Pellets in diet?

[Nooblet]

Hi everyone,

I have been doing a little research in regards to giving pellets as a small part of an Eclectus diet. Now I have come across conflicting things. Some say it's good for them others saying not to give them any at all. What is the right thing to do?

 

[EAI]

An Eclectus diet should be consisted of most, more likely entirely, fresh foods.

But from my perspective it would be hard to throw it out if it becomes rotten if you have school or job (ie). There are specialized Eclectus pellets that should be suitable if it was only used as a "filler" for when your'e gone. It shouldn't be their entire diet but IMO it's sure better than them eating rotting foods.

 

[Anansi]

The problem with pellets for eclectus parrots is that pellets are an enriched food. This is usually a good thing, but ekkies have a significantly longer digestive tract than other parrots... which allows more time for the extraction of vitamins from the food bring digested.

So, since they're already getting more out of their food than other parrots, enriched meals are pretty much overkill.

Too much of a good thing, basically.

This can lead to toe tapping, increased aggressiveness, and even plucking.

Personally, I feed my ekkies a maximum of 10 Harrison's pellets a day. 5 in the morning and 5 in the evening. Just in a "topping off" type capacity. Not enough to pose a problem.

Whether or not you do include a small sampling of organic pellets to your ekky's diet, his/her daily intake should consist of 80-90% fresh fruits and veggies.

 

[suley]

The problem with pellets for eclectus parrots is that pellets are an enriched food. This is usually a good thing, but ekkies have a significantly longer digestive tract than other parrots... which allows more time for the extraction of vitamins from the food bring digested.

So, since they're already getting more out of their food than other parrots, enriched meals are pretty much overkill.

Too much of a good thing, basically.

This can lead to toe tapping, increased aggressiveness, and even plucking.

Personally, I feed my ekkies a maximum of 10 Harrison's pellets a day. 5 in the morning and 5 in the evening. Just in a "topping off" type capacity. Not enough to pose a problem.

Whether or not you do include a small sampling of organic pellets to your ekky's diet, his/her daily intake should consist of 80-90% fresh fruits and veggies.

It is interesting that you say 80-90% should be fresh fruits and veggies as that is what I feed my bird.

However I know someone who has about 6 ekkies and he feeds them mostly pellets and seeds and he only gives them fruit and veg twice a week max. He tells me after he started giving them pellets their feather colours just became much more bright and full of life. In fact his birds are going to be featured in Rob Marshall's(prominent avian vet) new book. So I am very much assuming his birds are in very good health on this diet.

He told me my male ekkies red underneath could be more bright. Got me thinking should I start giving Yoshi some pellets.

I would also note that he was feeding his birds coloured pellets also but he assured me that they are just food colouring and won't harm the bird. But everywhere I have read that you should especially stay away from coloured pellets.

Anyways just food for thought. Would love to hear what you think about such a diet based around mostly pellets.

 

[drlisaort]

I personally do not give Oliver pellets with the exception of one or two that slip from the package of dried treats that I put in his forager...and even with the mixture (nuts, grains, raisins) it's a total of about a tablespoon in all....

 

[Anansi]

The problem with pellets for eclectus parrots is that pellets are an enriched food. This is usually a good thing, but ekkies have a significantly longer digestive tract than other parrots... which allows more time for the extraction of vitamins from the food bring digested.

So, since they're already getting more out of their food than other parrots, enriched meals are pretty much overkill.

Too much of a good thing, basically.

This can lead to toe tapping, increased aggressiveness, and even plucking.

Personally, I feed my ekkies a maximum of 10 Harrison's pellets a day. 5 in the morning and 5 in the evening. Just in a "topping off" type capacity. Not enough to pose a problem.

Whether or not you do include a small sampling of organic pellets to your ekky's diet, his/her daily intake should consist of 80-90% fresh fruits and veggies.

It is interesting that you say 80-90% should be fresh fruits and veggies as that is what I feed my bird.

