Conure re-training question?

[ryanjimison]

Hello bird friends! I'm looking forward to being a part of the conure community!

I have a Crimson bellied conure. He is very hand trained, will roll over in our hands, and is generally very cute and gentle, but has had a behavior change, that we need to work on. Just want to seek advice from you experienced conure owners.

When we first got him, he was obsessed with our family, but after a year started plucking himself during the day when we were at work and school. His previous owner who died had a second bird, so we thought "Maybe he's lonely during the day."

We got a second cage and a second bird (lovebird) so that they could talk to each other during the day. We let them out for supervised play. Great! They love each other very much. Awesome! His beautiful crimson plumage grew back and is bright and vibrant, and he doesn't pluck any more. Mission accomplished, right?

Well, now he only wants the lovebird, and will bite if we reach into his cage. If we reach into the lovebird cage, he flips out and starts screaming. If he flies on top of the lovebird cage, he defends it and will fly to us and try and bite us if we come within a 5 foot radius. He growls, throws his head around, and puffs himself up trying to look aggressive (which still looks adorable as a conure doing this).

If I use a stick with a crook at the end, and put it under his chest, he will still step up and is handle-able via the stick. So I can move him from his cage to play area and back to cage via stick.

Looking for advice of how to return him to being his hand tamed self.

One thought I had is that we move the lovebird upstairs (out of sight and sound) and wait a day and see if he forgets about the lovebird. I've heard birds have short memories when it comes to that sort of thing. Thoughts on that? Other thoughts?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Skittys_Daddy]

Birds are finnicky. They will 'choose' who to bond with and there is really very little we can do about it. We may buy a bird 'hoping' it will bond with us, even be it's primary caregiver but it will choose another family member to 'bond' with.

I do know this, it's not unusual for a human-bonded bird to bond with another bird.
For that reason, I've always kept my birds in separate cages, even in separate rooms.

I understand you wanting to have your bird bonded with you and also not be lonely.

I personally wouldn't recommend just removing the lovebird. I'd first, limit and eventually terminate their 'supervised visits'. That may very well be enough.

Lovebirds are usually kept in pairs, so I'd prefer not to recommend you keep the lovebird alone in a separate room. Have you considered getting the lovebird another mate? That could also resolve the problem.

You 'should' be able to keep them in the same room without having a 'bonding' issue with your conure. But if none of the above steps don't work, then separating them entirely may be the best option.

I think the best remedy is this: Limit and then eliminate their 'supervised visits' out of cage. Then, move them to separate sides of the room. Begin trying to 're-bond' with your conure. Then buy a mate for your lovebird. I don't think keeping both birds alone in separate rooms is a good idea, but rather a worst case scenario.

Maybe even just keep them in the same room when you are at work and then separate them when you are home and can attend to both of them.

 

[ryanjimison]

Update:

I tried an experiment with some success tonight.

I took the lovebird upstairs for the evening, and waited a few hours.

I prepared some chopped up apples (Conure's favorite treat) and put them in a small bowl. I opened his cage and held the bowl of apples by the front. He was still acting aggressively (swaying, growling, muttering), but came up and took an apple piece from the bowl I was holding, then ran to the back of his cage eating, but acting aggressively. The more apples he ate, the longer he would sit with me at the entrance to his cage.

I held the bowl out farther, and he fell out of his cage at one point, and climbed up on my lap (i was sitting), but he was growling and swaying. With him holding on to my pants, I walked with him to the kitchen, held out an apple piece, then had him step up on my finger. At the kitchen table, we had treats, he stepped up, occasionally bit, but not aggressively. Had apples and step ups, some petting, and he was quiet and agreeable, non aggressive. BIG first step.

After an hour, I took him back to his cage, put him in, and he retreated to the back corner, growling, swaying and returning to aggressive posturing.

This morning, I brought the lovebird cage back downstairs to its spot so that he could see his friend while we were gone at work and school.

I will try again tonight and see if its easier to get him out of his cage than last night. As suggested, I'm going to try removing the lovebird during the evenings for a few days, but returning it for the workday.

