RIP Posy

[Hawk]

Awww sorry for your loss. I know the feeling of losing a bird. I lost my Major Mitchell Cockatoo after she turned 68. She was like losing a child, your best friend. Though I had her 22 years of her 68, it felt like a life time.

 

[Violette]

Hey everyone,
I got the results of the necropsy today.
There was evidence of leaking of red blood cells into the kidneys. There was also evidence of bacteria in the stomach that could have gotten out of control (so possible bacterial infection?). There was also possible traces of lead toxin and garlic poisoning (which is so odd, since she only ate seed, NO garlic).

Here is an excerpt from the histopathology report:

"The erythrophagocytosis, coupled with the evidence of possible hemoglobinuria in renal tubules is an interesting finding. Possible considerations include lead toxicosis, or hemoparasites (although none were seen in the erythrocytes in great vessels, and this would be unusual in this species). Dr. did find a paper on hemoglobinuric nephrosis and hepatosplenic erythrophagocytosis in a conure after ingestion of garlic (J Av Med Surg 18:155, 2004), and it would be interesting to know if this bird was ever fed garlic, in any form (unlikely, as you mention it was eating only millet, but perhaps medicated by the owner?).The overgrowth of bacteria, possibly clostridia in the ventriculus was also unusual, but of uncertain cause."

So I guess this report is inconclusive. I'm having a hard time making sense of this. Can anyone help me out? I shouldn't be worried about my other birds being ill, right?

 

[RavensGryf]

Unfortunately it seems it's common to (after paying a considerable amount) to find necropsy results are inconclusive. I'm sorry it didn't hold a better answer for you.

Maybe it's not anything contagious, but what I'd do for peace of mind, is get everyone vet checked. It's good to do anyway, regardless of circumstances. Basic exam with bloodwork, fecal can find abnormal bacteria, yeast, or parasites, and also get viral disease tested.

 

[strudel]

I'm having a hard time making sense of this. Can anyone help me out? I shouldn't be worried about my other birds being ill, right?

Basically, you need to check your accommodation including the cages for lead. Do you live in an old house? If so, did Posy have access to any flaking paint?

I don't know about hemoparasites, I'd be talking to the vet about that for further information. That doesn't seem likely, because it's uncommon in her species and they didn't actually find any, it's just something that CAN cause what they found.

If you didn't feed garlic and the bird didn't have access, then that rules that out.

As for the bacteria, there might be a lot of sources. All you can do is make sure that the cages are clean, food fresh, all the usual things. It's the same thing with people who succumb to infection, you've got 2 things, whatever bug it is and the person's immune system letting it in/not fighting it off. There are bacteria everywhere, sometimes it's just down to the individual's immune response.

I'd be asking the vet what he/she thinks. And if you are worried about the others, then ask about what tests might determine any infection or whether there's any prophylactic treatment that should be considered. The trouble with nuking bugs is that you let other bugs have free rein to grow in their place.

 

[Violette]

Thank you both very much for the advice.

I'm going to take my birds in for exams soon, was just waiting for these results. My vet advised me to wait because she wants to know exactly what the birds need to be tested for. Hopefully all goes well.

Posy had no access to paint and the cages are brand new with non-toxic bars. Toys have been removed from my cage just in case, although she was never a chewer so I don't believe she ingested anything.

She had no fat stores and was extremely thin... (Not sure if it was an existing condition or from the recent illness). So I'm thinking that the possible overgrowth of bacteria knocked her down when she was so weak.

Thank you both again for the feedback! Puts my mind at ease.

 

[strudel]

So I'm thinking that the possible overgrowth of bacteria knocked her down when she was so weak.

and also, if she wasn't strong physically, her immune system might have allowed the bugs to get in instead of fighting them off. Once they were in, she couldn't fight them off if she wasn't strong physically. She might have had a chronic low-grade infection which made her weak. Which came first, chicken or egg? There are so many inter-relationships, it's hard to know how it "went down".

 

[Violette]

So I'm thinking that the possible overgrowth of bacteria knocked her down when she was so weak.

and also, if she wasn't strong physically, her immune system might have allowed the bugs to get in instead of fighting them off. Once they were in, she couldn't fight them off if she wasn't strong physically. She might have had a chronic low-grade infection which made her weak. Which came first, chicken or egg? There are so many inter-relationships, it's hard to know how it "went down".

Yeah, exactly my thinking. Correlation doesn't mean causation, especially in this case. The biologist in me just wants more answers, but I guess I will have to rely on my vet's advice and stop worrying. Just relieved to find that viral disease is not a possible factor.

 

[Hawk]

Awwwww.......I know that it's not easy to lose a bird. Sorry for the loss.