Mojo.. being a bad, bad baby!

[labell]

Okay so yesterday BLEW me away! Mojo has never seemed to crazy about any one but me but I figured since I am hand feeding him still that would get better once he was weaned and we are working on socializing him still so I was seeing this as a process and not a race.

A little back ground, since I got Mojo anytime I would hand him off to my husband he would bite his hand or arm and fly off either to me or just away. When my son was here he bit him as well. He has chomped my fingers but never in an aggressive way more like a baby not knowing bite strength while playing or getting too ramped up and we have been working on that, a "no or a time out" usually works fine.

About two weeks ago when I went to hand him to Don Mojo LAUNCHED himself at Don's face clearly wanting to bite so of course that made my husband who really isn't a bird person less than gung-ho to want to work with him. A few days after this I had Mojo on me and we were walking down the hall, Don asked me something from the bedroom as soon as Mojo realized how close Don was to me he bit me pretty hard on the arm. I gave him a firm NO and a time out later he seemed fine.

Now up to this point I was thinking that hubby was exaggerating on the level of aggression he was seeing because after all Mojo is a baby and I kept saying this to Don who would look at me like I was crazy. After all this is not the side I was seeing of Mojo at all! In fact when I came into the room, he thinks of nothing else, he will jump down to the bottom of the cage, yelling hi and hello and pacing in front of the door to come out and see me. I have seen a little jealousy when I am playing one on one with Mystic and Mojo wants all my attention but it wasn't bad just more like "Look at me mom" after all I feed them both together still twice a day without any issues. Don has since let me know before I am up in the morning when he uncovers every one he talks to them. He said Mojo typically responds to his morning greeting by biting the bars!!! I didn't know about this.

This long story is leading up to yesterday. Don was eating at the dining room table, the house is an open floor plan. The new adult Nape is in the living room. I walked through with Mojo on my arm, he saw the new Nape and flew at him in a very not friendly way, landed on top of the cage growling and going after her. I went over quickly and made him step up, we were walking away and Mojo launched himself at my face. He scratched and bit drawing blood, growling the whole time. Right near my eye, I could feel the blood dripping but at this point I had brushed him away from my face saying no and realized he was making a bee-line flight back to attack the nape. Both my husband and I rushed over and got him away from the nape who was not growling but leaning back with one foot out basically trying to hold off this crazed baby who is lunging, growling and trying to attack her. I got him up on my hand again and right to time out!

I have NEVER seen this type of aggression in a 14 week old baby and the folks I have spoken to haven't either (Henpecked and Wendy). I cried I was so upset yesterday, we will work through this! He is getting a wing clip as much as I hate to, I am hoping this gives him a little attitude adjustment. Though I am somewhat nervous because my thoughts were echoed by the people I spoke with that if this is how he can be at this young age, full on sexually maturity could be really bad!

I would love to hear from all of you if you have any suggestions, Henpecked (Richard) suggested I throw him off balance by taking him out in his travel cage to lots of new places, work on getting him weaned and clip him so these are all things I am going to start right away. I am going to really have to sweet talk the hubby into helping me with this because after what he saw yesterday he is less than excited.

 

[Kiwibird]

It sounds a lot like a overstimulation issue to me, especially knowing how much you have going on in your house with all the other birds. Mojo just may be more 'sensitive' to a busy/noisy/not 100% attention on him environment and has not learned how to deal with all the things going on around him. I'm a fan of 'time outs' in the sense of giving the bird (especially a wound up zon) a chance to calm down and collect themselves. I personally feel that they are intelligent enough to get the point. If he's not already, put him in a quiet, soothing place that isn't real bright and doesn't have anything going on (perhaps a bedroom with the door shut) or cover his cage up for a few minutes so he can cool off and calm down. Once he's calm again, be sure to praise and reward him so he doesn't think you hate him. That was pretty much the ONLY thing (and was our last resort) that helped with Kiwi's hyper aggression. It took a while for us to pinpoint the cause as too much sensory information coming in to a bird who had never learned how to cope. We also learned to watch for those signs a 'tantrum' was coming, and always tried prevention via distraction (hand him a toy, give him a treat ext...) to focus him over letting him flip and giving him a timeout. He eventually started to distract himself When he starts getting flashy and aggressive, you can almost see that little lightbulb go of in his feathery head and he will go rip up a toy and calm himself down.

I think that the overstimulation/severe aggression may be a more common issue in BFAs (isn't Mojo part BFA?). The blue fronts do have the worst reputation of all the amazons I think it's going to take Mojo time to make the connection between getting wound up and calming himself down before he does it without your prompting (time outs) anymore. Just be patient and consistent. Might not be a bad thing to work on bite pressure training either, for the sake of the family while he's learning how to be a good member of your flock

Edit: one last thing, he may be a really smart bird and is acting out because he's bored. Perhaps it would be a good idea to start some trick training and/or offering toys (not sure if a baby bird that age has toys yet).

