Bird adoptions? Not common?

[MonicaMc]

The majority of my birds are rehomes. Here's a list of my current birds.

Casey - Cinnamon Pearl Pied Female Cockatiel. I've had her since November of 2001 when she was 5 months old. A family (friends with my mother) knew I loved birds so decided to buy her as a gift to me from a friend of theirs that breeds and hand raises cockatiels. (I inadvertently bought her, so technically, she is my only "breeder" bird - and only bird that I've "bought" within my current flock)

Bourke - Female Bourke Parakeet. I've had her since January of 2002. I was told she was 5 or 7 years old at the time and the people who had her (and her family) wanted to go travel the USA and since they couldn't find a pet sitter, they decided to sell their birds. Well, their son at the time was a coworker of my mothers, and he knew I had birds, so I ended up getting her and all the others, with their cages. They also came with some really old Bird Talk Magazines (among others - magazines older than myself!)

Pistachio - Normal Male Cockatiel, estimated age at over 15 years old and I've had him since November of 2005. His previous owner was a kid a year younger than myself. (I actually knew this bird before I got my own pet bird!) His family got Pistachio and his mate from an animal shelter in 1998, so I don't know how old he really is. The boy grew up, lost interest in birds and discovered cars, girls and sports. The family offered me their birds multiple times but never brought the birds over.... until one morning they just showed up on my doorstep. I thought I'd never actually *get* the birds, but they decided that they had had enough and the birds were going. I was so disgusted in the cage! It was yellow from nicotine!

Tomi Girl - Pied Female Cockatiel. I've had her since April of 2006. No clue on age, but as far as I know, she was either an escaped pet or one that was let loose, then found in someones yard. I do not feel right calling these people owners, or companions. The people that found her decided to keep her, put her in a tiny "finch" cage (which, btw, I wouldn't even put *ONE* finch in!) and fed her seeds. She wasn't exactly friendly with them so she ended up being stuck inside a cage full of chain smokers (house had so much smoke, you could see it move when you walked around... ceilings yellow) who also smoked pot, were overrun with cats (multiple cats and kittens which had sinus problems and never once did they take any of their animals to a vet, cats were indoor/outdoor) and it was just a horrible mess. When she became "too noisy" for their household, they just covered the cage. When I finally took her, she was about 46% or so underweight. Cockatiels should weigh 90+ grams and she was less than 60 grams. The reason for this? They simply forgot to feed her. She was so weak that when she tried to fly I could easily snatch her out of the air! Her landing wasn't the best, either...

Charlie - Mitred Conure. I've had him since October of 2006 when he was 12 years. He had been in foster care (not official foster care, but foster care by an owner who wanted to get him out of a pet store because he was not doing well in there) for about a year, was in a pet store for about a year before that (store sold rabbits... Charlie didn't like it when customers brought in dogs so he'd scream his head off... and was consigned to the back room... with the rabbits), and before that he was owned by a man for 10 years of his life. His parents were wild caught imports. His foster mum and I had both belonged to a bird forum which is how I found out about him. At the time, I had a cherry headed conure that was very "un-conure" like and mostly hands off. Charlie was supposed to be another cherry head and he was, and is, the epitome of the word conure! I was interested in Charlie because I wanted a hands on bird, and hopefully, another cherry head so that my first could learn to be more "conure" like. His foster mum felt it would be best for him to be around another cherry head because she had a few large parrots and Charlie decided to bully one of them and got the short end of the stick... (he's now missing half of his lower beak!) not only that, but Charlie was louder than 3 amazons and two macaws!!! I had to travel down to go and see him and visit with his foster parents before taking him home with me which was no problem at all.... but when I saw him, I knew he was a mitred conure! Turns out that Charlie and my cherry head never did get along, even though I had both for 3 years.... and seven years later, I still keep in contact with his foster mum!

