Bird Purchase Mistake - Help!!!

[KitKatPlus]

I don't understand the difference between clicker training and touch training.

Such happy news that a breakthrough was reached!! Clicker training is any kind of training where you click when the bird does what you're asking for. It's useful to build a language that you both can understand - click means good.

Touch training (also called target training) is a type of clicker training where you have a chopstick (or any kind of short small stick), and you click when the bird touches the end of the stick with its beak. Using target training, you can target the bird up onto your hand to aid in step up training!

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtzz8bdCpu8"]BTT Parrot Training 101 | The Basics of Training Your Parrot - YouTube[/ame]

Here's a video from my absolute favorite parrot youtube channel on it!

 

[Inger]

I’m so glad to see that you’re making so much progress so quickly! And still hoping for a picture???


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[noodles123]

clicker training just rewards any desirable training with a click immediately after (targeted/desired behavior +click+ immediate reward). Touch training (depending on how you are using the phrase) often involves a clicker, but specifically requires the bird to touch a point before it gets the click+ reward. It can also be a desensitization technique that involves you touching the bird a bit, then clicking and rewarding. If the bird is food motivated, they will start to associate the contact with a positive result (treat). That having been said, if the fear is greater than their love for food, it will not work.

 

[MegZ]

Hi all,
Update: We have made lots of progress in the last several days. Bird is stepping up. Wanting to be out. Waddling down the hall (we will allow his ridiculously short feathers to grow out so he can be fully flighted). Starting to grow on me. Won't let us take him from the cage but then tonight when I tried to put him to bed, he threw a fit and then stepped up on my hand so has been hanging with dad well past his bedtime - sorry. I know I am being a bad bird mom for leaving him up so late, but I wanted to reward him for stepping up and communicating with us. Last but not least, I wanted a boy when I was dealing with the breeder. She had all girls and one boy and one untested that I could have. The other boy was spoken for and all the girls went fast. Bought my pet store bird with no info. about sex. Had the bird DNA tested last week and results came in today. Assumed it was a girl for various reasons. It's a boy!!! I had wanted a boy when I lost my other beautiful boy. That's what called to me. I just teared up when she said it was a boy. The breeder got ahold of me just after I had my spontaneous purchase and the one she had, turned out to be a girl. And the one I got with no info., is just what I was looking for... And, that just felt like the universe was saying - this is the right bird. This is the right choice. Also, I want to upload a pic but I am not sure how to do it.

 

[LaManuka]

Thanks for the update and the wonderful progress report!

Here's a link that may help you with posting pictures.....

http://www.parrotforums.com/technical-support/6287-how-post-pictures.html

Looking forward to seeing some pics, and don't forget to let us know when you settle on a name. I'm so very happy for the two of you

 

[noodles123]

yes! keep your heart open, and you will see! yay!

 

[MegZ]

http://www.parrotforums.com/members...-without-falling-cage-now-he-big-boy-cage.jpg

I can't copy and post the pic here but I was able to post the URL. We started him in a travel cage because he was very awkward when he came home. Just not used to getting around. He is now in a big boy cage.

 

[LaManuka]

I can fix that for you if you'd like

 

[noodles123]

I don't want to jinx it...but....just saying...

 

[Scott]

Wonderful progress, this makes me so happy! (you must be ecstatic!!)

I am so glad you joined, shared deep background and lack of early bonding. Folks in the future will stumble across this thread (often via internet search) and view some fine advice!

 

[MegZ]

Yes. I am very happy he is making progress (still un-named, but that is coming today), but he still acts like a Romanian or Russian crib baby. We are working on bonding with him. My other birds would come to me and I would say - "come here" He is now coming to the stick, I click, and then I give him a treat. I just added "come here" each time we do the stick training, so that he learns to not run from us. He steps up when out of the cage to just praise. It's kind of adorable. I was just reading an article in the Atlantic today about Romanian crib babies, ironically. It came up on my feed. Very interesting about children needing to bond before a certain age. Birds should not be raise in poor conditions or kept in pet stores in shoe box size cages with smooth walls and limited contact. It's just cruel. I should upload the photo of him in his cage at the store. It was heartbreaking to me and I couldn't stop myself. But this should never happen to any animal. Ever. Or children for that matter - anywhere in the world.