I'll keep you posted...been working with him using techniques discussed in this forum...so far so good. Thanks!

 

[ryanjimison]

Day 2:

I did the same maneuver and brought the love bird upstairs and put her to bed in the evening, and opened up the conure cage.

Approaching his cage he wasn't as aggressive (no swaying, but still some muttering), but it was obvious he would bite me if I put my hand in.

So I waited for him to come out, I had a treat for him, and gave it to him from my hand without him biting me.

He came out and looked like he wanted to fly to me, but in the nice way (where they crouch down and flutter their wings), not the attacking way(direct flight, reckless abandon). He did and landed on my shoulder, no biting, no aggression.

We walked to the kitchen table, and sat down. I tried to get him off my shoulder and he bit me, so I grabbed his beak for a few seconds, made him get on the finger, and then gave him a treat. We did step ups for treats for a few minutes, and he was docile, friendly. He took a little bath in a bowl of water...it was great!

We went back into the room with his cage and sat on the couch. At this point, he started crawling all around my body trying to attack my hands. We returned to the kitchen table, and he was fine, no aggression. Went back into the room with his cage, and he crawled all over my body trying to attack my hands, wherever they went. Back to kitchen - fine.

What do you think? Because its the room he and the lovebird are in usually, do you think that's what makes him aggressive in that place? Should I try moving his cage to a different room in the house, and try to spend time on the couch again and see if the chasing hands behavior changes?

Thanks!

 

[ryanjimison]

Saturday -

Moved the lovebird upstairs as has become the custom. Opened the cage for Rudy (the conure), to see what he would do. He flew to my shoulder. I fed him some orange bell peppers (he loves those) at the kitchen table and all was well. He had dinner with us at the table that night (something that hasn't be done in a long time). Afterwards we went into the room with the cage and sat on the recliner. Previously, his behavior would be to chase my hands and try and bite them. He didn't. He did have a weird flighty behavior, where he would do the fluttery wings crouch body language, even with no one else in the room, but, he decided to stay after a while, puffed up and we hung out for an hour, with no treats from me, and no bites from him. It was great.

At this point, without response or advice from the rest of the forum, I'm documenting my journey to retrain my conure to his previous, loving self. I hope this helps someone in the future. Please, if you have advice for me, I'd love to hear it.

 

[ryanjimison]

Monday -

This morning, I tried something, and Rudy(Conure) wasn't ready for it. Both cages were downstairs for the two birds to keep themselves company while we were at work.

I was feeding the birds, one cage at a time. When I got to Rudy, I opened his cage, he flew out and landed on the lovebird cage (as he has done previously for many months). He started his aggressive posturing, and angry amazon rainforest calls.

Previously, when I would finish putting food in, I would use a stick for him to step up on to put him back in his cage. However, this time, as I was working on putting his food in, I offered him some apple, and he took it. Then I tried to get him to step up on my finger (so I could put him back in his cage), and he did. Once he realized what he was doing, he dropped the apple and began aggressively biting my hand, drawing blood. I put him in his cage and closed it, and said "no bite," sternly.

I guess I was too hopeful that he would love both me and the lovebird. The conclusion that I'm drawing is: with the lovebird present (even in cage), he becomes wild and protective. With the lovebird upstairs, he is docile, loving, and able to be handled for the most part.

My big question to the bird experts of the forum after the last week of experiments: Is it possible to train Rudy to not be so wild and protective around the lovebird, or, is this a tension to manage and I should continue my pattern of putting the lovebird to bed upstairs nightly, to have nice, bite-free 1 on 1 time with Rudy?

 

[Flboy]

I really don't have an answer for you. But I wanted you to know that your posts are being read!

 

[ryanjimison]

Sorry, I wasn't fishing - I just want to know if there is someone on the forums who thinks if I'm on the right track, or more importantly, if anything is wrong with what I'm doing. Thanks for the support! Also, like I said, hope I'm able to help someone in the future through documenting this.