Faye - Normal Female Cockatiel. Age unknown, have had her since December of 2007. She was technically "payment" for house sitting a friends families house... All that I know about her past is that she and her mate were given away/sold at a yard sale, then the next person had the two for who knows how many years (they didn't specify), and when friends of theirs who owned two cockatiels moved to a different house, they gave the tiels to them. I don't think any of them fed anything other than seed and didn't particularly care about them. She was almost given to me when her mate died but the family decided to keep her a while longer. She was actually the third animal I got from this family (2nd cockatiel & 2nd bird) and to say the least, I'm pretty disgusted with this family and how they treat animals.

Jayde - Red Throated Female Conure. Age 3 years and I've had her since June of this year. I found out about her via a different forum that her foster mom and I also visit (but not the same one that I met Charlie's foster mum on). Someone had her for a couple of years, then gave her back to the breeder and I guess Jayde didn't like her cage buddy so the breeder was reselling her, where-in she ended up in the hands of her foster mom. I had lost my cherry headed conure 3 years ago and had, more or less, quietly been looking for another conure. I was mostly interested in buying a young cherry head from a breeder because the majority of my birds have been adults and I'd love to have a young conure! But I wasn't aversive in taking in another adult, either... and I'm also very much interested in getting to know the different red headed conure species! And so, two months ago, she was shipped to me! She is somewhat of a difficult bird in that she hates being on hands and has been afraid to leave her cage, but I don't regret getting her! I just hate the fact that she's clipped!




In short, Casey is the only bird I have that isn't a rehome, although she didn't come directly from a breeder, either! She is also the only bird that I've technically paid for. Having said that, even though Jayde was free, I still gave Jayde's foster mom a gift certificate to an online bird store. She wasn't asking an adoption fee and she wouldn't allow me to pay for Jayde's shipping price out here and I felt bad for all the money she has put into buying Jayde, making sure Jayde was healthy, then having to ship her! So the gift certificate was the least that I could do! I didn't have to, but I wanted to!

And I'm actually planning on doing something similar for Charlie's foster mom, even though it's been seven years! I just have to figure out if there are any bird stores she shops at online so I could get a certificate to her as well!

 

[MonicaMc]

Now as for adopt vs breeder vs pet store....

I'm on the fence about them all! (I could go either way, in other words) I'm *all for* reputable breeders, sanctuaries/rescues and reputable pet stores! However, I am against ignorant breeding, hoarders that call themselves a sanctuary/rescue, and bad pet stores.

I *hate* seeing people selling hybrids as pure species, and believe me, it happens far more commonly than many think! I hate seeing people selling a pure or hybrid as something that it isn't. I hate seeing breeders over-breed their birds just to make a buck. I hate seeing breeders breeding in tiny cages when the birds could breed just as easily in larger cages. I hate seeing baron cages that the only "enrichment" is chewing up the wooden perch(s) inside of it. If at least not toys, the birds could have fresh branches to destroy! I get that breeders are not pets, and I get that they are meant to be reproducing and not playing with toys, but that doesn't mean that they can't be provided with some sort of enrichment.

I respect breeders who breed responsibly. I respect breeders that give their birds large cages to breed in and keep things clean. Those that feed their birds well. *IF* they do hybridize, the hybrid birds *clearly* look like hybrids and are sold as such. (blue crown x cherry head hybrids look like green conures with a blue crown head.... no blue!) I can especially appreciate breeders who help with conservationist efforts or those breeding uncommon/rare species within captivity, and those that *STRIVE* for pure species!

I don't know if parrot overpopulation is an actual problem or not, but I do know that there are plenty of parrots in homes that are not being cared for the way that they should be. I know that there are thousands of parrots in rescues and sanctuaries, but wonder how many would be in these places if their adoption process wasn't so strict? I clearly understand why, but how many birds are losing out on a potentially good home because there was something that the rescue/adoption place didn't agree with? (i.e. predators in the home [cats/dogs/ferrets], owners that smoke, young kids, etc)

And I'm all for pet stores that educate all new owners and don't sell to just anybody that walks in the store! Pet stores that truly care where their animals go to and will refuse a sale if they don't think it's the right kind of person!

