Asking for prayers

[Terry57]

Good grief!!! There is no way that simply hydrating Phoe brought his UA down that much!!! So that first Vet couldn't even do blood-work correctly...I must have missed the fact that they used a toenail-clipping to get that round of blood-work done. I thought that they had finally decided to just draw the blood from his Jugular Vein without any sedation or anesthesia (like they should be doing all the time anyway) after you kept refusing it...So that explains a lot...That would most-likely have put his UA and Creatine levels in the "high-normal" range, which is not at all indicative of any type of Kidney Disease, Gout, etc., but rather indicative of an Infection...

Nothing like scaring the crap out of you and making you think your bird is dying of Kidney Disease to ruin your holiday...I think I'll give my CAV a hug the next time I see him. We tend to take our CAV's for granted (as well as my Certified Herp Vet who is also extremely good with my Beardie)...It's sad that Vets like this are the only option a lot of people have anywhere near them. You're right Terry, a lot of people with less bird/medical experience would have just followed everything that Vet said to them because they don't know any better, and because they want to do everything they can that is best for their bird, and why wouldn't they trust a Veterinarian who is willing to see/treat birds? If they weren't qualified to diagnose/treat birds, then why would they be doing it, right? My God, what if someone in this situation were to follow that Vet's advice, thinking that their bird was dying of kidney failure, was in pain, and that there was nothing that could be done and they were just going to suffer for a long time and then die a painful death, so the owner made the decision to euthanize their beloved bird. Then they decide to have a necropsy done just to see what the cause of the kidney disease was for future reference, only to find out that their bird's kidneys were fine and they simply had a little infection that was easily treated...Can you imagine going through that? I would be arrested...

I would also be arrested if something like that happened. I think this has been one of the longest weeks of my life. Phoe has always been so healthy, his plucking has always been his only issue. I love all my birds, but Phoe holds a special place in my heart because of his plucking, and just because of who he is. This was a gut punch, and a learning experience as well. It just goes to show what has been said so many times - sometimes going to a bad vet is worse than waiting for your own vet, or finding a vet who actually has experience with birds. This vet was young, so didn't even have any experience to draw on.

Unfortunately for her, I have many contacts in the bird world here and have gotten the word out.

I did give my vet a huge hug, too Lucky she was on the phone yesterday because I may have crushed her.

 

[ChristaNL]

Yup, your emergency vet has a ****load to learn about birds (and how to listen to/ handle the ownersituation)
.. maybe kick her/him in that direction as much as warning other people.
Educating the vet may help save more birds than just blacklisting an (as yet) semi-incompetent one.


We all made mistakes, we expect better from our CAVs!
(and this one should be really deeply ashamed)

 

[Terry57]

Yup, your emergency vet has a ****load to learn about birds (and how to listen to/ handle the ownersituation)
.. maybe kick her/him in that direction as much as warning other people.
Educating the vet may help save more birds than just blacklisting an (as yet) semi-incompetent one.


We all made mistakes, we expect better from our CAVs!
(and this one should be really deeply ashamed)

Hard to let her know anything when she won't even return my call now.
I am going to err on the side of caution, I would not be able to handle it if she hurt one of my friend's birds because I didn't say anything.

 

[Laurasea]

I hink I shared before that I had a cat who was born with one kidney, when she was ten she had crystals and a bad infection, my vet said we should euthanize, I took her to a different vet the same day, wevtrested her infection and she lived seven more healthy years!!!! Then I fed her that bad batch of cat food that caused so many deaths...and I lost her..that's why I am a firm believer if you have a serious illness it's worth getting a second opion...I mean I had seven more years with a cat my vet wanted to kill!!!!

 

[Terry57]

I hink I shared before that I had a cat who was born with one kidney, when she was ten she had crystals and a bad infection, my vet said we should euthanize, I took her to a different vet the same day, wevtrested her infection and she lived seven more healthy years!!!! Then I fed her that bad batch of cat food that caused so many deaths...and I lost her..that's why I am a firm believer if you have a serious illness it's worth getting a second opion...I mean I had seven more years with a cat my vet wanted to kill!!!!

That's an amazing story, Laura, I'm so glad you had those extra years with her. Thank goodness you got that second opinion! I am so sorry for how you lost her
I had a cat who had terrible crystals as well, he was inbred and things weren't right inside him. Believe it or not they basically did a sex change on him so he would pee like a female, and we had him for another 8 years after that. I had a wonderful dog/cat vet at the time who moved heaven and earth to find a surgeon to do the work. He is actually what made me listen to my gut at the vet's the other day about anesthesia. When Shrimple got sick the last time (he had many issues because of the inbreeding) , I knew it was time to say goodbye, but I let the new vet who had taken over at that time talk me into running every test known to man. She kept asking me if I didn't want to save him. He died alone in the back of the vet's office while they were running tests. If I had listened to my gut then, I would have been with him and saved him that extra pain of those tests, and allowed him to go peacefully. I learned then to never ignore what I was feeling, and that vets are not always right.

I completely agree, always get a second opinion if in doubt, and do what you feel is best.

 

[LaManuka]

I’ve read and re-read this a few times over to make sure I was reading it right ... let’s just say after everything you and Phoe have been through I very much admire your restraint!!! And I’m very happy Phoe is doing so well!

 

[ChristaNL]

Just for the record: I am not saying "forgive and forget" about the terrible vet!
It is just... many people may not get your warning in time, but 'fixing the vet' might prevent future problems (even if that person decides not to see birds anymore that would be a good thing / at least in this case...it would have spared you so much heartache.)


