It's a toughie.

[Doves1]

That's what happens to so many birds that are in need of rescue, people don't do their research or talk to other parrot owners because buying their bird, then they find out the noise level, attention needs, and diets and go....oh I can't handle or afford this I now have to sell my bird.

Then it's really hard for the bird because Parrot's bond so intimetly with their humans.

I hope the bell trick works for you and Loki settles down so you can study

 

[Joshuwaaa]

Thanks ! An yea it's such a shame. I must say today has been quite the challenge. I've had to leave him at 7:30 to sleep because he is just to cranky today.

Praying tomorrow brings better luck x

 

[Joshuwaaa]

In response to my last post. No. Today didn't bring better luck. So past me, I'm sorry for that lol.

Today has been pretty awful, I've woke up, fed him and done some bits around the house. An all day he has cried and cried so loud. Seems like attention, I just don't think I'm doing well at looking after him. I can't help him stop screaming, I'm still ignoring him and this morning have resorted to watching my iPad with earphones in to blare out his sound.

Starting to think I'm pretty awful owner !

 

[Doves1]

Your not a bad owner Josh, some birds are just very vocal.

Is Loki in his cage when he screams or out of it, or does it not matter?

What else is in the room with him, does it seem like a scared scream or a I want attention scream?

 

[sodakat]

It is NOT normal for him to call out all day. Something is going on.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

As soon as he is out of his cage he is fine. His noise decreases as his behaviour is less aggressive. Biggest difference is when he's playing with me and we are having our proper sit and play, treats, toys etc then he is wonderful and fine.

Just as soon as I walk in he starts to screech at me. So I end up ignoring him, an because he doesn't get the attention, he doesn't stop long enough for me to give any x

 

[CathnPoe]

Poe was just like this until 2 weeks ago or so.
He spends very little time in his cage, as I'm on uni holidays.
I'd put him in his cage, leave, he'd be fine, then the minute he heard me or saw me he'd scream - at different levels of intensity... some high enough you would think he'd been stabbed.
Anyway, he's now a gem.
He's screamed maybe once in a whole week!
He used to scream, LOUD, everytime the microwave beeped, even that has come down significantly and become sporadic at best with half the volume.
He's found his voice and chatters beautifully. No words, but definitely sounding out syllables.
I left the room every time he screamed, and while I thought it wasn't working. It's like it's suddenly clicked.
If he's been in his cage for a couple of hours, he might call to me once (not nearly as loud as he had been and ONLY if he sees/hears me) and then be perfectly silent when I comes to pick him up.

Loki will stop being the trouble maker his name has so appropriately prognosticated.
Hang in there.

 

[RisingSun]

I read through most of the thread but not all, so I apologize if the following was already suggested. Do you have a play stand? Either one that rolls on wheels, or a little tray/ tabletop one? Luckily Matisse only lets out a couple loud "rrraaawwk"s in the morning, evening, and sometime when I'm leaving for work. Luckily not every day though.

I find he does this if he can't see me. Having a java tree on wheels has been a blessing as I can roll him around to whatever room I'm in if I don't feel like having him hanging on me...and we're both happy. Many times they don't even need to be entertained or paid attention to...merely being in the same space with you is a enough.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

I do truely think it's for attention. He comes right to the part of his cage closest to myself, an just goes for it. About 5 seconds between each scream. An each at a different volume to the last.

As soon as he's out and on my arm, or nestled Ito my hair or t-shirt. He's fine.

I just don't like taking him out until he's quiet, I don't want to reinforce loud as being the reason he gets to come out and play.

He does have a wheelie table with a perch on it which I take him around the house in. You'll have to excuse me but if he's good, he can come sit with me while in the shower or bath, he sits with me while I wash up dishes and cleant the apartment. Only time he gets bored is when I'm sitting studying, he doesn't get I'm reading and not just staring at something lol.

If he's loud on his play stand and I ignore him, he will fly off of it and run across the floor to me lol. Even when jack had him and I went to grab a snack he flew through the apartment and ran to find me. All this is just adorable though, it's just the noise level.

Perseverance. Thanks everyone x

 

[Thingamagigs]

You are not a bad birdy parent, you are just a stressed out first time birdy mummy

Are you in the same room as him when you are ignoring him?

Let me run a scenario by you

In this scenario you don't have any pets, its just you and Jack.

You are sitting in a room together, reading/facebooking/casually occupied.
You ask Jack a question, but he doesn't respond.
He is sitting right there, next to you, but does not even acknowledge that you are there.
You repeat the question. Again, nothing.

What would you do? How would you feel? What would you do if he continued to ignore you even though he was sitting right there in the room with you?
Would you get louder? Would you try harder? Would you become distressed?

