Salty is in trouble with plucking

A lot of people are against giving Haldol to parrots. I wouldn't take what those people say too seriously. I think it should be used IF plucking is a serious problem AND all else fails. I realize it's not natural to drug parrots, but keeping parrots in captivity isn't natural, and parrots in the wild don't pluck. If Haldol can break the anxiety cycle, allow a parrot to grow back his feathers, and avoid repeated rehomings or euthanazia it can be a good thing.
 
A lot of people are against giving Haldol to parrots. I wouldn't take what those people say too seriously. I think it should be used IF plucking is a serious problem AND all else fails. I realize it's not natural to drug parrots, but keeping parrots in captivity isn't natural, and parrots in the wild don't pluck. If Haldol can break the anxiety cycle, allow a parrot to grow back his feathers, and avoid repeated rehomings or euthanazia it can be a good thing.
I agree! Very little about our birds' lives are natural, and smart, sensitive greys especially seem like they suffer from suboptimal caretaking. This girl in particular probably would have been removed from her first home if she were a human child, and maybe her second too. She has some definite anxieties and fears that are easy to trigger, even in her fourth (and last) home with me.

If a light dose of meds helps her learn to move more calmly through the world - on my hand, because she's chewed off almost all of her primary and secondary wing feathers - then I'm all for that. Ultimately we're all just trying to do our best for our feathered/semi-feathered friends, however we do it.
 
Your vet seems attentive. That's a major plus. I am cautious about using behavior altering meds in man or beast. My concern is the quiet and often unnoticed side effects. You are aware of your parrot baseline. Your vet is in the loop. Those are the biggest factors. Take it one step at a time. I think your bird is a cutie. But I am basically a Grey fanatic. There's a avain trainer who has(had) a YouTube video series. One of her stars was a severely plucking CAG she rescued. I don't remember anything else. I was looking for training techniques. I do that periodically. Consider keeping a journal; Med times, dose, behavior before and after. General activity around bird and house. It will aid you and vet with dosages. You'll be able to answer a basic question. Is this a one time or recurring problem? That question is very important for human or animal medicine decisions. It will eliminate a common response; I don't know but....
 
Your vet seems attentive. That's a major plus. I am cautious about using behavior altering meds in man or beast. My concern is the quiet and often unnoticed side effects. You are aware of your parrot baseline. Your vet is in the loop. Those are the biggest factors. Take it one step at a time. I think your bird is a cutie. But I am basically a Grey fanatic. There's a avain trainer who has(had) a YouTube video series. One of her stars was a severely plucking CAG she rescued. I don't remember anything else. I was looking for training techniques. I do that periodically. Consider keeping a journal; Med times, dose, behavior before and after. General activity around bird and house. It will aid you and vet with dosages. You'll be able to answer a basic question. Is this a one time or recurring problem? That question is very important for human or animal medicine decisions. It will eliminate a common response; I don't know but....
I get what you're saying! We have three Greys and that's helped a lot with figuring out her behavior. For clarity, she's been plucking for years, and unfortunately it's a long-term issue. I'm solidly pro-meds when normal health precautions are taken, in part because I've experienced how life-changing medication can be for mental health conditions that look "livable" from the outside, but are very distressing to the one who is affected.

I'll self-disclose a bit to illustrate my perspective, which might be different from some: when I was a kid, I started pulling out the hair at the nape of my neck from anxiety. It isn't like people imagine, yanking it out in a burst of frustration...it's a methodical, almost self-soothing behavior that becomes habitual and absent-minded, so people don't even realize they're doing it. Very similar to the way a lot of birds tend to pluck, if you watch them: they groom, then just start pulling a feather out, then another. Or they get stressed or bored, and they try to self-regulate by doing something that feels familiar and relieves the impulse. It's weird to think that something that is destructive could be relieving, but that's what it is.

Feather plucking, nail biting, skin picking, etc..."the thing" that is done might vary between individuals, but they're all types of body-focused repetitive behaviors, or BFRBs. I encourage anyone with a plucking parrot to read about BFRBs in humans, to help understand a little more about how it might work with parrots too.

So let's say we have a beloved parrot who is an inveterate plucker. We worry about the obvious feather and skin damage, so we put plucking collars and things on birds to try to help them. Those things help to minimize the physical damage caused, but not the mental distress that led to the behavior. That's because the behavior is the secondary problem; the impulse is the primary problem, and it's still there, causing the bird stress, and now frustration too. Things like enrichment, exercise, nutrition, etc are helpful, but don't take the impulse away. Trying to resist an impulse, or being unable to do "the thing" can be really uncomfortable and persistent, fueling more stress and more need to do the behavior.

