Service Macaw For Autistic Boy Needs Help!

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moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
So I'll make this quick, or try to anyway. There is a certain parrot "Vlogger" on YouTube that many of us are aware of and have been critical of, myself included, who is actually doing a wonderful thing in trying to help a parrot family in severe need, so I told her that I would post about it here with a link to their GoFundMe Account.

There is a mother and her teenage son, Mary and Jacob, who have a Greenwing Macaw named Sam. Sam is Jacob's Certified Service Animal (not an ESA, but an actual Service Animal that has been trained to alert Jacob to oncoming health issues), as Jacob suffers from Autism, Epilepsy, Parkinson's Disease, and Schizophrenic Tendencies (all professionally diagnosed and being treated). Sam has been with Mary and Jacob since he was a baby, and was professionally trained to be Sam's Service-Animal, part of which was Free-Flight Training Sam from a baby. Sam alerts Jacob to oncoming seizures, as well as to potential safety situations when Jacob is outside by himself (traffic dangers, stranger dangers, etc.). Sam allows Jacob to have much more independence than he would ever be able to have without him, and he also gives Mary some piece of mind, as well as rest.

Sam was recently diagnosed with Heavy Metal Poisoning. Without going into the massive amount of details, Mary has taken Sam to 4 different Avian Vets throughout the Los Angeles/Southern California area. Sam underwent the standard Chelation-Therapy, by a round of 10 injections and then with the aid of milk/eggs. Sam's metal levels after Chelation show that his lead levels are normal, but his Zinc is through the roof, and this is because he has bits of metal (as well as something else that is not metal, still unidentified) lodged inside of his lower GI Tract and inside of his Crop that are too large to pass. Sam must now have a very dangerous and costly surgery to remove the remaining large pieces of metal from both his Crop and his Intestines that the Chelation could not help pass, before Sam dies of Zinc poisoning. The first 3 Avian Vets that Mary took Sam to absolutely refused to do the surgery due to the danger, and suggested other long, horrible treatments, as well as euthanasia. The fourth vet that they took Sam to is the one who is going to do the surgery...but they don't have the funds. EDIT: I didn't realize when I first wrote this post that Mary has already spent over $4,000 on vet care with the 3 prior vets since Sam became sick! All of Mary's savings and the entire personal loan that she took out are already gone; Mary has a total of $500 left, and the entire total to save Sam's life is right around $2,200...As of the time I'm writing this edit, the GoFundMe is at $230 of the needed $2,200...So any little bit that we can give will help them tremendously. This vet is the only Avian Vet willing to go in and do the necessary Endoscopy, as Chelation did not work, and the vet is unable to go any lower on the price of the surgery, nor will they allow them to make payments (apparently this was discussed)....

To make things worse, Mary is legally blind and cannot legally drive, so she has been relying upon Uber to take them all over Southern California for these Avian Vet visits, and one Uber driver named Alexandria (yes, I'm calling her out) silently went ahead and charged Mary's card an extra $80 after the trip was over, because Sam had gotten sick and vomited ON MARY'S LAP while they were sitting in the back of Alexandria's car. When they arrived at Mary's home they looked at the seat and Alexandria herself told Mary "don't worry about it, there's nothing on the seat, it's all on you", and apparently there wasn't even that much vomit on Mary, it's not like parrots vomit up large amounts. Then the next day, Mary got a message from Uber stating that "A mess occurred on your ride with Alexandria yesterday that required her to get her ENTIRE CAR DETAILED at a cost of $80, which was just charged to your card"...So yes, Alexandria the Uber driver in the Los Angeles area got a free $80 detail to her entire car on Mary's bank card because Sam vomited a small amount on Mary's lap...And I'm sorry Alexandria the Uber driver, but even if some of the vomit from Sam did in fact get on your seat, which you told Mary it hadn't, but even if it did, a bottle of Resolve Cleaner and a rag would have cost you $4! That was just a kick in the ass for Mary.