I often feel the word "ignore" is a bad word to use when describing the technique that people use to avoid a birds behaviour. I prefer to use the word "leave". In birdy society, when a bird doesn't like another birds behaviour, it normally just leaves (i.e. flies away, out of sight).
I personally feel that leaving the birds sight is very important to the process.

 

[RisingSun]

ah I see. He acts like a butt even while in the same room. Awe, it really does seem like he loves you to pieces. I'm sorry his love means you have to suffer! The first time I heard the terrible ecelctus scream I only heard rumors about but never experienced firsthand, it set me on edge for a few minutes. I feel for you. Hopefully it's just needy baby syndrome and he'll learn to be more independent as he gets older.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

I love Loki so much, it's ridiculous. Last night my aunt was over and although new people scare him a little (not sure if he's scared he's going somewhere, or anxiety about people) he was wonderful. Sat with my all night just casually chatting with us, stood on my aunt for a short while and she gave him a seed just to boost his confidence with people then came back to me for the remainder of our night.

You will have to excuse me if I refer to myself as his Mom, it's only because at the age of 21 and being in a same sex relationship, he's like my baby, an being that figure in the house, jack has always said "wanna go to mommy" lol. I'm one of those people :S! Lol

Thingamagigs I love the scenario you built up, it makes such sense to me and I wonder how I have never thought that way before. Maybe walking out the room is better. If Jack annoyed me, I too would want to scream at him haha.

I know I must look like a complete novice when it comes to bird owning, and to be honest I guess I am. He is the first big parrot I've ever lived with and it must be frustrating to see me post so much, looking like I know little to nothing. I apologise for that, I do realise that although I felt I read and asked all the information I thought necessary maybe I should of been more ready. Thank you to everyone on here though, your continued support and genuine feedback and help are much appreciated and although I'm still learning about Loki everyday, it's ace to have a community you can go too for a little bit of extra knowledge.

I may not know enough yet, but I love him to death, and maybe that is half the battle to having a bird. The rest will come with experience.

Il no doubt keep everyone posted on our daily life, I'm sure today will bring something new.

We did have joy yesterday when he started to play more with jack and his stacking toys. Lots of seeds, cuddles and kisses thrown his way as treats.

Il try the walking out technique ! An let you know.

Hope your all well, lemme know what problems you have faced, I love knowing more about my new baby x

 

[Thingamagigs]

Awwww josh! Don't apologise!
I can guarantee you that not one reasonable person is sitting here thinking that you are posting too much or doubting your love for Loki
And call yourself Mom (Mum in Australian lol) all you like I'm not in a same sex relationship but I refer to my (male) partner as my housewife

I can also promise you that most people here have been through something similar to what you are experiencing... though I think a lot of people suffer in silence... either through fear of judgement or because support just was not available when they first started owning birds.
You can do all the research in the world, get other owners opinions until your head is overflowing with information... and still end up completely unprepared for the reality of owning a big bird Most articles are based on peoples personal opinions which they base on their own experience. So compared to a cockatoo, an eclectus is quiet and subdued... so its common for that to feature heavily in articles on eclectus. Very few articles can put it into perspective for someone completely new to birds. I dream of creating a website that ranks and lists birds actual attributes (average decibel of various types of calls, average frequency of calls, weight comparisons, beak size comparisons, probability of aggression etc)... but that would take a lot of time that I don't currently have.

It does get easier though... even if Loki never changes. Its just like when you have your first child You have no idea the love you are capable of, the things you can overcome and the crazy things you can tolerate for that love. Children grow you into a calmer, more tolerant person. Having a needy bird is kind of similar.

 

[drlisaort]

Outstanding post Thingamagig! I also find when I "leave" the room if I call out to him from wherever I am in a "normal" tone of voice he responds in the same tone. I feel like we are bird talking back and forth.

 

[Doves1]

As has already been said it's for attention, he's bored in his cage and wants to be with you.

Try getting new toys and switching them up so he never has the same toy in his cage. My boy is like that too, these birds are so smart that they get bored easily and when board they can either get destructive or loud.