How is Poe today?
Relieved owners make for an even happier bird?

 

[Kalel]

OMG, Terry! I just saw this! Sending positive thoughts your way and wishing the best for you, Reg, dear little Phoe and all your feathered family! I am glad Phoe is doing better! May the new year bring you more good tidings

 

[EllenD]

I agree in telling your local friends/family with birds not to go there unless it's an absolute emergency and there is NOWHERE ELSE to go at all...However, I would also at least send an email to that Vet, trying to be as "educational" as you can be, lol, just to make this horrible mistake they made a learning experience for them, because regardless of how many people you tell, this young Vet is no-doubt going to see/treat many, many, many more birds, they may have already (I'm guessing this is an "Exotics Vet" or Exotics Hospital), and apparently they have no CAV to learn from there. Something short and to the point, such as "I just wanted to let you know that Phoe is fine, he does not at all have Kidney Disease, but rather a simple infection that can be treated with the proper medication. When blood-levels were retested with blood that was drawn the correct way, from one of his Jugular-Veins, which should not require any sedation and certainly no general-anesthesia at all once you are trained how to do it correctly, Phoe's UA and other levels were all within the normal range, indicating that running the blood tests from blood taken from a clipped-toenail resulted in very inaccurate numbers. I just wanted to let you know this so that you can learn from this and not make the same mistakes with another bird, and so you can hopefully be taught by an experienced Avian Vet how to draw blood from one of their two Jugular Veins properly without any sedation or anesthesia, and so that no one else has to falsely believe that their bird is dying of a condition that they don't actually have."

That was me being as nice as I could possibly be to that vet...It hurt me, lol, but you get the idea...

 

[Terry57]

I’ve read and re-read this a few times over to make sure I was reading it right ... let’s just say after everything you and Phoe have been through I very much admire your restraint!!! And I’m very happy Phoe is doing so well!

Thank you, LaManuka! Somehow I don't think my restraint would have been as..uh, restrained had I been face to face with her when I got the news about the issue with the first tests.

Just for the record: I am not saying "forgive and forget" about the terrible vet!
It is just... many people may not get your warning in time, but 'fixing the vet' might prevent future problems (even if that person decides not to see birds anymore that would be a good thing / at least in this case...it would have spared you so much heartache.)


How is Poe today?
Relieved owners make for an even happier bird?

Phoe was tired yesterday, but still eating and drinking. He kept running over to me looking for the syringe, so I am still letting him drink water from it. I love doing it as much as he enjoys doing it. In my upset, I never mentioned that I had to end up using 6 different syringes because everyone was jealous and wanted to be fed water by syringe. After giving it to Phoe I have to go to all the other conures so they don't feel left out. Good news is that giving anyone meds from here on out won't be an issue

OMG, Terry! I just saw this! Sending positive thoughts your way and wishing the best for you, Reg, dear little Phoe and all your feathered family! I am glad Phoe is doing better! May the new year bring you more good tidings

Thank you, Kalel, and our family & flock sends you & yours wishes for a wonderful new year!

I agree in telling your local friends/family with birds not to go there unless it's an absolute emergency and there is NOWHERE ELSE to go at all...However, I would also at least send an email to that Vet, trying to be as "educational" as you can be, lol, just to make this horrible mistake they made a learning experience for them, because regardless of how many people you tell, this young Vet is no-doubt going to see/treat many, many, many more birds, they may have already (I'm guessing this is an "Exotics Vet" or Exotics Hospital), and apparently they have no CAV to learn from there. Something short and to the point, such as "I just wanted to let you know that Phoe is fine, he does not at all have Kidney Disease, but rather a simple infection that can be treated with the proper medication. When blood-levels were retested with blood that was drawn the correct way, from one of his Jugular-Veins, which should not require any sedation and certainly no general-anesthesia at all once you are trained how to do it correctly, Phoe's UA and other levels were all within the normal range, indicating that running the blood tests from blood taken from a clipped-toenail resulted in very inaccurate numbers. I just wanted to let you know this so that you can learn from this and not make the same mistakes with another bird, and so you can hopefully be taught by an experienced Avian Vet how to draw blood from one of their two Jugular Veins properly without any sedation or anesthesia, and so that no one else has to falsely believe that their bird is dying of a condition that they don't actually have."

That was me being as nice as I could possibly be to that vet...It hurt me, lol, but you get the idea...

Ellen, I am going to borrow this and use it in an email. Since she never returned my calls, perhaps an email is best anyway. Thank you for writing this up, I am so angry at her that I could not have written anything like this.

 

[EllenD]

No problem...I'm angry at her too, and I'm actually quite proud of myself for being able to write that on the spot so "nicely"

 

[Terry57]

I just found Phoe passed away in the bottom of his cage.
We will have a necropsy done. For now, I can't breathe.

 

[Scott]

Deepest condolences for your loss of Phoe, my friend. I can only imagine the shock, hurt, and confusion, may you be comforted by Phoe's beautiful memories. I know Reg is with you to console and grieve.

 

[Laurasea]

Oh no!!! How can this be!!!! I'm Soo very sorry!!! You have to be in complete shock!!! I would ask them to do an x-ray, before the necropsies...oh man so sorry to hear this....not fair at all....you will be in my thoughts and prayers.

 

[Terry57]

I am closing this thread now, but wanted to thank everyone for your prayers & support throughout this.
I made Phoe his own thread in bereavement, I just don't think I can bear right now to remember how happy and hopeful I was for the last 2 days.