Is a "raw" diet for parrots possible?

[June2012]

I've scoured far and wide all over Google -- I just can't find an answer, other than this ONE article from Dr. Hines: Feeding Finicky Birds - Parrot Diets

I know that parrots are sensitive and I cook almost all 3 of my meals from home. Even people are trying to feed their other pets a raw diet. No dog food or kibble or canned wet food. Real meat. Is it possible? I know it's unrealistic for a modern home to do this. I can totally see it become another bill almost. But can it be done? Do we have enough info to actually dive into this?

Have any of you guys thought about this? Or is a pelleted diet the ONLY way? I mean, pellet companies have to know a parrot's dietary needs in order for parrots to be happy and healthy when on such a diet, right? Is it because the supplements are in a little package already, that people simply decide to not go the all natural route? Is it because the American market cannot provide such and it is too hard to find such resources?

I am so curious as to why this is. Is it because parrots are simply, a relatively new pet so that it simply could not be formulated? If possible, I would totally love to give my parrot a raw diet. XD

 

[ZephyrFly]

http://www.parrotforums.com/parrot-food-recipes-diet/49831-chop-day-recipe.html
Give the Food and Diet section a wiz, lots of people have looked into either raw diets (eclectus' need a VERY raw diet to safe healthy, so lots of people have talked on it), also home cooking, chops, breads and more.


HolisticBird and HolisticBirds
I love this page, if you know your science this is a very good read to help you figure out a diet plan. If not, the diet pyramids are easy to follow, everything is explained on the page though (keep an eye that you look at the right pyramid for the bird you're thinking of). I need to look at this more myself, my gcc should get more veg in his chop...

https://theparrotuniversity.com/circusdiet
Everything With a pinch of salt, or not. I recommend reading a lot and having multiple sources.

I am not an expert, nor a professional, so these are only recomendations from my experience and research.
A raw diet is possible, easier if you can count cooked beans, lentils, sweet potato, squash, etc. I personally give my gcc a 50-50 diet leaning on chop (I hope), this means I give my guy 50% pellets and 50% chop, roughly. I find personally that pellets are a bit too high in protein for my liking (least the brand I use, or brands I'd consider using) but helps give everything else my bird needs that I am not 100% confident I provide in his chop, so his chop is lower in protein but higher in veg and fibre (could probably use more veg).

Goodluck on your searches. Hope the links help.

 

[June2012]

http://www.parrotforums.com/parrot-food-recipes-diet/49831-chop-day-recipe.html
Give the Food and Diet section a wiz, lots of people have looked into either raw diets (eclectus' need a VERY raw diet to safe healthy, so lots of people have talked on it), also home cooking, chops, breads and more.


HolisticBird and HolisticBirds
I love this page, if you know your science this is a very good read to help you figure out a diet plan. If not, the diet pyramids are easy to follow, everything is explained on the page though (keep an eye that you look at the right pyramid for the bird you're thinking of). I need to look at this more myself, my gcc should get more veg in his chop...

https://theparrotuniversity.com/circusdiet
Everything With a pinch of salt, or not. I recommend reading a lot and having multiple sources.

I am not an expert, nor a professional, so these are only recomendations from my experience and research.
A raw diet is possible, easier if you can count cooked beans, lentils, sweet potato, squash, etc. I personally give my gcc a 50-50 diet leaning on chop (I hope), this means I give my guy 50% pellets and 50% chop, roughly. I find personally that pellets are a bit too high in protein for my liking (least the brand I use, or brands I'd consider using) but helps give everything else my bird needs that I am not 100% confident I provide in his chop, so his chop is lower in protein but higher in veg and fibre (could probably use more veg).

Goodluck on your searches. Hope the links help.

OMG! Thank you so much! I'll definitely use these sources.

EDIT: I forgot to ask: When they have percentages, by what percentage do they mean? What percent age of their body weight should I provide for them not to waste it? I don't want to give them 10% of their body weight and end up with a very chubby bird. O.O

 

[Puck]

Kiwibird (this is her username--I know you can't PM yet but she is around) is a good person to ask about this--from my understanding her bird gets fresh food, not pellets. There are absolutely ways to feed your parrots a "raw" diet...

