Orange-winged with deformed flight feathers

[Marina]

Kiwi is 10. Her previous owner never took her to the vet and fed her seeds. She is now tested for diseases and now eats harrisons. Her deformed feathers are only where her flight feathers form. She has had multiple surgeries in the past 7 months to remove them and they keep coming back. Two vets have rarely seen this happen to an amazon and this bad. It is not fungus, bacteria, metal poisoning, liver disease (although that hasnt been tested, she just has no symptoms)or cancer. Further tests are now being done. Can anyone help us out? Her last option is to remove those feather folicles completely.

 

[JerseyWendy]

Welcome to the forum, Marina.

How long have you had Kiwi? Was she clipped when you got her from her previous home? Is it at all possible that she damaged the feather follicles due to bad trims, and that's why her new flights come in deformed?

I certainly wish you only the best with her.

 

[henpecked]

Welcome to the forum. i'm not sure what i'm looking at in the photo. Aren't those feathers up near the body< not feathers that are normally trimmed? Could you get some more photos please. Does the vet think she night have an enlarged liver? I don't see fungal/bacterial issues. More likely heavy metals or compromised liver functions, IMO. (rusty cage?) Are there other feathers with stress bars ? What benefit to removing follicles ? Why are the deformed feathers a health issue,more likely a symptom. Find/fix the problem and the symptoms go away. I'd explore a VitA rich diet (fresh is best) with natural sun light in small doses.

 

[Marina]

Weve had her for roughly 8 months. Her wings were nearly void of flight feathers. If its due to bad trims we cant really ever find out. It is a last possibility if all other tests come out inconclusive.

Welcome to the forum, Marina.

How long have you had Kiwi? Was she clipped when you got her from her previous home? Is it at all possible that she damaged the feather follicles due to bad trims, and that's why her new flights come in deformed?

I certainly wish you only the best with her.

 

[Marina]

I put up new pics. The clubbed feathers pop up from middle to end of her wing and do not develop inwards close to her body as far as we could tell. None of the vets thought she had a bad liver and she is otherwise healthy and shows no symptoms of liver disease. It is not heavy metal poisoning either. She came to us with dull feathering, semi soft beak and void of almost all primary flight feathers. She has a long crooked one on her right wing at the tip and has molted a few adult feathers that had an abnormal bump on the shaft. She came back negative for fungal, bacterial or cancer and they are now doing further tests. Ive read a deficiency in b2 vitamins can cause clubbed feathers. Having her do multiple surgeries a year for the next 30+ years getting rid of the painful clubbed feathers is not an option for us or her. Its either we get a cause for them and hopefully a treatment or we get her folicles removed completely. As i suspected most people have never seen this so badly in an amazon as it is rare to produce clubbed feathers so many and so often. I heard of there being strains of beak and feather that need to be tested differently than the usual tests and it could be she has such a small amount in her system that basic tests miss it unless the sample was large enough and the test was strong enough. Again that is a extremely rare scenario. We all know the clubbed feathers are a symptom but it is of what that is puzzling. If no answer is found then the folicles will be removed. She wont ever be in pain anymore but the risk of her falling hard throughout the course of her life is also up there in our worries. She is on organic harrisons adult lifetime pellets and a concocsion of fruit and veggie smoothies as her eating them as solids is unlikely since she was poorly socialized to new things and would freak out at the sight of unfamiliar foods. We got her to take carrots, banana, apple slices and thats about it. The rest is hit or miss every day. She takes any drink in a cup tho so smoothies work best for her.

Welcome to the forum. i'm not sure what i'm looking at in the photo. Aren't those feathers up near the body< not feathers that are normally trimmed? Could you get some more photos please. Does the vet think she night have an enlarged liver? I don't see fungal/bacterial issues. More likely heavy metals or compromised liver functions, IMO. (rusty cage?) Are there other feathers with stress bars ? What benefit to removing follicles ? Why are the deformed feathers a health issue,more likely a symptom. Find/fix the problem and the symptoms go away. I'd explore a VitA rich diet (fresh is best) with natural sun light in small doses.