However I know someone who has about 6 ekkies and he feeds them mostly pellets and seeds and he only gives them fruit and veg twice a week max. He tells me after he started giving them pellets their feather colours just became much more bright and full of life. In fact his birds are going to be featured in Rob Marshall's(prominent avian vet) new book. So I am very much assuming his birds are in very good health on this diet.

He told me my male ekkies red underneath could be more bright. Got me thinking should I start giving Yoshi some pellets.

I would also note that he was feeding his birds coloured pellets also but he assured me that they are just food colouring and won't harm the bird. But everywhere I have read that you should especially stay away from coloured pellets.

Anyways just food for thought. Would love to hear what you think about such a diet based around mostly pellets.

Hiya, Suley!

This is a rather old thread, so let me start by saying that my feeding habits have changed a bit since then. I now do not give my ekkies any pellets at all. I still don't have a problem with giving maybe 10 pellets in a day to an ekkie, but since I've managed to raise perfectly healthy eclectus without them, I didn't much see the point.

Here are my thoughts on pellets in the ekkie diet. Not everyone who feeds their ekkies a pellet-based diet is necessarily going to see the ill-effects of toe-tapping or wing-flipping. Ekkies are just more prone to developing issues from pellets due to an overdose of vitamins than other parrots. That's like if I were to tell someone that they were more likely to develop high blood pressure because both of their parents had it. I'm not saying high blood pressure is their destiny. There is simply a greater likelihood that it could happen to them and they should approach their chosen diet accordingly. Know what I mean?

Now, I can't claim to have researched every pellet out there. And I'm aware of Rob Marshall and the success he's apparently had with supplementing ekkie diets. But here's my view. I know that it's possible to give ekkies everything that they need via a fresh and varied diet of fruits, veggies, grains and legumes. I know there are no pellet trees in nature. I know that a significant number of ekkies suffer from the effects of over-supplementation due to diets consisting either solely or mostly of pellets... or the addition of vitamin supplements to their food. And I know that there have been ekkies with terrible lab results who boasted plumage most brilliant in color.

So I'm not denying that your friend might have healthy parrots. (Though the fact that it seems a large portion of the diet consists of seeds as well does make me twitch a little bit.) Truth is, without seeing them or any lab test results, I really just don't know.

But I am saying that I personally wouldn't risk the damage to my ekkies that could potentially occur due to accidental over-supplementation. Why risk it when I know that I can give them all they need from more natural sources?

 

[Anansi]

Oh, and as for brilliant plumage...

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No pellets here.

 

[Peppagirl]

Oh, and as for brilliant plumage...

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No pellets here.

WOW!! She is stunning!!!!!!!

 

[Anansi]

Thank you! I absolutely love when she stretches her wings like that.

 

[Peppagirl]

Thank you! I absolutely love when she stretches her wings like that.

Her colours are so bright and amazing. Those feathers are beautiful........

 

[Anansi]

Thank you! She takes quite a bit of pride in her plumage, preening away with such delicate precision. Lol! And I help her along with baths given every other day.

 

[skylala]

There is nothing wrong with feeding your eclectus pellets, so long as you give them the right ones.

I give mine Paradise Pellets by VetaFarm. This is a specially designed recipe specifically for frugivores (Fruit eaters). Eclectus are frugivores.
These pellets were created by Taronga Zoo for their Toucans and is specifically low in iron which is ideal for eclectus.

If a ZOO is OK with feeding their own eclectus these pellets, I am OK with it. Vets recommend pellets! Pellets are the easiest way to give your parrot a complete diet, which can be very difficult when giving only fruit and veg. My eclectus is a picky eater so it is literally IMPOSSIBLE to give him a balanced diet any other way, and it's awful having so many 'experts' online making other people feel bad and stressing about giving their bird pellets when it is right and it is working for them. Maybe there will be instances where pellet diet didn't work for a particular individual.. That doesn't mean it won't work for your bird, nor does it make it bad. Some people have bad reactions to eating a peanut! Are peanuts bad now because a group of people got on the internet saying they had personal experience that removing peanuts from their diet made them healthier? Remember that for every person on the internet saying pellets are awful and their birds improved SO MUCH when they removed pellets, there are the opposite people saying their birds are doing just fine on pellets and even improved SO MUCH when they switched to a pellet diet.