The idea behind the percentages is to first put as much food as you usually would in the bowl (weigh first). Take what your bird doesn't eat and weigh that. Subtract from original weight. Then reduce that by 5-10% encouraging birds to drop less food and eat everything they are given and also keep them at a healthy weight--a "diet" that is more natural than gorging themselves all the time. If they are still gaining weight or if they leave food behind in their cup, reduce by another 5-10%. Most people way overfeed their birds. Of course if you do this kind of feeding rather than letting as many pellets as they could possibly want sit in the bowl all day every day you need to be sure and watch their weight, always remember to feed, and add food during molts.

I feed Sammy three times a day, twice chop and once pellets. His diet is about 60% chop, 30% pellets, and 10% millet during training.

EDIT: And as for the "why"... it is not easy to feed yourself a complex, nutritionally sound raw diet, much less your animals, so many people (including me) supplement with pellets. With two jobs I don't really have time for true raw food shopping every day.

 

[June2012]

Kiwibird (this is her username--I know you can't PM yet but she is around) is a good person to ask about this--from my understanding her bird gets fresh food, not pellets. There are absolutely ways to feed your parrots a "raw" diet...

The idea behind the percentages is to first put as much food as you usually would in the bowl (weigh first). Take what your bird doesn't eat and weigh that. Subtract from original weight. Then reduce that by 5-10% encouraging birds to drop less food and eat everything they are given and also keep them at a healthy weight--a "diet" that is more natural than gorging themselves all the time. If they are still gaining weight or if they leave food behind in their cup, reduce by another 5-10%. Most people way overfeed their birds. Of course if you do this kind of feeding rather than letting as many pellets as they could possibly want sit in the bowl all day every day you need to be sure and watch their weight, always remember to feed, and add food during molts.

I feed Sammy three times a day, twice chop and once pellets. His diet is about 60% chop, 30% pellets, and 10% millet during training.

EDIT: And as for the "why"... it is not easy to feed yourself a complex, nutritionally sound raw diet, much less your animals, so many people (including me) supplement with pellets. With two jobs I don't really have time for true raw food shopping every day.

That is true! But I guess what I meant "raw" wasn't cooked wise, but all natural wise. And how do you know if it's too little? If their droppings become darker or they lose weight?

And honestly, you have two jobs?! You must really be a wonderful, addicted and awesome bird lover. You have all those birds and still have 2 jobs? People have no reason to complain birds take up time, now, do they?

 

[Matt_95]

Kiwibird would be great to talk to about this. She helped me prepared for feeding Calvin 100% unprocessed food. He gets a highly varied mix of chopped vegetables, sprouts, cooked legumes and fruit. I'm always giving him new foods so that he will be happy to try new things when he is older. I find chop an excellent way to feed him a huge variety of vegetables and to cut down on waste.

 

[June2012]

Kiwibird would be great to talk to about this. She helped me prepared for feeding Calvin 100% unprocessed food. He gets a highly varied mix of chopped vegetables, sprouts, cooked legumes and fruit. I'm always giving him new foods so that he will be happy to try new things when he is older. I find chop an excellent way to feed him a huge variety of vegetables and to cut down on waste.

Once I have access to my computer, I'll definitely contact her! I'm so interested in this. :3

 

[jakrob4]

Would have to include sprouted seeds etc, not just vegies. A hardboiled egg every now and then would be needed, especially when molting or laying eggs. They usually eat bugs in the wild for extra protein and B12.

 

[Chihuahua]

I fed my dog raw for a while.. I must have done it wrong because she did not do well on it/

 

[Kiwibird]

I fed my dog raw for a while.. I must have done it wrong because she did not do well on it/

Keep in mind, dogs and birds have vastly different dietary needs. I don't know much about dogs dietary needs besides they are primarily carnivores, nor what you were feeding yours, but I do know that a lot of people in the raw community feed raw diets to carnivorous pets and it doesn't always work out well for the pet (I am a raw vegan and participate on some raw/vegan forums where this topic of feeding carnivores a raw plant based diet is commonly discussed by members).

Most parrots, however, thrive on a raw or whole foods diet, as it is very close to what they eat in nature. The key is variety, variety and more variety (seasonal rotating variety too, if at all possible)! And while not all in the avian community agree, I also lean towards a more fruit-heavy diet for most species (except during the breeding season), as most species eat a lot of fruit (thus a lot of natural sugar) in the wild. Protien is necessary, though in parrots should make up a relatively low portion of their diet. Protein can can be obtained through plant (such as grains, sprouts, nuts, seeds or legumes) or animal sources (such as SMALL AMOUNTS of eggs, cheese or ORGANIC meats) being most parrots are in fact true omnivores who typically eat a plant-heavy diet in nature (thus can thrive on an all-plant based diet, but also thrive with small amounts of animal products too).

