door being open....well he clambered right on out and up the side of the cage. I tried to get him to climb onto a gloved hand, but he flapped off onto the floor and started waddling away. John, my fiance, gently directed him back into the open floor area and we corralled the dogs and cats away. John scooped up Baby and set him back in the cage. He flapped when he was close to the cage, but no squawking or growling....I just didn't expect him to come out so soon....and I got distracted for a second. His wings are not clipped or I wouldn't care if he was out. Now he wont' go near the door and growled at the glove when I put it, empty, in the cage for him to inspect. *sigh*

I didn't expect quite this level of 180 turn from him, and I'm worried now that I freaked him out with the whole floor expedition and recapture....

 

[UrbanLegend711]

Wolf, what did you do when he bit? How did you react that got him to stop...any advice on helping Baby learn to accept hands..like any specific activities you found helped?

 

[MollyGreenCheeks]

Welcome to the forum and thank you so much for taking care of this troubled Grey! You are doing a great thing here. So far it honestly sound like you are doing everything very well. Baby will recover from the latest expedition out of the cage very soon if not by tomorrow morning. As you stated he needs to be observed now especially because he is not clipped. The response to a Grey bite should be the same as every other parrot bite. Try not to make any loud sounds, try to roll your hand, finger out of it's mouth. I know that Green Cheeks are nothing like a Grey bite but if my babies bite I tell them "No" or "stop" and use my other hand to assist the beak in releasing if necessary. Today was the third time in over a year that I had blood drawn. Good times and good luck. Just remember that the success will be well worth the effort when its all said and done!

 

[PortaPerch]

Great work! That's a real touching story.

I cannot touch Greybeard, as he is bonded to wifey, but he always steps up on the PortaPerch for me. The wood perch on the end lets me maneuver him at will, whether I move him to another location, or just put the PortaPerch upright as a portable stand.

 

[Lintini]

Heya welcome!!

I adopted a CAG at the end of June that hadn't been handled in ~15 years and I am able to handle her now (I asked her to step up after 3 weeks of living with me) , I will post some of the threads for you to see how members here helped me with their great ideas!! I was originally adopting 2 but my cousin took the other, so here is Chloe's story!! Congrats on your new addition, I have never been happier!!!
http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/19673-getting-two-greys-advice.html

http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/20091-happy-not-handling.html

http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/20233-she-came-out-today.html

http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/20680-i-got-her-out-myself-today.html

 

[UrbanLegend711]

Thank you all for the warm welcome and help! Lintini, I will read all the links...I really really appreciate it.

Baby surprised me again....about 20 minutes after I posted my frustrations with the impromptu exploration and growling, John my fiance opened Baby's cage and was talking to him, and putting his hands in the cage. Baby watched intently but didn't go for his fingers unless he extended a hand in the parrot's direction. John backed away a bit, and Baby clambered on out of the cage again and went up on top of it. We both stood there talking to him...he'd scuttle over towards me, **** his head at me, whistle, bob his head....then scuttle over towards John and do the same, then back. We both had our arms crossed so Baby didn't feel threatened by the hands. But then I thought I would see if he would climb onto a perch...this set him flying away again...much stronger flight this time. He landed on the dining room table and John went to collect him. Baby grumbled a bit but didn't bite this time. Within another ten minutes he was back on top of the cage, whooping and chuckling. We let him stay up there for half an hour until we had to go to bed. Then it was another flying episode because he would not let us coax him back into the cage. This time I tried to gently scoop him up with gloved hands. He appears to really hate gloves (I wonder if they were used to forcibly restrain him?) and he flapped in my face and got away. John caught him and he grumbled loudly until we put him back in the cage...not attempts to bite though.

I feel like that was a LOT of progress for 24 hours. I just wish we didn't have to catch him and scoop him up. He can fly though and if he won't let us near we don't have much choice but to put the dogs upstairs when we let him explore. I don't want to confine him to the cage as he's spent way too long with no room to explore. He certainly didn't seem to upset with us, and whooped at us when we turned out the lights to go to bed. This was a LOT more than I expected so soon...I didn't think he'd venture out of his cage for weeks.

