Venting

[Molcan2]

So I went to someones house and they had a B&G and M2 loose on the porch doing what ever they pleased. This should of been my first clue that 'boundaries' were missing. Well the B&G was being rather obnoxious with the owner (constantly hoping on/off her shoulder, biting at her jewelery) so I didn't really have any desire to mess with it. The M2 on the other hand was trying really really hard to get my attention, the owner seemed surprised by this. This visit was not related to birds so I was ignoring it, until it hoped on the floor and ran over to me. So I picked it up, first asking if it was friendly - she said yes (also asked how old it was, 3yr old female), and kept it low on my forearm. As we were standing there talking the M2 tried repeatedly to get on my shoulder. I don't allow birds to put themselves on my shoulder, esp ones I don't know (esp. Toos). If a bird is on my shoulder its because I not only put it there but I also know that I can trust that bird to be there. So each time it tried to get up there I would block it, in order to keep it on my forearm. This apparently is not what the bird is used to, and has never been told NO before. It decided to fly up to my shoulder and immediately went after my ear, then as I was pulling it down lunged at my face. This behavior was of coarse a display of dominance, and the bird most defiantly didn't get away with it. Fortunately I acted quick enough and no skin was broken, thankfully - it could of been so much worse. Had the bird been older and knew fully what it was intending to do, I could of lost part of my ear and lip. The owner of coarse apologized, stating that it had never happened before, I explained to her that it was more than likely a dominance issue and something that she really needs to address and correct now.

The M2 is only three, I cant imagine what its going to be like when it gets older if no boundaries are established now. It just irritates me, more so because I know the other side of it. The side of when it gets older and more aggressive. Then the bird gets blamed for the behavior and either gets shunned in a cage or ends up in the hands of a rehabbed trying to undo years of improper handling. This is no fault of the bird but comes directly from the human for not establishing any rules. I'm not blaming this particular person, its quite obvious by the number of birds in rescues that this is a widespread problem. There should be some sort of class you attend that teaches you the basics before being allowed to own a large parrot. At least the birds would end up benefiting from it.

Thats it, my vent.

 

[Pedro]

To be fair with the whole situation I believe there is no dominance in the bird world & to be honest i have never witnessed any in my own aviaries. I would say this lady trusts her birds to be on her shoulder. I also don't believe that just because the birds were out on the porch that boundaries were missing. That is their home.

IMO the bird reacted because you wouldn't let it do what it's used to. IMO it was irresponsible of that owner to let her birds near a stranger. It is also possible that the birds behavior was also exacerbated by having someone new in it's home.

What i let my parrots do & what i do with them is totally up to me, it's doesn't mean that because my SC Too delights in attacking my nextdoor neighbours toes & chases her when she runs away, that i should train my bird better. I just pick him up & he goes on the stand or in the cage. I never let anyone new to my home touch any of my parrots unless the bird wants to go to them & i watch for any sign the bird is uncomfortable. I know my Too gets very excited when we have visitors.

Sorry but i can see fault on both sides.

 

[Molcan2]

I didn't elaborate on what the B&G was doing that made its behavior 'obnoxious.' It was not just hoping on and off her shoulder, it was biting at her as well, she was extremely annoyed by the B&G's behavior but instead of correcting the bird she let the behavior continue and when she no longer could stand the behavior of the B&G, she decided to go inside instead of addressing the issue.

I did not mean that by the birds being loose on the porch that there were no boundaries. I didn't really go into detail on what they were doing on the porch that made them so unruly. My own personal bird is loose all day, the only time she is caged is at night when she is inside sleeping. My own personal bird has rules, they were laid down from day one and I stick to them, the result is that I have a bird that is balanced and behaves. My Too can go to ANY stranger, any time. In fact we are working on completing therapy work right now to get her certified. The woman whose M2 I was referring to is used to strangers, however the bird has learned to intimidate people to get what it wants.

My actual problem with the situation is that instead of providing the birds with structure they over run the house. Which to each is his own if that is how you want your birds to live in your house but more often than not these birds end up getting re-homed because their behaviors become 'out of control' when the bird is simply behaving the way its been allowed to all along. My issue is when people blame the bird for what it has become instead of themselves.

 

[Pedro]

The point i was trying to make Molcan2 is maybe the behavior of her birds were because a stranger was around & they are usually well behaved otherwise. I do know that sometimes this isn't the case & your maybe right in your observations & i do so agree with people blaming the bird for bad behavior. And to also be fair i didn't witness what you did. I was merely making another suggestion. My parrots are also well behaved but there are certain people they just don't shine to. It isn't very often though.

Maybe i am a little backward here but why would you get a parrot certified & what benefit is it.

 

[Molcan2]

I understand where you are coming from. I'm not attacking her personally, I'm upset with the situation as a whole and the result of what happens to these birds in general.

The certification is so that she can be allowed into retirement facilities and to an extent work with autistic children (which I already do with horses). I wouldn't get her certified if I didn't have to but she has to be evaluated and deemed tame and safe before entering into those types of settings.

 

[Molcan2]

Oh and I expect others opinions, otherwise I wouldn't post it in a forum.

 

[kerry]

I believe that the M2 may have been jealous of the attention that her owner was giving to you & that may have been the reason for her biting at your face.
My female Yellow Naped Amazon is jealous of my close relationship with my granddaughter & acts aggressive toward my granddaughter even when in her cage so I know to never let the YNA out of her cage when my granddaughter is at my home.

 

[lene1949]

Molcan2... how would you have corrected these birds?