A play stand would help, espeically a Java Tree with toys connected to it. The trick is just to keep him occupied

 

[ProbablyHarrison]

I obviously don't have any hands on experience yet, but I just got a book by Barbara Heidenreich that deals with the major behavioral issues most parrots deal with and she has a whole chapter on screaming. She always uses positive reinforcement and has years and years of training experience. Here's a helpful passage:

"...it is important to satisfy that [attention] need another way. You have decided that screaming will not get a response from you. So what will? That is up for you to decide. While you are trying to ignore your parrot screaming, he may offer another sound. If he does, and you like that sound, respond to it immediately. You can repeat the sound back, or you can say 'good,' or you can give your bird visual contact with you, whatever lets your bird know you are there." ("Good Bird!," Heidenriech, 24)​

She presents this as an alternative if the bird does not respond to rewarding silence. She also mentions that if you are persistently keeping the same consistent response to screaming, it will often increase incessantly as your bird tries desperately to get it to work. This means you're on the right track because your positive reinforcement will eventually convince the bird that screaming doesn't get it what it wants, and the other, preferred route, does. I've read many trainers suggest this/similar routes, as a noise replacement. Give the bird a new, more interesting or fun sound that they like to make and respond to that, and they won't want to scream anymore.

 

[sodakat]

That's what I do, ProbablyHarrison. Only one of my birds, Sailor, really needs this reinforcement but it is a must for him. I chose a two-tone whistle with a high note followed by a low note. I mean I whistle that to him, not that I use an actual whistle. And he whistles it back to me. Often he will initiate the whistle, usually if I'm in another room but sometimes when I'm in the bird room with my back to his cage. I try to always, always answer his whistle. I also make the whistle when he is carrying on with another (annoying) call just as a reminder to him.

Sailor is an excellent talker with a good vocabulary so this is why I chose a whistle noise instead of a word. I figured the whistle would be a specific sound we could share instead of a word that maybe wouldn't mean as much since we talk all the time.

I am not too good about ignoring their hollering. Its just not my nature. Therefore, LaFitte says "stop that" when some other bird is carrying on too long and Sully will holler, "stop" in a sing-song voice. Gee, I wonder where they learned that?

When I'm on the crazy train --- remember I have eight Eclectus --- I generally don't stop to think if what I say to them will be repeated. But, I do try really hard never to say anything I'll regret later if I hear it said back to me.

Sully calls himself Sully Greenbird and sometimes Sully Badbird. I think that was likely a joke in his last home because he also says some very loving things so I know someone cared deeply about him. 3 of the 4 eclectus I acquired as adults are talkers and not one of them says something that indicates they were anything but loved in their other homes. Even my poor nekkid Lolly girl says, "what a pretty girl, pretty, pretty girl".

 

[Joshuwaaa]

Just got some mail and wanted to share it. My friend sent me a small parcel, and inside was a little pet clicker !

She said maybe I could try using it to train Loki to do some tricks, help him quieten down and maybe help with step up and such.

To be honest, his step up is really good, he's happy to step up, not always directly on command though, but I don't mind that, I like that he only steps up when he wants to and who he wants to.

Hoping clicker training will quieten him down, does anyone know how to use it effectively, without making a robot bird to clicks x

 

[sodakat]

Josh, the first thing most clicker trainers/groups recommend is to "charge" the clicker. This means you teach your bird what will happen when you click. The way I did it with mine was to click, then immediately give a treat.

They quickly learn that when they hear the sound of the clicker they will receive a treat. This is the whole concept of using a clicker; helping them associate the sound of the clicker with a coming treat.

Once they "get it" you can move to the next step which is clicking when they do what you request. For example, ask for a step up, the bird steps up, you click then immediately give a treat.

But since he already steps up nicely you may want to use the clicker with new requests instead. Many clicker trainers/groups suggest you teach a bird to touch a stick. A chopstick works well or a pen or pencil. The idea is to teach the bird to touch the stick with his beak. So you hold the stick close to him but far enough away that he must make an effort to touch his beak to the stick (like a couple inches). Just hold it still and let him touch the stick when he is ready. When he touches his beak to it immediately click and treat.

This is repeated until constant. The next step is to move the stick farther away so he has to move his body in order to touch the stick. Click and reward.

Finally you touch the stick to a spot that requires him to move or even fly to another perch. Click and reward.

Clicker training is mentally stimulating to most birds.

But, I don't think you can click to reward silence. That would be too confusing for the bird, IMO.

Good luck!

 

[Joshuwaaa]

Past few days have been horrendous. While everyone is making videos of their birds being lovely, Loki has just constantly screamed.

It's becoming unbareable and we now don't spend time in the front room. Past few days his screams have been awful and I can't stop it. I walk out. He screams. I have been for days even not being able to put his food in because his screams send me out.

I can't stand this living condition with him. We have tried everything. He just won't stop. We are getting to a point where we can't live with him and I'm starting to dislike him.

He was so lovely and we seem to be trying so hard, but he doesn't stop. We take him out and soon as he goes back in he just yells. Please tell me something will change, otherwise I don't know what I will do, it's horrible not being able to be near him.