An incomplete fresh diet is WORSE then a complete pellet diet designed for these animals.

Don't get sucked into the hysteria. People with no veterinary or scientific knowledge giving advice to people based on anecdotal opinions that have never been proven. Trust the scientists and vets, not random people on the internet Remember that 'breeders' are not scientists or vets either.
Go to your vet. Get some blood work done. Find out if he is getting the appropriate vitamins and minerals and put your mind at ease and adjust if necessary, instead of relying on people who know nothing at all about your birds health.

There are different pellets designed for different birds: Get the right one and you will be fine.
Remember, pellets are a complete diet. Issues with eclectus come about from either vitamin deficiency, or getting too much of some vitamins. If you give your parrots pellets that have x% of vitamin Y, then give your parrot heaps of veg and fruit that also has loads of vitamin Y... They can now be overloaded with vitamin Y. So be mindful of that as well. Pellets come with a guideline of how much to feed vs fresh fruit and veg for a reason. If you change this, you may not be giving your parrot a balanced diet any more.

If you choose to do a complete fresh diet, that's fine too. If done properly, this would be the most ideal diet for them. But it is risky and you must make sure it is a balanced diet and they are getting ALL of the vitamins and minerals they need. If you can do that, do it! It would be a wonderful diet.

 

[JerseyWendy]

Opinions are a wonderful thing.

 

[JerseyWendy]

It often appears as if our Australian members seem to strongly disagree with many American members being against feeding pellets.

There are phenomenal Australian articles (and forums) dedicated to the Eclectus parrot.

Here is one great read regarding the controversial diet subject (Australian website):
pellets

More great info right here (by Dr. Rob Marshall, very famous Australian Aviculturist)
http://birdhealth.com.au/petbirds/care/care_Eclectus.html

And even more (Graham Taylor, Australian Eclectus breeder)
http://eclectus-parrots.com/diet/

 

[Terry57]

I feed my ekkie just as Stephen (Anansi) feeds his beautiful ekkies.
My vet specifically said no pellets, so Ekko only gets fresh fruits, grains and veggies, and his blood work always comes back fine It takes a bit of work to make sure their diet is nutritionally correct, but it can be done

 

[Anansi]

There is nothing wrong with feeding your eclectus pellets, so long as you give them the right ones.

I give mine Paradise Pellets by VetaFarm. This is a specially designed recipe specifically for frugivores (Fruit eaters). Eclectus are frugivores.
These pellets were created by Taronga Zoo for their Toucans and is specifically low in iron which is ideal for eclectus.

If a ZOO is OK with feeding their own eclectus these pellets, I am OK with it. Vets recommend pellets! Pellets are the easiest way to give your parrot a complete diet, which can be very difficult when giving only fruit and veg. My eclectus is a picky eater so it is literally IMPOSSIBLE to give him a balanced diet any other way, and it's awful having so many 'experts' online making other people feel bad and stressing about giving their bird pellets when it is right and it is working for them. Maybe there will be instances where pellet diet didn't work for a particular individual.. That doesn't mean it won't work for your bird, nor does it make it bad. Some people have bad reactions to eating a peanut! Are peanuts bad now because a group of people got on the internet saying they had personal experience that removing peanuts from their diet made them healthier? Remember that for every person on the internet saying pellets are awful and their birds improved SO MUCH when they removed pellets, there are the opposite people saying their birds are doing just fine on pellets and even improved SO MUCH when they switched to a pellet diet.

An incomplete fresh diet is WORSE then a complete pellet diet designed for these animals.

