Penny is sick, I've been holding back making a thread

[Laurasea]

Oatmeal, baby food puree (non fortified, no salt,careful with too much citric acid), low sodium saltine in a pinch, cooked apple, cooked sweet potato, non- fortified pasta---which is harder to find..., scrambled eggs (no salt), pumpkin puree (check contents), mashed cauliflower maybe??? (would have to research more on that one)....Mashed fruit, wasa crackers...still thinking...think about steaming fruit/veg and mashing...My bird LOVES natural nut butter, but caution should be used, as it may contain high salt/fat etc if you get the wrong kind...maybe mixing some safe nut butter with something like fruit to prevent choking etc. ..you know how dry it can be...cooked rice (rinsed before cooking, no salt)..will keep thinking..OH- QUINOA (also rinsed)..You could also try getting unsalted nuts and mashing them and adding some water to make a sort of mush.

These are some excellent ideas. This is why I need you all! When you are in the midst of so much worry and stress, your mind just freezes. At least mine does ..thank you

 

[crazyforfeathers]

I'm sorry I just saw your thread. I'm so sorry to hear that your baby's feeling sick. Sending her warm, healing thoughts and prayers. I hope she eats a bit more and starts to feel better. Have you tried a small bit of peanut butter? That was the only thing Limbo would eat when he was in the worst bouts of vomiting.

 

[Laurasea]

Even though I acted immediately, I was slow to truly appreciate how dire things are.

I feel I am truly in a war for her life. And keep being confused at which side is winning...

She is weaker. When at rest she now let's her wings drop, not a full hang, but very noticeable dropping. And I've seen some swaying and perch fumbles. She once again slept the day away, fluffed, not the extreme fluffed the likes if which I had never seen before, but more fluffed than a normal sleep.

Her stool are scant on fecal matter, since nit eating much. But when I came to her csge with warm food offering, she would perk up, and screech and try and bite when I put my hands in, as her normal quaker way. And she would come over and eat a little of what I offered.

It is only now , as if a few minutes ago, that she us actually at her feed bowl eating seeds. I kind if busied myself around the other cages to see if she was faking. But I observed her actually eating some seeds.

She had another bout of clear liquid from her right nostril, and itching both nostrils. And she keeps her right eye squinted even when I hand fed her. Earlier I wrapped her in a towel and dud a full exam. I felt all over her face for any sign of sinus swelling, and under eyes. I opened her mouth and shined my flashlight in to see if any plagues, I checked her vent her preen gland, I palpapate her belly, shined the light in her nostrils, and in her eyes. Nothing abnormal was found, except tge wetness around the right nostril.

I'm going out of my mind because she us both worse and better.

Tomorrow ill get the foods you all mentioned . And hope this second dose of medicine, decisively turns the tide.

 

[noodles123]

don't forget instacart-- if you don't want to leave and she's still up...I'm so stressed for you... You are doing great...hang in the best you can! I wish I could help- you are so very good with your bird and I know how much you love them-- hate this!


Could she have a blockage? I know she's eating a lot less, but I can't recall if you were able to have that checked with all of the holidays etc.

 

[Laurasea]

I made the mistake, or fell into the trap, " but she was fine yesterday "
Birds hide being sick!!!
When she showed the most extreme sick bird signs I've ever seen, full stand out feather fluff, not eating, nit moving,, only sleeping, turning her head from my food offerings of her FAVORITES ! She was at deaths door !! We have all counsel other if this when they explain their birds simular symptoms. This is an emergency, if you find your bird like this it is an emergency !!! You call your vet and insist to be seen as an emergency! Do NOT wait till the next day! If they can't see you insist they refer you to another vet, even if its an hour away. Usually they will relent and work you in.
I fell into the same trap, the wait and see. I waited to call my vet till afternoon, abd didn't reach her till evening. She wanted me to go get the meds that night. But because she knows me, and my birds, abd I said I thought she perked up a little by evening, we waited. She insisted and waited fir my call at 730 tge next morning to update her.