 

[MonicaMc]

Oh and I can't stand designer breeds either.. Sorry.. But we need responsible breeders otherwise we would loose the breeds that have their specific purposes.. And Im sorta guessing that goes for parrots too..

I really hate to see people ignorantly breeding hybrids. I'm against hybridization, but if people are going to do it, I'd rather see it done responsibly, hybrids that clearly look like hybrids, and sold as such. I've seen so many birds that are hybrids being sold as pure species, two pure species paired up and advertised as one species, even pure species being sold as something that they aren't. Nothing gets on my nerves more than that! (in regards to breeding....)

There's a breeder selling Red Fronted Conures, but admits that one parent is a Red Front and the other is a Mitred... Red Fronts, aka Waglers, are not common within captivity, and I hate seeing them hybridized. I've seen the Waglers sold as Mitreds and Cherry heads, too!

There's another breeder selling cherry headed conures, but in one photo he calls them mitred conures (cherry heads). One bird is a cherry head, the other I think is a mitred hybrid... and someone put a deposit down on supposed cherry headed chicks, and I told her she was buying a hybrid.... I don't think she believes me.

Of course, I'm also against hybrids on a subspecies level! I wonder how many amazons, cockatoos, conures and senegals out there are pure! Not to even mention the eclectus... I'm not even sure that the red factor sun conures aren't hybrids!


I feel that unless we have dedicated breeders out there who can tell not only the species apart, but the subspecies as well, that our captive parrots are doomed to being hybrids - except in species where if the bird was hybridized with any other species, you'd clearly be able to tell it was a hybrid (re: cockatiels and hyacinth macaws) or in those species where hybrids are either impossible (re: budgies) or hybrids result in infertile offspring (re: peach face lovebirds).

And here's an article about hybrids and the future of aviculture....

Hybrids and the future of Aviculture - City Parrots -



And having said all that, I still find the subject of hybrids to be a fascinating one! Contrary to popular belief, many hybrids are actually very healthy birds! Most are *not* sterile and can often reproduce! (have heard of 2nd generation hybrid hyacinths... multi-generation hybrid conure, macaw and conure x macaw hybrids... etc) In fact, I started a gallery of hybrid parrots!

Flickr: The Hybrid Parrots Pool



Sorry if this post is off topic, but posted in case you were interested. I don't own a hybrid parrot, but I can't say that I never will. The only birds in my flock that could be hybrids would be my conures, and neither one show any traces of hybridization. Not on a species level nor on a subspecies... well, mitred conures have subspecies, but red throats don't.





And if anyone wants to talk hybrids, we can start a new thread for that!

 

[Littlebird2]

I adopted Ipo, a 17 year old eclectus, based on personality. Or rather he sat on my knee and captured my heart. My first bird, a cockatiel, I got from a pet store. I had never even heard of a parrot rescue. It was only when I was fooling around looking at parrot info that I found them.i volunteer regularly and find it sad how many birds need homes. Sadder still are those that get adopted and come back 6 mos later because they are too loud, too messy etc. so there can be a lot of requirements but it is to Protect the birds. Any rescue should make exceptions based on individual circumstances. If I were to get another bird it would definitely be a rescue

 

[Boysmom]

Both of my current Birds are rehomes. Ruby I got at a year old. She had a crop infection from dirty water and was on a poor white seed only diet. Not good for an Ekkie. She was vetted and medicated and is now the princess of our home. She is so well trained and behaved that I take her everywhere with me. Kylie just came to live with me yesterday. She is a 6 year old female Lilac crown Amazon. She had only one previous home but the owner didnt have the time to spend with her that she needed. Over 6 months of talking and working this out, she is finally home with me.

I did try the rescue route, only it turned out to be a nightmare. The rescue did admit they dont care to adopt out birds and that basically no one meets their standads for adoption. I believe alot of rescues are simply glorified hoarders.

 

[Merlee]

Not quite true. It depends on the environment you provide and whether the birds have other companions. I have a large amount of birds but most of them live cage-free in a room fitted for their needs and with, at least, one companion of their own species so they don't require more than two hours of my company which is usually given while I clean and feed. One day a week I spend more time in there because I do the thorough weekly cleaning but, normally, it's about 1.5 to 2 hours in the morning and only 15 to 30 minutes in the evening (this is when they get their protein food so they couldn't care less about me been there or not -LOL).