As smart as Greys are, the usual human remedy of cognitive-behavioral therapy is not a great option for them. :) The other two typical interventions that get to the root of the issue, and ones that I've found to work well for me too, are:

-Incompatible activities: finding an activity that is satisfying, but that also makes you physically unable to do "the thing" at the same time. For humans, that might look like a fidget spinner to keep your hands occupied so you can't play with your hair or bite your nails. For birds, that means keeping their beak busy, like with preener toys. They get the satisfaction of doing "the thing", pulling, biting, and chewing in a way that doesn't damage them, so the impulse is relieved without the harm. My girl LOVES toys with shoelace aglets. She pops them just like she pops her feathers. (Ew)

-and medication. A lot of people think that body-focused repetitive behaviors are related to OCD. We medicate other imbalances in the body, for both humans and birds, even when there's a risk of side effects; why would we not do the same for imbalances in the brain? Either way, there is the opportunity to relieve suffering. Why wouldn't we want to do that?

I hope that gives some insight into why I and others might choose to use haldol, with all the caution of any other medication treatment. And many, many shoelace toys!
 
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When I posted that I was thinking about my dog as well as previous years as RN. The scratch-itch-scratch or lick-itch-lick cycles. I've seen patients scratch sores leading to massive infections and amputations. My dog was 7 yo when he started to lick his paws or itch skin with teeth until ulcerations and bleeding occurred. It's a worry that won't stop. Every time he licks or itches I freeze and watch him. I've had/got him on medication. It stopped the behavior but he'd have periods of altered movement. So vet and I worked out a schedule. I can wean med off then restart. He's gone as long as 3 months without medication. I've found no sources of why companion birds pluck. There's tons of theory floating around. When I got my CAG, I was new to large parrot ownership. I knew next to nothing and I mean nothing. My first avian vet more or less ordered me to read, learn, read again. He said that all species of companion birds pluck. (I didn't even know what that was!) But CAG's were the most susceptible. His policy was distraction passive and distraction active. Redirecting any negative behavior. My current vet advises random and different types of distractions. Yes my CAG has done brief plucking. It was hormonal related. I worked extra on the distraction. The sores on my dog and fear of infection or worse haunt me. I watch my CAG for plucking. I kinda go on yellow alert during molts. I know were you're coming from. I'm glad you're doing your best. I am aware that behavior altering meds may be necessary. Too many people want to use meds as first option and expect it to be a cure.
 
When Haldol is given to humans for things from senile dementia to agiatation to severe psychosis there is a very large dosing range (1 mg/day - 20+mg/day). Presumably, dosing in parrots also has to be tailored to the bird"s needs. I wish one of newer neuroleptic drugs with fewer side effects could be safely used in parrots but there is far more data on Haldol in parrots than any other drug.
 
I look for controlled studies. I've found only one. It was done on a scant number of birds. Again my mistrust of big business is showing. Haldol is 50+ years old. It's being slowly phased out with newer drugs. So what's left for the manufacturer? Send it into an alternative market! Haldol is not FDA approved for animal use. I emphasize caution, care, observation and a knowledgeable vet.
 
THis is NOT a thread to discuss the pro's and con's of either treatment, Haldol or Lupron. If members want to start one on that topic...... THats thier choice. I do not advocate for either. I have zero evidence that it was effective in Saltys case, because much else was tried too. The use of Lupron was suggested by my CAV, but Salty did not receive anywhere near what is accepted as an effective regimen (many shots) for that treatment.

Thank you
 
Controlled double blind studies are the gold standard of course, but it's unlikely that large controlled studies will ever be conducted on drugs for psychiatric/behavioral problems in parrots.
Despite all the perceived evils of Big Pharma, most life improving and life saving drugs were developed by Big Pharma. The original maker of Haldol in the US was McNeil Pharma, a J&J company I worked for from '88 to '91 as a field sales rep marketing Haldol to psychiatrists but this was at the tail end of the time the drug was commonly used. J&J largely abandoned Haldol many years ago and has nothing to do with finding alternative markets (i.e. veterinary) for the drug. Today, Haldol's primary uses in humans are to quickly stabilize psychotic patients in hospital settings and in very low doses to calm agitated senile dementia patients. It's seldom used long term anymore.
There are no psych drugs approved for use in birds and there probably never will be. Lupron and similar hormone regulating drugs are not approved for use in birds either. I'm not sure there are any drugs approved by the veterinary arm of the FDA for use in parrots, but there may be drugs approved for poultry.
 

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