When she was so sick the next morning, I called, she called the pharmacy a quarter to 9 when they open at 9, the pharmacy called me at 3 min after 9, I picked up meds at 930, abd git them in her by 10. When I picked her up to give the medicine she was ice cold. She was dieing, her system was shutting down. If any of you have taken care of creatures that are in the process of death, or in shock , you know what I mean. Their extremities are cold, their body temperature drops. Mind you its 80 degrees here, and I had a powerful radiant heat panel on her thst she was snugged upto. She was cold not from temperature, she was cold because she was near death. This is also confirmed by my vet.

I foolishly thought I knew best, I put heat on her on the 3oth , ( when this stsrted), heat is critical for sick birds, I started her on antibiotics not prescribed for her, ( yes safe sn appropriate dose,) and I fooled around trying to get her to eat, and to figure out what was going on.

What I should have done is realize I'm looking at a bird that is critical, and call my vet that first morning. I know , many of you know, when yiu see a bird at full fluff, not eating, they can be about to die! They coukd die on the way to the vet, or at the vets, or before tge treatment can take effect. That you must treat this as sn emergency. We have had many people come here seeking advice, we advise must go to vet ASAP, they reply tgey have an appointment fir the morning, only to come back and say the bird died before the next morning appointment!!! And I said to myself, the something many others say, but tgey were fine yesterday. Birds hide being sick!!! Some hide it till you find them dead! Maybe she was sick before, or maybe it was something that multiplying rapidly, whatever, by the time you see these signs they are extremely sick.

I had a lizard get in the house, I put it outside, shortly after thst Penny sat in the same spot. Lizards carry salmonella, maybe that was what made her sick. My dogs go out into my yard, that has armadillo, opossum, rats, other creatures, that pee and poop. Maybe the dogs brought in something. I'll never know.

I feel extremely lucky, that she is alive. Extremely. My vet feels she has enough improvement to feel these are the right antibiotics. But she us still a very sick bird. And I'm in close contact to see if we need to add ir change medicine.

I'm sharing this for all our guests and members. So you do not fall into the trap of waiting. So you act like this is an emergency, and see your vet the same day!!+

Edit: thank you Lamanuka. This picture doesn't capture the full stand out of every feather Penny had on her first day of being sick. ( I didn't think to take one then) But it does show her sick, fluffed, and squint eyed. This is Today when she flew on top of the fridge when trying to give her food. And in seconds was back to fluffed and asleep /or just sick squint eyed resting. And her worried friend Cloudy.

 

[noodles123]

I made the mistake, or fell into the trap, " but she was fine yesterday "
Birds hide being sick!!!
When she showed the most extreme sick bird signs I've ever seen, full stand out feather fluff, not eating, nit moving,, only sleeping, turning her head from my food offerings of her FAVORITES ! She was at deaths door !! We have all counsel other if this when they explain their birds simular symptoms. This is an emergency, if you find your bird like this it is an emergency !!! You call your vet and insist to be seen as an emergency! Do NOT wait till the next day! If they can't see you insist they refer you to another vet, even if its an hour away. Usually they will relent and work you in.
I fell into the same trap, the wait and see. I waited to call my vet till afternoon, abd didn't reach her till evening. She wanted me to go get the meds that night. But because she knows me, and my birds, abd I said I thought she perked up a little by evening, we waited. She insisted and waited fir my call at 730 tge next morning to update her.

When she was so sick the next morning, I called, she called the pharmacy a quarter to 9 when they open at 9, the pharmacy called me at 3 min after 9, I picked up meds at 930, abd git them in her by 10. When I picked her up to give the medicine she was ice cold. She was dieing, her system was shutting down. If any of you have taken care of creatures that are in the process of death, or in shock , you know what I mean. Their extremities are cold, their body temperature drops. Mind you its 80 degrees here, and I had a powerful radiant heat panel on her thst she was snugged upto. She was cold not from temperature, she was cold because she was near death. This is also confirmed by my vet.