Don't get sucked into the hysteria. People with no veterinary or scientific knowledge giving advice to people based on anecdotal opinions that have never been proven. Trust the scientists and vets, not random people on the internet Remember that 'breeders' are not scientists or vets either.
Go to your vet. Get some blood work done. Find out if he is getting the appropriate vitamins and minerals and put your mind at ease and adjust if necessary, instead of relying on people who know nothing at all about your birds health.

There are different pellets designed for different birds: Get the right one and you will be fine.
Remember, pellets are a complete diet. Issues with eclectus come about from either vitamin deficiency, or getting too much of some vitamins. If you give your parrots pellets that have x% of vitamin Y, then give your parrot heaps of veg and fruit that also has loads of vitamin Y... They can now be overloaded with vitamin Y. So be mindful of that as well. Pellets come with a guideline of how much to feed vs fresh fruit and veg for a reason. If you change this, you may not be giving your parrot a balanced diet any more.

If you choose to do a complete fresh diet, that's fine too. If done properly, this would be the most ideal diet for them. But it is risky and you must make sure it is a balanced diet and they are getting ALL of the vitamins and minerals they need. If you can do that, do it! It would be a wonderful diet.

If a pellet-based diet works for you and your bird, I think that's great. As I stated before, I'd never categorically assert that all pellets are bad for all ekkies.

However, I think it's safe to say that ekkies have proven quite susceptible to complications arising from the use of pellets and supplements. Now again, I'm not saying all pellets and supplements are bad, but at the same time I believe it may be somewhat irresponsible to term a justifiable wariness of said pellets and supplements as "hysteria".

While not all eclectus parrots on pellet-based diets suffer from toe-tapping and wing-flipping, the number of them that do is undeniably significant. Let's not pretend otherwise.

You stated, "There are different pellets designed for different birds: Get the right one and you will be fine." That's quite the bold and declarative statement. Thing is, who is to say which is the right one? There have been pellets touted as "eclectus safe" before that have led to harmful dietary imbalances despite their brand's assertions to the contrary. Why does a particular pellet brand work for one ekkie and not for another? Who knows? Certainly not I. But it does happen. And we "random people on the internet" who, according to you, are sucking hapless innocents into our apparently shared "hysteria", are merely letting people know that it does happen.

You mention also that if zoos are okay with feeding their own eclectus parrots pellets, then you are too. Fair enough. And I applaud your unshakeable faith in the zoological system as a whole. I, however, disagree with a number of policies held by many zoos as regards the safety and happiness of their animals, so that particular point has precious little impact with me.

If you want to make the case that pellets can indeed work for ekkies, by all means, do so. As Wendy pointed out, opinions are indeed wonderful things. Just understand that others have opinions as well, and implying that said others are both uninformed and spreaders of hysteria falls far short of accurate and lumbers, rather ponderously, into the realm of the insulting.

 

[JerseyWendy]

Stephen:

LOVE what you said and how you said it.

 

[Terry57]

Stephen:

LOVE what you said and how you said it.

I completely agree

 

[Allee]

Stephen:

LOVE what you said and how you said it.

I completely agree

I absolutely agree with both of you!

Beautifully said, Stephen.

 

[Betrisher]

Would you like to live on a diet that included a couple of handfuls of vitamin pills every day? Or on pelleted food that consisted of dried and compressed roast pork or barbecued beef or cookies and milk?

It has long been established that all living organisms do best eating a balanced diet based on natural foods. More recently, we're discovering that food additives can be harmful and vitamin overdosing can too (viz. Vitamin A etc). Why even consider feeding a bird artificial substitutes when you live in a developed nation where fresh and varied food is so easily available?

Yes, if push comes to shove a bird will do OK on pellets. So would you. However, you would also languish every day for the taste of fresh meat and veggies with the occasional fruit to tickle your taste buds. I know my birds relish their daily fruit and veggies because they eat them first. The pellets come last every time.

I have no specialist knowledge of Eclectus parrots beyond the fact that everyone seems to say they do best on a natural regimen. Certainly, your birds probably won't die if you feed them pellets. They won't die if you feed them unnecessary supplements. I just don't understand why artificial foods would even be considered when fresh is so easily available.