Also...whenever we hand him a treat, he takes it and dunks it in his water dish before eating it. It doesn't matter what it is....broccoli, banana, peanut, melon...it gets dunked in the dish, then fished out and eaten. Is this something that grey parrots do? I've never heard of it before, but then I don't have a ton of parrot experience.


Here are some pictures of Baby exploring the outside of the cage:

 

[Lintini]

That is so great, what a nice home he has now! Great cage! Does he like the swing? I was thinking about getting one for Chloe.

 

[UrbanLegend711]

He hasn't touched the swing. I don't think he has built up his confidence quite enough for that yet. He hadn't been able to stretch his wings even for a decade. It was encouraging to see that he could fly last night. I was scared that he'd hurt himself, but it means that at least his wings weren't clipped before he learned flight, so that should help him a bit.

 

[Conuregirl]

he looks really nice and i think you guys did an amazing thing helping him! it took me a month for my rescue to really trust me and have him step up from the cage. i remember the first night he wouldn't go in his cage and wanted to be on top, hiding in the back. now, he always wants me to pick him up lol.

 

[Lovelyloribeth]

What a beautiful ending story. He's gorgeous!

I also have to give you tons of kudos for taking him. In all reality, you saved his life! You should see a huge change in him after he is settled. What a relief that he can still fly. Poor baby. But at least he's in the best of homes now!!

I do not have a grey so I don't know their typical behaviors, but my conure, ChiChi dunks his food in his water dish. Pellets especially! I think mostly to soften it up to eat it more easily. But I hear it quite often and is a very typical behavior I hear. I am sure someone will chime in and confirm that it is normal for a grey.

 

[wolf0994]

Wolf, what did you do when he bit? How did you react that got him to stop...any advice on helping Baby learn to accept hands..like any specific activities you found helped?

Wow you have had alot of excitement! When Kawie bit, we just did our best to not jerk away. He has never broken skin with a "bite" to the finger. He has caused impressions in the skin though. The 2 skin breaks that I mentioned were both on the face. My son leaned in to give him a kiss and he scratched his upper lip with his upper beak. My wife was the other incident where he caught her in the side of her cheek and drew a small amount of blood. As I said before these were more like cat scratches than bad bleeding. He has grabbed my finger once during that first month, and it startled me so I did pull back rather fast which can be a mistake so try not to. All in all since April he has scratched 2 faces drawing blood and grabbed ahold of 3 fingers leaving impressions but no wounds. Each time he did it, we took a firm voice and told him "dont bite", then said "be soft". That seemed to work for my wife. I have heard some people will firmly (NOT HARD) grab the beak and say NO! Mainly you dont want him to be able to manipulate you through fear of biting. Stand firm and calm. Easy to say, hard to do sometimes.

Now second thing, I would stay away from the gloves. Kawie HATES gloves! I know your afraid of getting bit but Baby most likely views it as a threat. When Kawie flew down to the ground the first time I used a wooden spoon as thats what the previous owners mentioned. He didnt seem to care but was still spooked. The 2nd time my daughter was the one home and she used a round dog food bowl to get him to step onto. The last time I just instictively reached down with my bare hand and he stepped right up on it like it was his fav thing to do! Shocked me, I just set him back on his cage without thinking that I should have used that as a teaching tool to hold him for a bit and let him know it wasnt a dangerous thing. Then the last time was when we took him to the vet and had to get him to fly to the ground and I picked him up again bare handed, no problem and placed him in the bird carrier and when we got back opened the bird carrier and used my bare hand to get him out... no troubles at all. I was even able to let a couple of my kids hold him before we put him back on his cage. It was AWESOME I tell you! AWESOME! I felt so.... excited I guess is the best word to be able to hold him.