I foolishly thought I knew best, I put heat on her on the 3oth , ( when this stsrted), heat is critical for sick birds, I started her on antibiotics not prescribed for her, ( yes safe sn appropriate dose,) and I fooled around trying to get her to eat, and to figure out what was going on.

What I should have done is realize I'm looking at a bird that is critical, and call my vet that first morning. I know , many of you know, when yiu see a bird at full fluff, not eating, they can be about to die! They coukd die on the way to the vet, or at the vets, or before tge treatment can take effect. That you must treat this as sn emergency. We have had many people come here seeking advice, we advise must go to vet ASAP, they reply tgey have an appointment fir the morning, only to come back and say the bird died before the next morning appointment!!! And I said to myself, the something many others say, but tgey were fine yesterday. Birds hide being sick!!! Some hide it till you find them dead! Maybe she was sick before, or maybe it was something that multiplying rapidly, whatever, by the time you see these signs they are extremely sick.

I had a lizard get in the house, I put it outside, shortly after thst Penny sat in the same spot. Lizards carry salmonella, maybe that was what made her sick. My dogs go out into my yard, that has armadillo, opossum, rats, other creatures, that pee and poop. Maybe the dogs brought in something. I'll never know.

I feel extremely lucky, that she is alive. Extremely. My vet feels she has enough improvement to feel these are the right antibiotics. But she us still a very sick bird. And I'm in close contact to see if we need to add ir change medicine.

I'm sharing this for all our guests and members. So you do not fall into the trap of waiting. So you act like this is an emergency, and see your vet the same day!!+

this should be a sticky-- I really feel like you waited way less than many and we all have done the same (you are blaming yourself, but you acted faster than most people ever would ). You are more vigilant than 90% of the population, BUT this is so important for people to understand- there was just a post today where someone was asking about a sick bird, and it sounded way worse, but the idea was to wait..YOU ARE AN EXCELLENT BIRD MOM---SERIOUSLY-- and I so appreciate your reflection here, because I have felt the same, and I know that feeling. I appreciate this because it is brutally honest and it IS what people need to hear....<3

 

[Laurasea]

I made the mistake, or fell into the trap, " but she was fine yesterday "
Birds hide being sick!!!
When she showed the most extreme sick bird signs I've ever seen, full stand out feather fluff, not eating, nit moving,, only sleeping, turning her head from my food offerings of her FAVORITES ! She was at deaths door !! We have all counsel other if this when they explain their birds simular symptoms. This is an emergency, if you find your bird like this it is an emergency !!! You call your vet and insist to be seen as an emergency! Do NOT wait till the next day! If they can't see you insist they refer you to another vet, even if its an hour away. Usually they will relent and work you in.
I fell into the same trap, the wait and see. I waited to call my vet till afternoon, abd didn't reach her till evening. She wanted me to go get the meds that night. But because she knows me, and my birds, abd I said I thought she perked up a little by evening, we waited. She insisted and waited fir my call at 730 tge next morning to update her.

When she was so sick the next morning, I called, she called the pharmacy a quarter to 9 when they open at 9, the pharmacy called me at 3 min after 9, I picked up meds at 930, abd git them in her by 10. When I picked her up to give the medicine she was ice cold. She was dieing, her system was shutting down. If any of you have taken care of creatures that are in the process of death, or in shock , you know what I mean. Their extremities are cold, their body temperature drops. Mind you its 80 degrees here, and I had a powerful radiant heat panel on her thst she was snugged upto. She was cold not from temperature, she was cold because she was near death. This is also confirmed by my vet.

I foolishly thought I knew best, I put heat on her on the 3oth , ( when this stsrted), heat is critical for sick birds, I started her on antibiotics not prescribed for her, ( yes safe sn appropriate dose,) and I fooled around trying to get her to eat, and to figure out what was going on.