Sam has had multiple imaging tests, blood work panels, cultures, and been on tons of medications. Mary has already spent her entire savings and has also gone to her bank and taken out a personal loan for the highest amount that she could. She spent her entire month's paycheck last month on Sam's care, and now the surgery to save his life is going to cost thousands of dollars. I believe that the GoFundMe page for Sam lists a goal of only $2,000-$3,000, as the personal loan that Mary took out will cover the rest. And they know that Sam may not make it through the surgery anyway. So they need some help.

To her credit, Caronlin Von Petzholdt has been driving Mary, Jacob, and Sam to Sam's last few Vet appointments, as the current Avian Vet that is going to do the surgery is a 2-hour drive one-way from Mary's house; Carolin lives over an hour from Mary to begin with, so she has been getting up before dawn, driving over an hour to Mary's house, then another 2 hours from Mary's to the Vet's office, then back again; this is the only way that Sam could have made it to this Avian Vet that is willing to try and help Sam, as Mary could have never afforded to hire a driver for that long a trip. So Carolin deserves a lot of credit and thanks for trying to help them in any way she can, I know she's also helping them financially and buying them groceries, etc. So thank you Carolin.

I'm going to add the link to Sam's GoFundMe page as soon as I get it from Carolin, she is going to post it on her YouTube page and under all of her videos once it's up and running. So look for the link sometime today. Anyone that can help with even $1, it's much appreciated. We all know what it's like to lose a fid, but Sam is a necessary part of Jacob's everyday life, without Sam, Jacob cannot do simple things like cross the street or go into a McDonald's safely by himself.

This is the link to the a video that Carolin posted with the first visit with the fourth Avian Vet that saw Sam and is currently treating him, and who is eventually going to do the surgery:
[ame="[MEDIA=youtube]hEIr5181T-0:279[/MEDIA]"]THIS BIRD HAS HEAVY METAL POISONING! - YouTube[/ame]


EDIT: So I can't post the link to Sam's GoFundMe page here, as it's against forum rules, but the link above to Carolin Von Petzholdt's YouTube video will take you to the place you can make a donation for Sam. Simply click on the very top "Title" above the video that starts with the word "YouTube" and it will take you to the YouTube video page.
I watched the videos and now I'm starting to be skeptical.
The son and the bird are absolutely great and I feel Sam is perfect for Jacob as a therapy animal.
But the mother isn't very polite and she seems to be just saying things for publicity.
I feel really bad for Sam and Jacob.
I'm autistic too but I would never let anyone treat me and my cockatoo the way that mother treats her son and macaw.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
As a service dog handler it is EXTREMELY stressful seeing ESAs / fake service animals in public where they aren't allowed / shouldn't be. I work at a hospital and the amount of times I see ESAs and "therapy dogs" (cmon cant you at least get your terminology for the dog correct at least even if its fake) come in is just stupid. Now, the hospital DOES have a therapy dog program and pet dogs are allowed during end of life care if the proper paperwork and what not is filled out.. but the people I interact with aren't part of either of those things. This is a HOSPITAL it has to stay CLEAN. Service animals are an obvious exception but they still have to remain clean. To work there I had to fill out lots of paper work and what not to confirm my dog was clean and healthy and wouldn't cause a problem while there. There's a TON of other issues that comes with faking a service animal and it heavily affects legit service dog handlers greatly.

Therapy dog:
- Helps many
- Doesn't by law require any training but certain programs will have different requirements.
- Does not have public access rights
- Only allowed in facilities that the program it is working with is allowed in

ADA Service dog:
- Helps ONE person
- MUST be task trained
- MUST be public access trained
- Protected by fair housing act
- MUST be allowed anywhere where the GENERAL PUBLIC is allowed.
- DOES NOT require any form of ID (certification, paperwork, ID card, vest, etc) anything that claims to sell legit forms of ID is a SCAM
- Illegal to interact with dog without handler's permission