I keep one pet bird, sometimes two (while I am quarantining a new one or is of a different species for which I don't have any other) and I never spend less than three to four hours a day with each of them. Is it hard? YOU BET! But it's the bare minimum considering they are made to have company 24/7/365!

I don't know the conditions and routines the rescue you mention keeps but 50 birds is not that many if kept right. I personally know of two very good rescues that have hundreds of them and they don't only have volunteers who come every day to help out with cleaning, feeding, socializing, etc (I even know one that has a paid employee because the lady could not count on volunteers showing up every day) and the birds are let out all day long and rotated into flight rooms or aviaries and socialized with other birds either of their own species or very similar. The system works out very well. Much better than having a single or a couple of birds in cages all day long and letting them out at night for an hour or two when the owner comes home from work...

I have a couple of questions. How many is too many kept in one facility? The place I visited is a two-story house and the birds are kept in two rooms in the basement, the dining room and some in the living room. The upstairs is private living quarters. I have seen macaws living in birds cages more suited for amazons. Are there guidelines or rules a rescue has to follow regarding living arrangements for these birds? How about ratio of birds to caregiver?

 

[Pajarita]

No, unfortunately for the birds, there are no guidelines for anything. The industry is completely 100% unregulated and, because of this, there are abuses left and right (not only in rescues, sanctuaries and breeders but also in private homes).

There is a project going on called The Roaming Parrot who goes into rescues and sanctuaries and has a questionnaire or chart they fill up for every one. They only go if they are invited by the rescue or sanctuary and the purpose is to put together a national database with all information so people can compare and choose the rescue they feel is the best for adopting, relinquishing, volunteering or donating. There is no judgment, it's just a compilation of standards but, personally, I would consider a rescue which chooses not to participate iffy at best.

Now, if you ask me what I would consider a good rescue, I would tell you that it would have to be one that is not crowded, feeds fresh food, keeps the birds to a solar schedule, has comfortable and clean housing for all the birds, separate rooms for different species (like macaws with macaws, toos with toos, conures with conures, etc) as well as flight rooms, good lights (both artificial and natural -so a basement is not good) and, if at all possible, outdoor aviaries (I would not expect this of a small or medium size rescue but I would expect it of, say, The Gabriel Foundation, which doesn't). I would also expect the birds to have been checked by an AV at arrival as well as quarantined and there should be records on these as well as behavioral information. And, of course, a reasonable adoption fee ($100 for a budgie is not reasonable) and a quick turn-around for applications because anything less than that makes you wonder if the rescuer is not a collector instead of a rescuer...

 

[Merlee]

Thank you for answering my questions. What do you think about rescues taking in boarders and not keeping them separated form the inhabitants? Personally, I would have reservations because the rescue insists that when their adoptions are approved, the adopted bird must be in quarantine for 90 days. "Do as I say, not as I do" comes to mind here. lol.

 

[Pajarita]

All good rescues quarantine and vet. If they don't, they are not good. And boarders should be isolated from the rescue birds and this is not only because of possible contagion but also because you don't want a pet bird which lives by himself to bond with one in the rescue and then go back to his lonely home.

 

[Merlee]

The more I learn about a rescue near me, the less I like it.

 

[Pajarita]

Unfortunately, there are lots and lots of bad rescues, I've seen some whose owners should be in jail but most struggle to do good. Problem is, people tend to loose perspective and keep on accepting birds they don't have the room or the resources for thinking they are doing them a favor when, in reality, they are not. Even well-intentioned, loving people make mistakes. I know of a very knowledgeable lady who loves animals and works like a mule all day long, keeps her birds cages impeccably clean, gives them medical attention, lets them out every day, offers maybe not a big selection of produce but some every day, etc but got stuck in the past so she has breeders' cages (one stack on top of another) for housing the larger and medium species and that's terribly stressing for the poor birds which hate been so low to the ground; she still does the antiquated 12L/12D with the resulting hormonal problems and off-season laying; she feeds Harrison's and has ended up with birds dead from eggbinding; she has air purifiers in every room but she never opens the windows when the weather is good; and I can go on and on...