 

[MegZ]

Back again with another update. We had such a good day yesterday that I am rather bummed today. He won't leave the top of his cage. Will allow us to pet him a bit and seems to enjoy that. Has been on the cage since this morning. Acting bitey, which is concerning, if we encourage him to step up, which he wasn't doing before - so we backed way off. Acting like we just brought him home. I am hoping that someday he will want to be held or want to sit on our shoulders but this behavior of running away from us despite us not pushing him and rewarding him for coming to the stick or other things, is very concerning to me. It seems very entrenched, so today I am feeling rather set back. I want an active member of our home and I hope that this behavior isn't something that is always going to be there. Yesterday was much better. Why is he suddenly so backwards today? Ugh.

 

[noodles123]

this is all semi-normal-- one day, you will look back and wonder how you ever made it to where you are (given all of the ups and downs). I swear, I really think you just got super lucky the first time....This isn't abnormal. Take it for what it is-- you have a brand new family member (super smart, with a history). Trust takes time, and sometimes we do things that scare them without even knowing it. Don't let this get you down-- you are on the right track. Also, keep an eye on his eating/drinking/droppings etc--- sometimes if a bird isn't feeling well they will act strange (but again, you don't have a very solid foundation yet, so I am guessing this is all just part of the process). You may have just pushed too hard without knowing it-- or maybe you followed his lead, but he got paranoid because it was moving fast and he's not totally on-board yet. You will get there.

 

[noodles123]

I said before that my relationship with my bird was like an arranged marriage. We had never met. She wouldn't let me pick her up for 3 months...I let her out daily and left the cage open during times when I knew I didn't have to go anywhere in the evening (because I knew she tolerated her cage and would eventually go back to go to bed if I dimmed the lights in the evening). We are so good now, you would never guess. She hangs upside down off of my fingers like a bat and is so very gentle with me most of the time (I maybe get bitten 3x a year, if that). She stopped over-preening *knock on wood*...Shes a ton of work, but there were nights when I cried and cried because I thought she would never tolerate me...Felt like a slave in my own home...it all passed...It's crazy because, I know how hard it was, but it was just like a light switch flipped one day (within her). I'm not saying they never have off-days (they can get freaked out or upset by tiny things and it can be scary to think that you are back at square one..but you aren't).

Think about a human child who gets cranky and screams "I hate you!" Do they really? 99% of the time, no. They might be frustrated, or scared, or sick or tired, but they don't ACTUALLY hate you. Parrots are better at remembering things than human kids (in many respects) and they are not on the same page as far as what is scary and what is not (in a lot of cases anyway). Just don't over-think it. Have you heard the song "B*tch" by Meredith Brooks? It's like the anthem of owning a parrot for many people lol.

DISCLAIMER: BASED ON THE TITLE, THE WORD "B*TCH" IS USED A LOT IN THE CHORUS I feel like this pretty much summed up my relationship-building process with Noodles.
[ame="https://youtu.be/_ivt_N2Zcts"]Meredith Brooks - ***** (Official Video) - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Inger]

I love seeing all the progress you’ve made! I don’t have any experience with a difficult bird, but I think that two steps forward and one step back is not unusual. Also, and you probably know this from your previous bird experience, maybe he didn’t like your shirt yesterday. Or something equally mundane to us but super relevant to him. Bumble doesn’t like the color turquoise. Awkward, since it’s my favorite. She’s better now, but for a while if I wore anything that was the wrong shade of blue she’d bite me and cheep at me and fly away a lot. Birds are weird.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MegZ]

As usual, thank you for continuing to give me input. i think the experience of being night and day different from my other conure and not possibly truly knowing how this will be going forward is so hard in sharp contrast to the VERY opposite experience I had with my previous bird who just died. When we brought Milo home, he just wanted to play and be with us ALL THE TIME - from minute one. He loved to roll over and would roll on his back and use his feet to play with our fingers. He would just flip over and roll on the bed. He was sooooooo fun. He was beyond comical - almost magical. He learned multiple phrases and would use them in the most hilarious ways. He would say - baby bird, baby, goodnight, be good, hi, wait, and he would use them in correct context, and was very communicative with us. He also had funny whistles and sounds, and just was constantly dynamic. Just describing him is making me cry. BIG HUGE personality. So, this is VERY hard for me. We're doing it, but sometimes, it's almost painful. So, I appreciate the help, and I do hope there is real, lasting light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[wrench13]

When this little guy does open up, I think you are going to be very suprised. It could be gradual or it might be just one day he decides to join your flock.