 

[JerseyWendy]

I LOVE Captn's idea!!! He's too sure of himself IMHO. Taking him out in a travel cage, getting him out of his surroundings and into the world will socialize him and do him a world of good. And hopefully it will "adjust" his attitude problem, too. :54:

You also know my opinion on how to nip his Kamakaze courses in the butt. He might change his tune as soon as he realizes he can no longer get to those whom he seeks (or not) as quickly and easily as he does now, once his wings have been nicked a bit. (yeah, yeah, yeah, I know how controversial this subject is....so shoot me everyone :09: )

I honestly wish you wouldn't live so far, otherwise I'd be over in a heartbeat, you know that Laura, right? If need be, you can always schedule a road trip to Jersey.

And no, I've also never seen a baby Amazon at this age with a MEGA attitude like this. YIKES!

 

[labell]

I know with the size of my flock it may seem that my household is busy and noisy but it really isn't believe it or not. The eclectus have their own room and are out most of the day. Other than talking and the calls when it is close to breakfast or dinner time they are quiet and amuse themselves by playing on all the stuff in their room. I interact with them most of the time in there or have one or two with me while walking around the house doing chores.

The baby zons are in my studio which is 425 square feet so lots of space to themselves. They both play with and destroy toys in their cages when I am giving them in your cage play time as well as both are really enjoying playing with and eating larger hunks of fruits and veggies. Both get individual training and playtime with me multiple times per day. We really have been working on step up and step down from every place in the house there are literally t-stand or java trees every where and in every room as well as bite pressure training when we play with foot toys together on my bed. We also have been working the most on flight recall training. Believe me we work until they are happily worn out and panting from flying which is why clipping Mojo at this point breaks my heart but I do feel it needs to happen right now and at least I know he has learned to fly and land VERY well and would recall fly to me across the whole house.

At the moment the rowdiest bird I have is the new nape (noise wise) she has had a really hard clip and doesn't even attempt to go anywhere but her play top and I scooted a play-stand close enough to her cage that she can reach it. She likes to ride around on my shoulder a few times a day but is really still getting adjusted to her new home and family.

I should add that while I oil paint, that is my only job, my house is kept super simple as far as decorating both because I have asthma and I hate clutter. My father lived through the depression and saved every thing and while not an actual hoarder he was close. I grew up moved out and became the opposite. Less is more for me, so I don't spend a lot of my life house cleaning. More cleaning up after the birds than anything else lol! Since I mostly eat raw fruits and veggies I don't spend a lot of time cooking either. I love my life now, at almost 50 I do what I want when I want. I listen to music, do yoga, paint and play with my pets and never forget for a moment how blessed I am to spend everyday doing what I love.

THANK YOU WENDY! You are a sweetheart and I do know if it comes to that, that you would take Mojo for a few weeks and let him see what life is without me since the aggression he shows mostly seems to revolve around possessiveness of me but I will try all I can first but I want to say that the offer means the world to me! xxoo

Edit: Yes Mojo is BF and YN, I had never heard that BF were the more aggressive out of the hot three. I did deal with major aggression toward others with my nape that passed years ago but he was older and while he never liked anyone but me we learned to work around it and of course it was worse every spring, the thing that blows me away is the age of Mojo and this behavior, I wouldn't believe it if I hadn't seen it first hand.

 

[Anansi]

First off let me ask, how are you? Mojo went after you hard enough to draw blood, but you don't give an idea of how bad. I'm hoping it was something superficial that is already almost healed.

As for what training approach you should take, I agree with all that Richard, Wendy and April have said. Breaking up his routine is a very good idea. It will throw him off a little and distract him at the same time.
And anticipating his tantrums whenever possible and acting proactively is key to turning things around, I believe.

Something else you might want to try is asking your husband to take over one or both of the hand-feedings, as well as the majority of all treats. Well, IF he's willing. A big if, I know, but it may serve to broaden Mojo's horizons a bit since right now you appear to be his entire world. It would show that good things can come from other members of the flock as well.

And, despite the controversial nature of the wing-clipping topic, and her own words to the contrary, let's have no shooting of our Wendy, please. After all, even the most hardcore, full-on, "full-flighter" has to admit that this is an instance where a temporary exception should be made. It is a safety issue. If a bird is actively going after your face and drawing blood near your eye, a hard choice has to be made. And this is coming from someone whose personal preference is for keeping birds fully flighted. Like you, Lara, it would've broken my heart. But also like you, it's a temporary measure that I'd have taken.