ESA:
- Can be ANY animal as long as it provides the human with emotional support
- Doesn't by law require any training.
- Protected by fair housing act
- NO public access rights.
They really should add parrots as service animals t
As a service dog handler it is EXTREMELY stressful seeing ESAs / fake service animals in public where they aren't allowed / shouldn't be. I work at a hospital and the amount of times I see ESAs and "therapy dogs" (cmon cant you at least get your terminology for the dog correct at least even if its fake) come in is just stupid. Now, the hospital DOES have a therapy dog program and pet dogs are allowed during end of life care if the proper paperwork and what not is filled out.. but the people I interact with aren't part of either of those things. This is a HOSPITAL it has to stay CLEAN. Service animals are an obvious exception but they still have to remain clean. To work there I had to fill out lots of paper work and what not to confirm my dog was clean and healthy and wouldn't cause a problem while there. There's a TON of other issues that comes with faking a service animal and it heavily affects legit service dog handlers greatly.

Therapy dog:
- Helps many
- Doesn't by law require any training but certain programs will have different requirements.
- Does not have public access rights
- Only allowed in facilities that the program it is working with is allowed in

ADA Service dog:
- Helps ONE person
- MUST be task trained
- MUST be public access trained
- Protected by fair housing act
- MUST be allowed anywhere where the GENERAL PUBLIC is allowed.
- DOES NOT require any form of ID (certification, paperwork, ID card, vest, etc) anything that claims to sell legit forms of ID is a SCAM
- Illegal to interact with dog without handler's permission


ESA:
- Can be ANY animal as long as it provides the human with emotional support
- Doesn't by law require any training.
- Protected by fair housing act
- NO public access rights.
They really should add parrots as service animals for those with slight physical disabilities and moderate mental disabilities.
Autism and PTSD are two disabilities where a legalized service animal can play in according to the ADA to stop behaviors such as hand flapping and skin picking, parrots can be trained to intervene those behaviors.
Someone said once they have seen parrots fetch items for their physically disabled owners.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
Note:

According to ADA law (in the US) only dogs (and in some cases miniature horses) can be considered service animals.




I am in no way hating on the family or on the autistic person nor am I denying the wonderful resource that I am sure the macaw is to the boy and his family. I am in fact autistic myself and my parrot helps me greatly, but calling it a service animal is illegal in the US.

Service animals that are accepted legally for autism are dogs only (as miniature horses are exceptions to the law). I have a service dog because of my autism.

PS: There is no official registration for service animals in the US. The only thing you have to do to get an "official" ID card is to fill out a form online and pay about 50 bucks. Through those websites I could register my pillow as an "official" service animal.

Again, I am not hating on the boy or his family, but laws are laws and should be followed. I hope that they are able to gather the money to treat their sick bird.
Well there are some states that went off on their own.
I know Wisconsin is a well known state for that.
Wisconsin law says "Any animal can be a service animal as long as it can perform the task it is required to perform"
 