What I should have done is realize I'm looking at a bird that is critical, and call my vet that first morning. I know , many of you know, when yiu see a bird at full fluff, not eating, they can be about to die! They coukd die on the way to the vet, or at the vets, or before tge treatment can take effect. That you must treat this as sn emergency. We have had many people come here seeking advice, we advise must go to vet ASAP, they reply tgey have an appointment fir the morning, only to come back and say the bird died before the next morning appointment!!! And I said to myself, the something many others say, but tgey were fine yesterday. Birds hide being sick!!! Some hide it till you find them dead! Maybe she was sick before, or maybe it was something that multiplying rapidly, whatever, by the time you see these signs they are extremely sick.

I had a lizard get in the house, I put it outside, shortly after thst Penny sat in the same spot. Lizards carry salmonella, maybe that was what made her sick. My dogs go out into my yard, that has armadillo, opossum, rats, other creatures, that pee and poop. Maybe the dogs brought in something. I'll never know.

I feel extremely lucky, that she is alive. Extremely. My vet feels she has enough improvement to feel these are the right antibiotics. But she us still a very sick bird. And I'm in close contact to see if we need to add ir change medicine.

I'm sharing this for all our guests and members. So you do not fall into the trap of waiting. So you act like this is an emergency, and see your vet the same day!!+

this should be a sticky-- I really feel like you waited way less than many and we all have done the same (you are blaming yourself, but you acted faster than most people ever would ). You are more vigilant than 90% of the population, BUT this is so important for people to understand- there was just a post today where someone was asking about a sick bird, and it sounded way worse, but the idea was to wait..YOU ARE AN EXCELLENT BIRD MOM---SERIOUSLY-- and I so appreciate your reflection here, because I have felt the same, and I know that feeling. I appreciate this because it is brutally honest and it IS what people need to hear....<3

Noodles, thank you, you are one of the biggest champions of advising members to take their burds the vet ASAP, you yourself, act immediately even on milder symptoms.

It is " pride? " and having taken care of sick ones before, that got me in trouble. And the complete shock and surprise to wake up and finding everything has changed in a moment!
Thinking how did this happen, where did this come from, how can she possibly be so sick?

I know birds hide being sick, until they can't. They aren't like dogs or cats or people . They are a prey species, that requires the safety of the flock, a flock that will drive them out to save the flock if signs of illness are shown. Birds evolved this way, it isn't a stiff upper lip, or being tough.. its encoded in their DNA!
They don't choose to hide illness, they have no choice.
Nearly once a week we are advising others if this.

I had a quiet voice in my head, say you have never seen a bird present this obviously sick. I feel many others also have their mind real when suddenly out of the blue their bird is sick . They doubt themselves, tgey come here seeking advice, because of course they love their burd. Often they are resistant when we all say you have to take your bird to the vet. There are always difficulties offered, time, distance, money, don't know of a veterinarian

. For all you readers, you need to work that out now! You rarely have much time! Establish yourself with an avain veterinarian, set aside emergency funds. Prepare yourself with how you will provide supplemental warmth and supporting care, and special foods.

Offer foods by hand, and get your parrot used to eating oatmeal, or baby foods, or something that you can hide meds if when needed. And a parrot who will take warm foods, will likely eat those when very sick. But not if they have never been exposed to them before @ And do reach out to our fabulous members, because your head will be spinning, and you won't think of everything, like foods. Like warm sweet potatoes, and peanut butter, baby food, ect...

I will add my link to an article on supporting care for sick birds . Warmth is critical supportive care for sick birds, and by warmth i mean 80-90 degrees, birds normal body temperature is close to 110 degrees i think. It takes a lot of energy to maintain that, energy a sick burd can't spare.