 

[Altum]

I'm no expert, but it sounds like it's working to me. You may have just rushed things a little bit by putting your bare hands in biting range while they were together.

I think it's important to be patient... your goal is to create a status quo where he and the lovebird are together some of the time, you and he are together some of the time, and the he is alone some of the time (while you are with the lovebird).

And the thing is, he is probably extra aggressive when the three of you are in one place, because he knows you will be taking his new friend away, and he doesn't have enough experience with the new routine to be confident that the lovebird will come back.

Do you use any verbal cues when you're transitioning between different parts of the routine? My experience has been that there are some things that my GCC gets alarmed about sometimes but will be nonchalant about the same thing if he knows it's part of the routine. I use "Be good," when I'm leaving for the day, and "Good night, Foggy," when I'm turning out the lights, and it's really cut down on the number of piteous flock calls coming through the door... he knows it happens every day and he knows I'll be back at the usual time. I repeat them a lot as I go through my own morning/evening routine, so he can prepare himself.

 

[ryanjimison]

The verbal cue is a great piece of advice. I do use it for "Good bird" when he steps up without biting (accompanied with treat). I also use a stern "NO BITE" when he bites. But having a goodnight cue, or a "I'm taking the lovebird upstairs cue" or bringing the lovebird back would be helpful. Thanks!

 

[Doublete]

That sounds like a strangely insecure birdy. I don't have any words of advice but it sounds like you are doing well and trying!

 

[Notdumasilook]

Just curious.. how much do you handle the lovebird?? And do you handle the lovebird in front of the conure? The reason I'm asking is the conure has obviously "adopted" the lovebird like his/her baby. But since in the wild there can be 2 parents..... well you see where Im going? I had a similar situation between a BFA and a cockatiel, and he was a handful to deal with until he accepted me as the 'other' parent.

 

[ryanjimison]

I don't handle the lovebird that much. She doesn't seem to like people. Bought the bird as a companion bird for the conure while we're gone at work so they can see each other from their cages and talk. We will have her and the conure hang out together (supervised) and they adore each other, preening and sitting right next to each other. But anytime the conure sees me feed the lovebird, or interact with the lovebird, he flips out and starts screaming and posturing aggressively. If I get the lovebird out, its the end of the world, and the conure bounces around the inside of his cage going crazy.

The best description of the conure after the last week of work with him, is bi-polar. Protective, manic and loud when lovebird is around. When lovebird is upstairs, he is sweet, docile and quiet.

 

[Notdumasilook]

No your bird is normal. I understand why you got the lovebird.. it was a good thought, and would probably work out if you could handle it also. You are dealing with birdie instincts here which might seem nuts unless u think like a bird. Now you got yourself in deeper with the addition to the flock getting adopted. It might take some time and patience now on your part (and the birds) to tame that lovebird a bit one on one so it bonds with you also. Once your conure sees you handling the lovebird and not hurting it he/she should calm down and yall can be one happy family again. I wish you luck.. lovebirds can be stubborn and Id rather be bit by a macaw than a lovebird.
Don't expect results right away either. It took time with my BFA... and NOW he has "adopted" my sun conure. Had some testy moments with that combo also, but now they will both sit on one shoulder with all of us having a preen me party. Don't give up!!

 

[ryanjimison]

Thanks for the advice. I don't really like the lovebird, but if it helps us normalize as a flock, I will give it a shot. Like you said, I'd rather be bitten by my conure than the lovebird. The lovebird doesn't hold back when biting...the conure at least has some restraint. The lovebird will actually sit on shoulders no problem, just hates hands.

 

[Notdumasilook]

Heck a lovebird can be as adorable as any other bird... kinda like a tiny amazon on crack (hah) But, at least in my experience if not hand tamed young can be tuff to get sweetened up. Some years back I raised some in an aviary I built... not for $ but more of a hobby. The fledglings were easy but if I didn't spend time and handle them young it was major effort and a good deal of blood to bring them around ) Keep me posted on the picking issue as well? Im curious if your approach succeeds. Good luck.