 

[henpecked]

I'll be home next week and email those pics to a friend of mine.He knows everything about amazons. I'll let you know what he says. If you don't mind, i'll show them to a couple of vets.

 

[Marina]

Much appreciated. The feathers are currently undergoing advanced tests for rare fungus or bacteria. We will ask if he can do a full blood workup to see if she is deficient in anything. My personal email is m.guppy@hotmail.com if you require more pictures.

I'll be home next week and email those pics to a friend of mine.He knows everything about amazons. I'll let you know what he says. If you don't mind, i'll show them to a couple of vets.

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Hello

This is Marina's boyfriend, Kiwi is actually my bird and she is now eating more veggies than ever ! We started Prime vitamins supplemnt from Hagen and i hope she is going to get better. Henpecked , did you get a chance to talk to your friend ?

Regards,

Stephane

 

[Karigan]

So they're growing in hooked and spiraled then? Do the vets know if there's follicle damage?

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Hello Karigan,

The vet is not sure to be hosnest because we have to keep in mind that she was on seeds for 9 years and half until we got her... she doesn't know what a toy is i think i might start considering her has a rescue bird..

 

[henpecked]

Hey guys, sent you an email but failed to tell who i was,LOL

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Hello henpecked did you sent it to m.guppy@hotmail.com ? I'm in her inbox right now and i am not seeing anything :S

 

[henpecked]

Right email. I'll try it again

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Hello,

I replied to your e-mail

REgards

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Update on Kiwi's Health :

The feather biopsy did not reveal any fungus or Bacteria. We also did Full Bloodwork and everything came back 100 % normal beside her Cholesterol ( a bit above normal)

Everything seems to be pointing at Damaged Feather Follicle. Those are my two options :

1 - I pay to remove the crooked feathers everything hoping that they'll heal and grow back nicely. That's a risk to take because every molt is going to be different.

2- I pay to get her Flight feathers remove completly

I have absolutely no idea what to do in that case. It is my decision because it's my bird but i need more advice.

Thanks

Stephane

 

[henpecked]

I heard back from Howard yesterday.He had showed your story and pics around as i had also. No one seemed to have any answers that your Vet has not explored. Because of the mention of bumble foot he suggested that you check and make sure mites aren't an issue. Yes Bumble foot is usually caused by bacteria , sometimes a mite infestation can cause similar results. Are we talking about the same few feathers on each wing? Or do new feathers anywhere on her do this. If it's only a couple of feathers on each wing then maybe having the follicle removed is the answer. Do the feathers ever mature? How many feathers need to be "fixed"?

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Hello Henpecked,

Kiwi has a surgery on her right wing a month and half ago and she has no cyst on the right side. I do not know if it is a good sign because the feathers doesn't seem to be regrowing at all.. She has some cyst on her left wing that doesn't really bother her right now and i'M waiting as long as possible if anything will grow back on the right side. We are not 100% sure that those are the feathers that got removed a while ago.

For the bumblefoot.. Our previous vet gave us Batril that i need to apply daily on her foot and it doesn't seem to work.. i Think i am going to go back to our new vet..

 

[henpecked]

With the bumble foot,, have you changed her perches? Does she have any natural, larger diameter perches? How does she receive the baytril? Have you checked for "scalely leg mites"?

 

[MissyMe83]

I wish you the best of luck with her! Sounds like you're doing the absolute best for her. Please keep us updated with your findings and how she's doing. I'm glad that you found eachother!

 

[OrangeWingedKiwi]

Hello Henpecked,

Her perches were too small and now she only has 2 perchers ( that we lowered).

She has a 1 1/8 inches Perch and a Wood one. I am thinking of getting rid of all

her perches so she can heal faster... Regarding the Baytril i am applying it

directly on her feet ( as my vets instruction). I need to rub it onto the red

patches and i do that wearing plastic surgeon gloves.

Thanks !