Birds are designed for flight as such they have kean body mass, and little fat stores. They have high metabolism, and are foragers " grazres" with a simplified digestive system in which foods pass quickly. And fighting an illness or injury, takes a lot of calories. For all of the above that's why warmth is so critical, as is supporting foods.
https://www.beautyofbirds.com/sickbirdcare.html

https://www.vin.com/apputil/content...72&catId=35299&id=5709908&ind=92&objTypeID=17

https://vcahospitals.com/know-your-pet/nursing-care-for-sick-pet-birds

 

[noodles123]

No no--- do not go there. You know what it is like to be a parent-- I mean, everyone does it. You are seriously so, so GOOD at this-- do not blame yourself-- sure, we all do sh*t we wish we had done differently, but you really still did better than most in this situation!! You are reflecting, and sharing and that is huge, because it helps others, but even then, you did so much better than many people would have-- so thank you for being brave and devoted to your babies-- and know that we are here for you, but please, don't beat yourself up.


Your advice to others is sound, but I want you to hear me, when I say you really are good at this, and you have birds who are so lucky and so loved!

 

[LaManuka]

No no--- do not go there. You know what it is like to be a parent-- I mean, everyone does it. You are seriously so, so GOOD at this-- do not blame yourself-- sure, we all do sh*t we wish we had done differently, but you really still did better than most in this situation!! You are reflecting, and sharing and that is huge, because it helps others, but even then, you did so much better than many people would have-- so thank you for being brave and devoted to your babies-- and know that we are here for you, but please, don't beat yourself up.


Your advice to others is sound, but I want you to hear me, when I say you really are good at this, and you have birds who are so lucky and so loved!

Noodles is right Laura, don't go there, the "what ifs" will make you crazy! Penny could not have a better parront than you, now or at any other time in her life. We all know how passionate you are about your birdies and you just need to breathe, stay strong and keep putting one foot in front of the other until Penny has got through this. Sending my love and hugs and every bit of support that I can muster to you both Laura, we are all in this with you!

 

[Laurasea]

I do feel the love Noodles, and it means that much more because you are a very dedicated and excellent bird mom yourself! Oh and now you to Lamanuka! Another dedicated and excellent bird mom!

I am brutally honest, with myself, as well as with other members. For me in truth is light. I'm not beating myself up, I am learning. We all make mistakes, I can point out my own, lol

This forum betters the lives of parrots and people parrot relationships , for me being honest is the best way . I share a lot of detail, because I often wish others would share more.

 

[Laurasea]

I'm sharing this not because of bird mites. But because it has the best information on avian respiratory system that I've come across! And shows how they loose heat, and importance of supplemental heat. So that once get home from seeing your veterinarian, you will provide heat for your sick bird.
https://ladygouldian.com/content/why-all-fuss-about-air-sac-mites

 

[Scott]

You are truly amazing, Laura! Continuing to share and educate while nursing Penny back to health. We're all learning while embracing you and Penny with love and endless healing energy.

I'm wondering if small quantities of liquid Boost or Ensure are suitable for parrots? Highly concentrated nutrients, of course avoiding chocolate flavored.

 

[Ellie777Australia]

I do feel the love Noodles, and it means that much more because you are a very dedicated and excellent bird mom yourself! Oh and now you to Lamanuka! Another dedicated and excellent bird mom!

I am brutally honest, with myself, as well as with other members. For me in truth is light. I'm not beating myself up, I am learning. We all make mistakes, I can point out my own, lol

This forum betters the lives of parrots and people parrot relationships , for me being honest is the best way . I share a lot of detail, because I often wish others would share more.

Dearest Laura, Noodles and LaManuka are correct...do not go down the path of 'what ifs' because they can be innumerable. You rescued Penny and the 'before what ifs' are out of your control. You now need to focus on the 'what you dids' for her precious life, the difference you have made already is immeasurable! Yes, post what we learn from our own mistakes when we clearly make them, but never forget the GREAT things that you have done for your flock and all of us on this forum.

 

[Laurasea]

Penny, greeted me with more energy, and seemed to have a better appetite for my warm foods, and I even got a little sass, abd a bite fir puttingmy hands in her cage.

She was given her second azithromyacin dose this morning. And she lost 1 more gram,.