ravvlet

Well-known member
Jun 25, 2019
2,349
7,078
Seattle WA
Parrots
Kirby - OWA, 33yrs old (2019-)
Broccoli - Dusky Conure - 3?mo old (July 2023 -)
~~~
(Rehomed) Sammy - YNA, 45 yrs old (2022-2023)
(RIP) Cricket - Cockatiel (2019-2022)
This is a very old post! I’m not entirely certain the folks who were commenting on it originally are still around.

However, it’s still an interesting discussion. There’s been a lot of strain on service animals lately because of the number of people claiming untrained ESAs as ADA service animals, causing public incidents. It’s so easy nowadays to just order a vest that looks official and many retailers etc will not or are not allowed to ask you if your animal is actually certified.

My two cents is this: I love parrots, and I would love to be able to take my birds with me all over the place (and often do! They have backpack carriers and I’ve never yet been asked to leave a public facility because of them). However, unlike dogs, parrots are not domesticated. Even the best trained parrots - and I’ve met a few - have bad days where they are not up for performing, and it’s our job as their caretakers to recognize this. That is very difficult however in a true service role. It seems unfair to expect them to ignore their natural instincts (they are prey animals!) to perform a role for our benefit. They don’t possess the thousands of years of domestication that other companion animals have. Expecting them to be able to behave at all times, even in situations where their handler may be compromised, is a huge ask and one that I think is unfair to them. I worry also that making exotic pets ADA certifiable will cause the exploitation of said pets - they would be very “cool and stylish” to have; but when hundreds of dogs fail service dog training all the time, what will happen to the parrots (a much more expensive and harder to rehome animal) that don’t make the cut?

Parrots of course can still act as ESA and I think are excellent for that. As creatures who are so different from us, they require a lot of empathy and understanding, which can be very helpful! I personally find it extremely rewarding and therapeutic.

ADA regulation is already very miasmic and is frequently exploited so that people can bring their companion animals into public situations for which they may not be adequately prepared or socialized. Adding parrots to the list of animals that that might happen to is concerning. I wish we had a more robust and clear system through which service animals are trained, prepared and certified; until that is the case I’d be worried about adding to the list of species considered eligible for fear of misuse.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
This is a very old post! I’m not entirely certain the folks who were commenting on it originally are still around.

However, it’s still an interesting discussion. There’s been a lot of strain on service animals lately because of the number of people claiming untrained ESAs as ADA service animals, causing public incidents. It’s so easy nowadays to just order a vest that looks official and many retailers etc will not or are not allowed to ask you if your animal is actually certified.

My two cents is this: I love parrots, and I would love to be able to take my birds with me all over the place (and often do! They have backpack carriers and I’ve never yet been asked to leave a public facility because of them). However, unlike dogs, parrots are not domesticated. Even the best trained parrots - and I’ve met a few - have bad days where they are not up for performing, and it’s our job as their caretakers to recognize this. That is very difficult however in a true service role. It seems unfair to expect them to ignore their natural instincts (they are prey animals!) to perform a role for our benefit. They don’t possess the thousands of years of domestication that other companion animals have. Expecting them to be able to behave at all times, even in situations where their handler may be compromised, is a huge ask and one that I think is unfair to them. I worry also that making exotic pets ADA certifiable will cause the exploitation of said pets - they would be very “cool and stylish” to have; but when hundreds of dogs fail service dog training all the time, what will happen to the parrots (a much more expensive and harder to rehome animal) that don’t make the cut?

Parrots of course can still act as ESA and I think are excellent for that. As creatures who are so different from us, they require a lot of empathy and understanding, which can be very helpful! I personally find it extremely rewarding and therapeutic.

ADA regulation is already very miasmic and is frequently exploited so that people can bring their companion animals into public situations for which they may not be adequately prepared or socialized. Adding parrots to the list of animals that that might happen to is concerning. I wish we had a more robust and clear system through which service animals are trained, prepared and certified; until that is the case I’d be worried about adding to the list of species considered eligible for fear of misuse.
Well like said, even dogs are misused.
And there's pros and cons with any animal basically.
But out of every animal people try to pass 9f as a service animal, parrots have been the third choice.
I mean people can try to pass any other animal off as a service animal, but they don't, I've always seen dogs, horses and parrots. Those are the big three I've seen here.
Unless I actually see someone try to pass a reptile, amphibian, rodent, or fish off as a service animal. I stick by what I said.
And yeah, sure parrots have bad days, but so do people, sometimes there are days where I feel like I'm gonna punch the first person that talks to me but that's why I stay home.
And the exploitation thing. That happens a lot either way with every animal, dogs get exploited for show purposes and even as food, same with cats. And sadly pet stores will continue to exploit exotic animals for "style".