Then I know another one who used to post all over the place, telling the saddest stories about the 'new' bird and asking for donations which she then used not to improve the birds conditions but for personal expenses while the birds were eating nothing but cheap seeds.

And another one who kept the macaws and toos in the front room in an airy, well-lit room while she kept the other birds in a room that had not even a single ceiling or any other kind of light fixture and just a dirty, small, all the way up in the wall window with cages stacked three deep and feed only seed. She had pluckers in her living room which was kept dark so her kid could watch TV all day long... saddest birds I've ever seen!

And we all heard and saw the pictures of the rescue that had hundreds of mice and cockroaches all over the place, sick birds that couldn't even hold their heads up that were getting no medical attention, etc.

People talk about personal responsibility instead of regulation but, in my personal opinion, it doesn't work. You need to regulate.

 

[Abigal7]

Unfortunately, there are lots and lots of bad rescues, I've seen some whose owners should be in jail but most struggle to do good. Problem is, people tend to loose perspective and keep on accepting birds they don't have the room or the resources for thinking they are doing them a favor when, in reality, they are not. Even well-intentioned, loving people make mistakes. I know of a very knowledgeable lady who loves animals and works like a mule all day long, keeps her birds cages impeccably clean, gives them medical attention, lets them out every day, offers maybe not a big selection of produce but some every day, etc but got stuck in the past so she has breeders' cages (one stack on top of another) for housing the larger and medium species and that's terribly stressing for the poor birds which hate been so low to the ground; she still does the antiquated 12L/12D with the resulting hormonal problems and off-season laying; she feeds Harrison's and has ended up with birds dead from eggbinding; she has air purifiers in every room but she never opens the windows when the weather is good; and I can go on and on...

Then I know another one who used to post all over the place, telling the saddest stories about the 'new' bird and asking for donations which she then used not to improve the birds conditions but for personal expenses while the birds were eating nothing but cheap seeds.

And another one who kept the macaws and toos in the front room in an airy, well-lit room while she kept the other birds in a room that had not even a single ceiling or any other kind of light fixture and just a dirty, small, all the way up in the wall window with cages stacked three deep and feed only seed. She had pluckers in her living room which was kept dark so her kid could watch TV all day long... saddest birds I've ever seen!

And we all heard and saw the pictures of the rescue that had hundreds of mice and cockroaches all over the place, sick birds that couldn't even hold their heads up that were getting no medical attention, etc.

People talk about personal responsibility instead of regulation but, in my personal opinion, it doesn't work. You need to regulate.

Do not bird breeders have to be licensed, have state surveys and rules to follow? My mom breeds dogs and has State surveys etc. A friend of hers breeds sugar gliders and owns a pet store. She has to be licensed to own a pet store and has to have a USDA license to sell and breed exotic mammals. As a private citizen I do not get inspected but if I was a hoarder, or my animals started to look pretty unhealthy I would have a visit. I am surprised if parrot rescues are never inspected or have guidelines to follow. Is this the same with shelters?

 

[henpecked]

Breeding exotics varies from state to state (governed by state laws). Here in Fla i think you are required to be permitted by the state if you sell 15 or more exotic birds per year. The laws cover things like cage size, evac plans, etc. really not too much about the conditions birds are kept in. That sort of issue is up to the personal judgement of the inspector and FWC (Fish and Wildlife Commission). The inspectors are generally HSUS or SPCA and under contract with the state.They are not trained or necessarily bird knowledgable. There's no law that says " water must be changed twice a day or once a week" or " birds must be kept apart". In general a inspector could walk in to your house and seize your pets if they didn't like what they saw (a judgement call). It's up to a Judge and a hearing to determine if abuse has occurred and whether or not you get your pets back. There have been several case where confiscated birds died or where kept in much poorer conditions than they where seized from because of over zealous inspectors exercising their authority . The system is definitely flawed but that's the way it is.