But once again she didn't wake me up screaming. All of her time is spent fluffed and sleeping, unless I'm at the cage offering food..This is the 4th day of just sleeping.....but she is warm extremities now, and seems brighter more alert.

 

[saxguy64]

Wonderful update, Laura, though I'll still keep it in the category of guardedly optimistic. Not out of the woods, but definitely a positive direction.

Guessing what you might have done differently or sooner?... So many of us have been there. We do our best, and no one can ask for more than that. You, my dear, do an exemplary job for your fids, and we all learn from your actions and documentation of it. Just keep doing what you're doing!

Continued prayers for you and sweet Penny.

 

[Scott]

Encouraging signs, Laura! Penny is fighting something tenacious, hopefully she has turned the corner and will show continued progress.

Sending warm feathered hugs and hope to you and Penny!

 

[Laurasea]

yes what i would have done differently is call the vet first thing in the morning when I found her so sick. I would have practiced what we preach. Birds hide being sick until they are so sick they can't hide it!!! When a bird presents as sick as Penny did, its an emergency, a right this second emergency! It rarely ever just " happened" they have been hiding how sick they are!!

Today I'm so emotional, I clearly see improvement. But she is still a very sick bird.

She has had several more clear fluid draining from her right nostril. It just looks like a wet nostril from water. But veterinarian just explained to me, that the sinus was swollen shut on the inside. So normal tear and body fluid was backing up , and is now draining. Because of this pressure and pain relief she isn't squinting that right eye anymore, or only rarely. And the very slight right head tilt is gone.

I 100% feel she would have been dead by evening, if she hadn't gotten the right antibiotics in her that next morning. With cold extremities she was in the process of shutting down and death. As her body did the last ditch effort to shunt resources to core organs and brain. In fact other than being cold from extreme environment, I have never witnessed an animal turn around and live once they have gotten to this point!!!!!!!

I will take credit for putting radiant heat on her the second she showed signs of being sick. O feel that helped save her life, until she got the antibiotics she needed. I do want to drive that point home for our readers. Raising the burds environment to above 80 degrees is critical supportive care fir sick, or severely injured birds. You must have a plan in place, before you are confronted with a sick bird.

It is also my standard practice to provide extra warmth when I bring a new burd home. Or move to a new house. As it is stressful on a bird whether the show it or not. That's why when you buy a seemingly healthy bird and bring it home, only to have it be sick a few days later. They often can have things like chlamydia, that are keeping in check till they are stressed.

Thank you all, sharing is helping me. Because looking over and seeing her still sleeping and fluffed just makes me want to cry

 

[noodles123]

I'm so glad she's doing better (although, obviously, there's still a lot to overcome)..Glad you got her in and thanks again for being so honest, because we can all learn from that sort of transparency (even though, I maintain that you did better than most people would have!)


question: did you notice any sneezing or excess scratching before the discharge? I called the vet this morning b/c Noodles seemed to have some dried crust right above and below her left nostril (some in her feathers and some below her nare) , but she hasn't been sneezing or scratching and I'm wondering if she just got oatmeal on her face, but I am not sure....waiting for a call-back...UGHHHH PARRROOOOTTTTTSSS!!!

 

[Laurasea]

No. She has had zero sneezing, or wheezing, or tail bob.

The first morning she was just extremely full out fluffed. Squinting eyes, and ever so slightly keeping her head turned to the right, thst head tilt did worsen later. It wasn't till late tge second day that she started scratching her nostrils, infrequently. Id have to look back to see when the nostril on the right was first wet. She has still never sneezed.
She was septic tho, thats why at first she also had diarrhea.

 

[saxguy64]

Laura, I wasn't at all questioning what you would have done differently. Just noting that you were questioning yourself so much. "What if," and "I should have" don't change anything after the fact, other than creating self doubt. Please focus on all the good you've done. You're doing everything possible, doing your best for her, which is pretty darn impressive. You are Penny's angel!