I will admit, Kiwi is not on a 100% raw diet, as he still gets some cooked grains and my husband sneaks him bites of his (relatively healthy) cooked table food I tried to convert him to all sprouted vs cooked grains, but he just wasn't having it. A good majority of what he eats is raw fruits, veggies, sprouts, nuts and seeds though. He glows with health, is very active, never gets sick, maintains a healthy weight and for the most part, has a cheerful disposition. A raw diet CAN be very healthy, but you MUST have that variety!

***Be aware there are a few species who have very special dietary needs (think eclectus or lories) and I do not know enough about their special diets to make recommendations. Most of my knowlege/research is into what new world parrots native to central and south america eat. You must also keep in mind where your parrot comes from. Old world and new world species (and even species just from different regions or continents) have varying diets, so I strongly urge owners to research as much as they can what their species would eat in nature and feed as close to a natural diet as possible. One thing I guarantee NO parrot eats in the wild is pellets. There are no pellet trees in nature.

 

[Hawk]

I fed my dog raw for a while.. I must have done it wrong because she did not do well on it/

Keep in mind, dogs and birds have vastly different dietary needs. I don't know much about dogs dietary needs besides they are primarily carnivores, nor what you were feeding yours, but I do know that a lot of people in the raw community feed raw diets to carnivorous pets and it doesn't always work out well for the pet (I am a raw vegan and participate on some raw/vegan forums where this topic of feeding carnivores a raw plant based diet is commonly discussed by members).

Most parrots, however, thrive on a raw or whole foods diet, as it is very close to what they eat in nature. The key is variety, variety and more variety (seasonal rotating variety too, if at all possible)! And while not all in the avian community agree, I also lean towards a more fruit-heavy diet for most species (except during the breeding season), as most species eat a lot of fruit (thus a lot of natural sugar) in the wild. Protien is necessary, though in parrots should make up a relatively low portion of their diet. Protein can can be obtained through plant (such as grains, sprouts, nuts, seeds or legumes) or animal sources (such as SMALL AMOUNTS of eggs, cheese or ORGANIC meats) being most parrots are in fact true omnivores who typically eat a plant-heavy diet in nature (thus can thrive on an all-plant based diet, but also thrive with small amounts of animal products too).

I will admit, Kiwi is not on a 100% raw diet, as he still gets some cooked grains and my husband sneaks him bites of his (relatively healthy) cooked table food I tried to convert him to all sprouted vs cooked grains, but he just wasn't having it. A good majority of what he eats is raw fruits, veggies, sprouts, nuts and seeds though. He glows with health, is very active, never gets sick, maintains a healthy weight and for the most part, has a cheerful disposition. A raw diet CAN be very healthy, but you MUST have that variety!

***Be aware there are a few species who have very special dietary needs (think eclectus or lories) and I do not know enough about their special diets to make recommendations. Most of my knowlege/research is into what new world parrots native to central and south america eat. You must also keep in mind where your parrot comes from. Old world and new world species (and even species just from different regions or continents) have varying diets, so I strongly urge owners to research as much as they can what their species would eat in nature and feed as close to a natural diet as possible. One thing I guarantee NO parrot eats in the wild is pellets. There are no pellet trees in nature.

One thing I guarantee NO parrot eats in the wild is pellets. There are no pellet trees in nature.

Amen Kiwi !!!

 

[thekarens]

Is a "raw" diet for parrots possible?

I think it's totally possible. However, like humans, very few people can or will make the effort to simulate the required variety.

Obviously we don't have the exact same things they eat in the wild, so we have to use what's available and that means variety to make sure they are getting enough nutrition.

 

[Kiwibird]

Re: Is a "raw" diet for parrots possible?

I think it's totally possible. However, like humans, very few people can or will make the effort to simulate the required variety.

Exactly right. It's not that it can't work, it's just a major PITA to do and not everyone is willing/able to.

 

[June2012]

Re: Is a "raw" diet for parrots possible?

I think it's totally possible. However, like humans, very few people can or will make the effort to simulate the required variety.

Exactly right. It's not that it can't work, it's just a major PITA to do and not everyone is willing/able to.

I could see it happening, definitely. Many can't financially afford it and parrots tend to fling their food everywhere. But if you could, it would be difficult for sure. Time is also an issue, to go out and shop, to prepare, etc. I was just wondering if it was near the same level over the debate on raw vs kibble vs vegan for dogs. Or if it was even possible. Now I'm sure, since you proved it with a VERY healthy Amazon!