One thing that helped my familty with a beebee parrot we had many years ago was to have a small parakeet cage on the table where we had our meals, and let the new bird eat his meals with us, and maybe share parrot safe tidbits we were having. FLocks eat together.

 

[MegZ]

I hope that is the case. We continue to see moments of hope - a step up here or there, times he seems to be calling for us, and then he has these moments of true flake out, when we are not even near him and he is just acting completely odd. He is in one of those right now. Needed to vacuum and he was under the couch. Got him to come out and he stepped up on my husband's hand (tentatively) and then on mine and I put him back (praised him of course). Then, he went into one of his weird modes. He does this every day. Never saw my other bird do this ever.....For the last more than an hour, he has been doing some type of hiding or avoidance. This kind of behavior in some for or other, is at least 60% to 75% of his day. He hid in a box we have at the bottom of the cage for a half hour and now he is clinging to the inside wall of his big cage, as close to the top of the cage as he can get. He is clinging up there and almost giving us what I would think of as odd looks. Mind you, we are not approaching him or doing anything to him at all. Looks like he is going to come down now. I never saw either previous bird do such a thing. Any ideas? These are the weird things that make me worried he is scarred for life. Feels very strange sometimes.

 

[noodles123]

I hope that is the case. We continue to see moments of hope - a step up here or there, times he seems to be calling for us, and then he has these moments of true flake out, when we are not even near him and he is just acting completely odd. He is in one of those right now. Needed to vacuum and he was under the couch. Got him to come out and he stepped up on my husband's hand (tentatively) and then on mine and I put him back (praised him of course). Then, he went into one of his weird modes. He does this every day. Never saw my other bird do this ever.....For the last more than an hour, he has been doing some type of hiding or avoidance. This kind of behavior in some for or other, is at least 60% to 75% of his day. He hid in a box we have at the bottom of the cage for a half hour and now he is clinging to the inside wall of his big cage, as close to the top of the cage as he can get. He is clinging up there and almost giving us what I would think of as odd looks. Mind you, we are not approaching him or doing anything to him at all. Looks like he is going to come down now. I never saw either previous bird do such a thing. Any ideas? These are the weird things that make me worried he is scarred for life. Feels very strange sometimes.

it's because you scared him with the vac 99.9% sure...I would be that way too if a crazy roaring monster that sucked things up came barreling around and I didn't know what it was...they hear better than we do too....this one is pretty obvious to me. You need to realize how SENSITIVE they are to new objects, sounds etc. It doesn't matter that a vacuum is normal in your life...it isn't in his-- think about it from his perspective and assume that anything new, large, noisy etc will scare him a lot...especially if in his space, but a vacuum is notoriously frightening to skittish birds....
You need to stop thinking like a human and start thinking like a bird-- it's not that hard (just annoying lol-- because then you realize that the word is mostly terrifying until they have a trust bond with you, but even then, it isn't certain that objects will not scare them).

ALSO-- DO NOT allow him under the couch etc etc because this will make him hormonal when he reaches that age. Avoid all shadowy spaces (even though he is on the younger side). No snuggle huts, tents, boxes, low furniture, drawers, cabinets etc.. They WILL try to find dark nooks, but you have to stop prevent them from being able to do so..Now, if you scare him so badly that he runs and hides under something, that is a problem (because they need to feel safe) but you don't want either situation going on...

 

[MegZ]

Thanks again for the advice. He does the high hanging in the cage at least once a day, even when we are not vacuuming and when he comes out, he will go under the couch automatically. We would have to shoo him out all the time. There is also a cabinet behind the couch he could get under, so keeping him out from there would almost be impossible. We don't go after him or do anything to him. Hi MO is to be in his cage, on top of his cage, out in the little cage in the kitchen, or go under the couch. Very hard to get him to interact with us. He will enjoy being pet on the head if we invite him. This is no easy task. Which, is now honestly, making me feel a little hopeless. Even with stick/clicker training every day - he will not come to the stick past very close. i.e., I am now actually bummed out.