At this point, all you can do is take all of these measures and then give it some time. Because it likely will take time.

Please keep us updated, Lara. And if all else fails... there's always Wendy's Bootcamp!

 

[labell]

First off let me ask, how are you? Mojo went after you hard enough to draw blood, but you don't give an idea of how bad. I'm hoping it was something superficial that is already almost healed.

As for what training approach you should take, I agree with all that Richard, Wendy and April have said. Breaking up his routine is a very good idea. It will throw him off a little and distract him at the same time.
And anticipating his tantrums whenever possible and acting proactively is key to turning things around, I believe.

Something else you might want to try is asking your husband to take over one or both of the hand-feedings, as well as the majority of all treats. Well, IF he's willing. A big if, I know, but it may serve to broaden Mojo's horizons a bit since right now you appear to be his entire world. It would show that good things can come from other members of the flock as well.

And, despite the controversial nature of the wing-clipping topic, and her own words to the contrary, let's have no shooting of our Wendy, please. After all, even the most hardcore, full-on, "full-flighter" has to admit that this is an instance where a temporary exception should be made. It is a safety issue. If a bird is actively going after your face and drawing blood near your eye, a hard choice has to be made. And this is coming from someone whose personal preference is for keeping birds fully flighted. Like you, Lara, it would've broken my heart. But also like you, it's a temporary measure that I'd have taken.

At this point, all you can do is take all of these measures and then give it some time. Because it likely will take time.

Please keep us updated, Lara. And if all else fails... there's always Wendy's Bootcamp!

Thank you, I am okay the flesh above my right eye is bruised, swollen and very sore, while it bled for a while yesterday head/face wounds always do, it was not bad enough for stitches or anything.

I clipped him today, he can still fly pretty well it may take another clip to slow him down more but I didn't want it to be too drastic all at once. He has been fine today with me. When he got beaking too hard while playing with toys with me a firm NO did the trick. We also went out for a drive today in his travel cage. I will keep everyone updated and hopefully we can get past this quickly. Wendy Bootcamp LOL!!!!

 

[Taw5106]

Oh wow, when I said you were in trouble my goodness he turned into a rotten stinker! I'm glad to see you are doing ok, I hate seeing he went all the way to the opposite end of the spectrum or close to it. I can't speak to this but I'm glad you posted this great learning for an Amazon newbie. Since we picked up Buddy two days ago from my Mom's nobody wants to mess with him, I'm the only one that can get close and we've had a few "NO BITE" battles but they are very short. The change in behavior is amazing.

I do have a question, since Mojo is so young, could this be territorial??? (mine, mine, mine, mine...) He's use to Mystic and the others, so is this how he (or any amazon) demonstrates their territory?

Sounds like positive progress has been made, keep us posted and best of luck!

 

[labell]

Oh wow, when I said you were in trouble my goodness he turned into a rotten stinker! I'm glad to see you are doing ok, I hate seeing he went all the way to the opposite end of the spectrum or close to it. I can't speak to this but I'm glad you posted this great learning for an Amazon newbie. Since we picked up Buddy two days ago from my Mom's nobody wants to mess with him, I'm the only one that can get close and we've had a few "NO BITE" battles but they are very short. The change in behavior is amazing.

I do have a question, since Mojo is so young, could this be territorial??? (mine, mine, mine, mine...) He's use to Mystic and the others, so is this how he (or any amazon) demonstrates their territory?

Sounds like positive progress has been made, keep us posted and best of luck!

That is what I am thinking is him feeling possessive over me but it really is uncharted territory since I have never seen this in so young a baby. When I was younger and hand fed for my breeder friend I dealt with many types of babies the majority being amazons, cockatoos, macaws and some conures with the exception of a military macaw that was bitey from very young and extremely strong willed I have never seen this. In truth if someone had called me with this as a behavior problem back when I did rehab work with people and their birds I wouldn't have believed it or at least would have thought there was some exaggerating going on. But seeing and FEELING is believing! We WILL work/train through it. My kids used to call me "Mom-inator" as in terminator I am fair, loving but strict and consistent and I don't take no bull, he will not have the upper hand, he can't, it just isn't safe or fair to anyone including him and I love him too much to allow him to become a problem bird. He will outlive me and I have to make it so he can be loved by someone else someday!

 

[RavensGryf]

Laura, I'm sorry to hear of the bloody attack . So he's going typical male Amazon a bit early huh?! I know Amazons can show aggressive behavior earlier than most species (my Pionus did as well), but a full out flying attack as if he was hormonal?! I could just imagine the emotional as well as physical scars that leaves you with. Sounds like some better advice here already than I could give. Take care, and good luck with Mojo! With all your experience I know you can do it

 

[Taw5106]

LOL, love it, Mom-inator! That is great!