The best way I would say to get Baby to accept hands would be to offer treats anytime there is a good response. We did it anytime Kawie touched our finger or gave kisses. Basically anytime he did something we were happy with. If Baby lets you do anything I would reward it. We use grapes or something small that can be eaten fast so that they are looking for more to do it again. Used peanuts at first before I learned those can contain a fungus that can be harmful... he hasnt gotten a peanut since.

Oh last tidbit... to this day I coax Kawie into the cage with 1 or 2 small treats. I hate chasing him as I feel like it causes distrust. So when its bed time I get out a treat... and believe me he KNOWS! I tell him good night and I set them in his dish. He usually will watch me til I move away from the cage then he goes in. I tell him good night again and close the door and cover the cage. Make sure your covering his cage which is hard when they are that big. They need alot of sleep and can be quite grouchy without it. Unless Baby is in a room that is very very dark. At least that's the advice my vet gave me.

Oh and Kawie dunks bread in his water... and a few other things.

Best of luck!

 

[MollyGreenCheeks]

Looks like everything has been talked about several times and you seem to be doing a great job too. I can imagine how your thoughts were spinning as you tried to get to sleep!

Anyway, I just want to second Lovelyloribeth about food dunking. Many parrot dunk their food before eating it. It's perfectly normal so be prepared to be changing the water a few times daily1

 

[UrbanLegend711]

Thanks! Baby bit me hard on the fingertip this morning. I said, OW NO. NO Biting. I did kind of pull back though. I know that the previous owners were afraid of him biting, and I'm sure he knows that biting gets a loud response, and people to back off. It's hard to stop myself being afraid..I don't want a broken finger. They can break bones right?

Anyway, Baby readily takes treats from me. I usually give treats when he is curious and calm, never when he's acting afraid or growling. I will stop with the gloves...he was definitely terrified of them. My fiance told me last night that he wants to take it slower with Baby, so he wouldn't let me let Baby out. John has grown up with birds (parakeets, lovebirds, cockatiels) so I'm assuming he knows at least somewhat what he's doing. He is just kind of being bossy about it and it gets frustrating. I want Baby to like us both, and part of me is afraid that with John dictating the interactions, or being braver than I am, Baby will pick him over me....paranoid isn't it? I worry too much.


It's good that the food dunking is normal...I was concerned maybe something was wrong with his beak or digestive system. He also loves to dunk his head in the water and fill up his beak, then shake his head and splash water all over me! It's funny. He was talking a lot to us last night and bobbing his head, so he seems to be gaining some confidence.

 

[Lintini]

I know how you feel, I am a tad jealous that Chloe turns inside out whenever my brother or boyfriend enter my room and does half as much excitement for me. I have read different things, that well socialized greys can like the entire family and some will prefer just certain people. I make everyone who comes over come meet my birds lol!! PET HER PETTTTTTTT HERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!! hahaha

My greatest fear is being bitten too, I have a photo up on here when I first took her out, and you can see the sweat on my face. Today she was upset with me that I closed the closet so she couldn't enter it and she lunged at me. I think I scared her from the movement and she was upset because she really wants to bite all my clothing and go in there. The closet is lined with grid caging for my rabbits so she can easily go in and I have to shut it halfway so she can't. She has already landed in there once and scared the baajeezus out of my bunnies. I wish she was "good" like my amazon and just stayed on the top of her cage.....lol. Wishful thinking T_T

 

[Davinchi]

First of all, I want to say thank you for rescuing Baby from the horrible situation he was in. When I first got my CAG, he had been with another family for about 4 years. He wasn't in a bad situation but it was a huge change for him to be in a new place with new people. It took me over a month of just sitting next to the cage talking to him or reading my books out loud to get him to warm up to me. It just takes a lot of patience as birds are very picky on trusting people, especially if they were in bad situations. Now Picasso (my grey) and I are inseparable. Hang in there and understand that the rehabilitation takes time and love.