Sometimes I worry about stuff like this too, but then again I get told different by my bird actually. My cockatoo does things that wouldn't be considered normal for a parrot. He's learned to say new words and phrases within days. He does things with me that he never did with his previous owner.
So I get where your coming from, but we need to consider other things as well.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
This is a very old post! I’m not entirely certain the folks who were commenting on it originally are still around.

However, it’s still an interesting discussion. There’s been a lot of strain on service animals lately because of the number of people claiming untrained ESAs as ADA service animals, causing public incidents. It’s so easy nowadays to just order a vest that looks official and many retailers etc will not or are not allowed to ask you if your animal is actually certified.

My two cents is this: I love parrots, and I would love to be able to take my birds with me all over the place (and often do! They have backpack carriers and I’ve never yet been asked to leave a public facility because of them). However, unlike dogs, parrots are not domesticated. Even the best trained parrots - and I’ve met a few - have bad days where they are not up for performing, and it’s our job as their caretakers to recognize this. That is very difficult however in a true service role. It seems unfair to expect them to ignore their natural instincts (they are prey animals!) to perform a role for our benefit. They don’t possess the thousands of years of domestication that other companion animals have. Expecting them to be able to behave at all times, even in situations where their handler may be compromised, is a huge ask and one that I think is unfair to them. I worry also that making exotic pets ADA certifiable will cause the exploitation of said pets - they would be very “cool and stylish” to have; but when hundreds of dogs fail service dog training all the time, what will happen to the parrots (a much more expensive and harder to rehome animal) that don’t make the cut?

Parrots of course can still act as ESA and I think are excellent for that. As creatures who are so different from us, they require a lot of empathy and understanding, which can be very helpful! I personally find it extremely rewarding and therapeutic.

ADA regulation is already very miasmic and is frequently exploited so that people can bring their companion animals into public situations for which they may not be adequately prepared or socialized. Adding parrots to the list of animals that that might happen to is concerning. I wish we had a more robust and clear system through which service animals are trained, prepared and certified; until that is the case I’d be worried about adding to the list of species considered eligible for fear of misuse.
Plus another thing too, they say a parrot is like a toddler (I don't see it in Moxxie though) and someone left a comment on a different service animal bird video about how it's okay to take an actual toddler into a store but not a bird.
I honestly feel like this is a very good point because I've seen actual toddlers be dangerous and destructive too, I have two nephews with ADHD and I've watched them throw temper tantrums in multiple public places.
And I actually saw where someone got bit by a kindergartener in public and they almost had to have their arm amputated because of the bacteria in the child's mouth.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
Well like said, even dogs are misused.
And there's pros and cons with any animal basically.
But out of every animal people try to pass 9f as a service animal, parrots have been the third choice.
I mean people can try to pass any other animal off as a service animal, but they don't, I've always seen dogs, horses and parrots. Those are the big three I've seen here.
Unless I actually see someone try to pass a reptile, amphibian, rodent, or fish off as a service animal. I stick by what I said.
And yeah, sure parrots have bad days, but so do people, sometimes there are days where I feel like I'm gonna punch the first person that talks to me but that's why I stay home.
And the exploitation thing. That happens a lot either way with every animal, dogs get exploited for show purposes and even as food, same with cats. And sadly pet stores will continue to exploit exotic animals for "style".
Sometimes I worry about stuff like this too, but then again I get told different by my bird actually. My cockatoo does things that wouldn't be considered normal for a parrot. He's learned to say new words and phrases within days. He does things with me that he never did with his previous owner.
So I get where your coming from, but we need to consider other things as well.
Off*
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
This whole discussion is giving me bad vibes. I don't like it. This is a very heated topic that is highly debated.
I'm sorry, I agree, I wish it could be something we could discuss calmly like what we did in the thread. It really shouldn't be as heated as it is and I don't intend for it to be heated, I just want people to consider things while also considering their research.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
This whole discussion is giving me bad vibes. I don't like it. This is a very heated topic that is highly debated.
Well what I did when I private messaged you about your thoughts.
 

ravvlet

Well-known member
Jun 25, 2019
2,349
7,078
Seattle WA
Parrots
Kirby - OWA, 33yrs old (2019-)
Broccoli - Dusky Conure - 3?mo old (July 2023 -)
~~~
(Rehomed) Sammy - YNA, 45 yrs old (2022-2023)
(RIP) Cricket - Cockatiel (2019-2022)
Hmm, I think it’s important to remember here that while a parrot can be safely left unattended in a secured cage or area of your house, it is absolutely illegal to do the same to a human toddler - so their access to public facilities is not something that can really be compared. Also, far more people need amputations from exposure to things like rusty nails, etc, but no one is tabling a ban for common construction materials! A bit apples and oranges. An adult human sustaining a bite that could cause that kind of medical trauma is interesting and tragic, but it’s sensational largely because it almost never happens.