It just seemed that to me, that parrots are relatively new compared to dogs and other animals. They're not even domesticated! It's amazing that some people, although time consuming, can provide a diet like such. And IMO, if it wasn't nutritionally sound, your parrot would be unhealthy, no? (Now, I'm not bad mouthing anyone else that chooses a pellet based diet. It's reasonable and much easier to handle!)

 

[Kiwibird]

Re: Is a "raw" diet for parrots possible?

I could see it happening, definitely. Many can't financially afford it and parrots tend to fling their food everywhere. But if you could, it would be difficult for sure. Time is also an issue, to go out and shop, to prepare, etc. I was just wondering if it was near the same level over the debate on raw vs kibble vs vegan for dogs. Or if it was even possible. Now I'm sure, since you proved it with a VERY healthy Amazon!

It just seemed that to me, that parrots are relatively new compared to dogs and other animals. They're not even domesticated! It's amazing that some people, although time consuming, can provide a diet like such. And IMO, if it wasn't nutritionally sound, your parrot would be unhealthy, no? (Now, I'm not bad mouthing anyone else that chooses a pellet based diet. It's reasonable and much easier to handle!)

It helps that I eat much of the same foods:54: But yes, it is costly UNLESS the owners are also eating a whole foods/raw diet. At that point, giving some to the bird(s) becomes a negligible cost. I know many people rarely eat fresh foods themselves (by fresh, I mean home-made not that people at rotten food or anything), so they are buying them especially for their birds. That does make a fresh foods diet a major extra expense (especially with a large flock) and a big consideration when choosing between fresh or pelleted diet. I also think many people give WAY to big of portions to their birds. You can always give them more if they finish it all and want more, but once it's been picked through and spoiled, it's waste.

Interestingly enough, people in the avian community tend to not like fresh food diets and the majority are in favor of pelleted diet. My best guess is that pellets are more convenient and a more economical way to ensure the bird is getting adequate nutrition.

http://www.parrotforums.com/off-topic/54837-some-my-favorite-raw-foods.html

 

[Doublete]

My flock was thrilled that last night I had fresh string beans... I don't eat many different fruits and veg... Pretty much have things in the fridge for them only. My variety that I eat is very limited. So they had a nectarine, small sweet peppers, and green beans last night.

 

[June2012]

Re: Is a "raw" diet for parrots possible?

I could see it happening, definitely. Many can't financially afford it and parrots tend to fling their food everywhere. But if you could, it would be difficult for sure. Time is also an issue, to go out and shop, to prepare, etc. I was just wondering if it was near the same level over the debate on raw vs kibble vs vegan for dogs. Or if it was even possible. Now I'm sure, since you proved it with a VERY healthy Amazon!

It just seemed that to me, that parrots are relatively new compared to dogs and other animals. They're not even domesticated! It's amazing that some people, although time consuming, can provide a diet like such. And IMO, if it wasn't nutritionally sound, your parrot would be unhealthy, no? (Now, I'm not bad mouthing anyone else that chooses a pellet based diet. It's reasonable and much easier to handle!)

It helps that I eat much of the same foods:54: But yes, it is costly UNLESS the owners are also eating a whole foods/raw diet. At that point, giving some to the bird(s) becomes a negligible cost. I know many people rarely eat fresh foods themselves (by fresh, I mean home-made not that people at rotten food or anything), so they are buying them especially for their birds. That does make a fresh foods diet a major extra expense (especially with a large flock) and a big consideration when choosing between fresh or pelleted diet. I also think many people give WAY to big of portions to their birds. You can always give them more if they finish it all and want more, but once it's been picked through and spoiled, it's waste.

Interestingly enough, people in the avian community tend to not like fresh food diets and the majority are in favor of pelleted diet. My best guess is that pellets are more convenient and a more economical way to ensure the bird is getting adequate nutrition.

http://www.parrotforums.com/off-topic/54837-some-my-favorite-raw-foods.html

Do you ever find yourself eating from the chop bowl? But that makes sense too, since a parrot wouldn't eat as much as one person in general. And how many tablespoons of chop does he eat in one meal? How many times a day do you feed him? Sorry to be so nosy, feel free to not answer!

Also, how would one know a parrot is getting full nutrition? One cannot ask a parrot this or that. I'm sure he's healthy, and you're doing your absolute best as a parront. Are there any subtle signs? (Behavioral/physical?)