 

[redgate]

Just another opinion.
I am currently researching getting a Grey. Rehomes in my area are being offered at $1200-1500, babies at $1200-1500. OK, you get the cage in the rehome price (not always) but in most cases the cage is not worth having as it is way too small, so you are still going to have to buy a cage. So in the end a baby or a rehome are going to cost you the same amount of money.
Do you spend the money and start with a blank page (a baby) or get a rehome that might come with an awful lot of baggage that you don't know about and might not be able to change?



Irene

 

[Pajarita]

There are no real regulations. There are states where breeders of exotics need to be registered (like where I live in New Jersey) but it's more for revenue (you pay an annual fee) than anything else. PIJAC constantly fights any type of improvement to the laws so there would be no real overseeing (to the great detriment of the birds).

 

[Pajarita]

Just another opinion.
I am currently researching getting a Grey. Rehomes in my area are being offered at $1200-1500, babies at $1200-1500. OK, you get the cage in the rehome price (not always) but in most cases the cage is not worth having as it is way too small, so you are still going to have to buy a cage. So in the end a baby or a rehome are going to cost you the same amount of money.
Do you spend the money and start with a blank page (a baby) or get a rehome that might come with an awful lot of baggage that you don't know about and might not be able to change?



Irene

There is an ad in Buffalo (very near Toronto) for a friendly 3 year old CAG for only $800 and another one for $1000 with cage and toys while the average price for a baby seems to be $1400.

 

[redgate]

I know buying a dog and bringing it across the border requires a vet health certificate and a rabies, depending on age. Even day old poutry require health certificates and have to be from approved and inspected farms. I have no idea what hoops you would need to jump through to get a bird across but I can't imagine they would make it easy!

 

[henpecked]

Hey Irene, welcome to the forum. Yes ,you asked the big question, your sure to get several different replies. Logic would say a baby if they both cost the same. However many folks feel there's too many older birds in rescue and you should get one of them. Obliviously there's not that many CAGS in rescue in your area if they can ask the same for an older bird that a baby would cost. Sounds as if the "rescue" is looking to make a profit and is in the business of selling birds,not rescuing them.The phrase "bird flipper" comes to mind. What ever you decide to do, meet as many CAGs as you can (babies and adults). They all have their own personalities. If you find a older rehome/rescue that you can work with great, but many are rehomed or in rescue for behavioral issues. Your doing the right thing by joining a forum like this and researching. Maybe you could "foster" a older rehome/rescue and see what it takes to make it work. On the other hand, it's a great opportunity to raise a baby into your life long companion. I'm sure folks from both sides of the fence will have lots to say, just keep an open mind and remember " you can't believe everything you read on the internet".

 

[henpecked]

I know buying a dog and bringing it across the border requires a vet health certificate and a rabies, depending on age. Even day old poutry require health certificates and have to be from approved and inspected farms. I have no idea what hoops you would need to jump through to get a bird across but I can't imagine they would make it easy!

Technically it's tons of paper work if not impossible for you to buy a CITIES listed bird in the US and carry it back across into Canada. If you owned property and a resident of the US you might stand a chance of pulling it off.

 

[Merlee]

Just another opinion.
I am currently researching getting a Grey. Rehomes in my area are being offered at $1200-1500, babies at $1200-1500. OK, you get the cage in the rehome price (not always) but in most cases the cage is not worth having as it is way too small, so you are still going to have to buy a cage. So in the end a baby or a rehome are going to cost you the same amount of money.
Do you spend the money and start with a blank page (a baby) or get a rehome that might come with an awful lot of baggage that you don't know about and might not be able to change?

Irene

If you check older rehomes, you can always see how the bird interacts with the original owner. Some rehomes can be really sweet because they were socialized well. I got a rehome yellow nape who is nonaggressive and Boysmom just got a rehomed lilac crown amazon who is also very sweet and well trained. Good birds are on the market, you just have to spend some time looking.