Behaviorally speaking, parrots are not domesticated. It can certainly be argued that they’re highly intelligent & empathetic, but they do not have the instinct built as a result of thousands of years of being integrated in human society like canines do. The studies about the way dogs intuit commands from their humans based on micro-signals is really fascinating!

Again, my biggest issue (other than putting undue pressure on the bird) is that the process by which true service animals become certified is not yet well streamlined or documented and fakes abound; causing issues for actual trained animals and other people. In most cases, an upset parrot can do a lot more damage than a toddler (I have extensive experience being bitten by both ;) ) and furthermore there is a real risk of escape, which would endanger the bird.

A parrot can absolutely be trained to perform and for the most part comport themselves politely, and often are - which again makes them perfectly suitable as emotional support animals and deserving of protection under that legislation (housing, etc).

As far as other exotics being used as service animals - snakes and reptiles are often used as ESA. There is also a documented case of a turkey (I realize this is domestic poultry and not an exotic) being brought aboard a plane as someone’s service animal.

I am sorry if you feel this discussion became hostile in some way.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
Hmm, I think it’s important to remember here that while a parrot can be safely left unattended in a secured cage or area of your house, it is absolutely illegal to do the same to a human toddler - so their access to public facilities is not something that can really be compared. Also, far more people need amputations from exposure to things like rusty nails, etc, but no one is tabling a ban for common construction materials! A bit apples and oranges. An adult human sustaining a bite that could cause that kind of medical trauma is interesting and tragic, but it’s sensational largely because it almost never happens.

Behaviorally speaking, parrots are not domesticated. It can certainly be argued that they’re highly intelligent & empathetic, but they do not have the instinct built as a result of thousands of years of being integrated in human society like canines do. The studies about the way dogs intuit commands from their humans based on micro-signals is really fascinating!

Again, my biggest issue (other than putting undue pressure on the bird) is that the process by which true service animals become certified is not yet well streamlined or documented and fakes abound; causing issues for actual trained animals and other people. In most cases, an upset parrot can do a lot more damage than a toddler (I have extensive experience being bitten by both ;) ) and furthermore there is a real risk of escape, which would endanger the bird.

A parrot can absolutely be trained to perform and for the most part comport themselves politely, and often are - which again makes them perfectly suitable as emotional support animals and deserving of protection under that legislation (housing, etc).

As far as other exotics being used as service animals - snakes and reptiles are often used as ESA. There is also a documented case of a turkey (I realize this is domestic poultry and not an exotic) being brought aboard a plane as someone’s service animal.

I am sorry if you feel this discussion became hostile in some way.
The reptile thing was a reference. And technically to leave a single bird unattended for days on end too can be considered abuse to the animal since they're not meant to be alone for that amount of time, plus not everyone can get a caretaker either, and that's a fact even though they truly love their birds.

And I have also been bitten by both too and honestly a toddler's bite is more painful than a bird bite in my experience, a bird just bites then lets go, sometimes they hang on a little but not long, toddlers can and will hang onto you until you get them off and it requires extensive force to get a toddler to unlatch their jaws.

And also for the escaping part, that's why you should use a harness or travel cage if needed.

And again, sure parrots aren't "domesticated" as you say but in reality were really any of the animals we have as pets meant to be domesticated? Let alone some dog breeds suffer health problems due to the breeding we did a long time ago. In all reality, we were meant to be animals too like every other creature on this planet.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
Hmm, I think it’s important to remember here that while a parrot can be safely left unattended in a secured cage or area of your house, it is absolutely illegal to do the same to a human toddler - so their access to public facilities is not something that can really be compared. Also, far more people need amputations from exposure to things like rusty nails, etc, but no one is tabling a ban for common construction materials! A bit apples and oranges. An adult human sustaining a bite that could cause that kind of medical trauma is interesting and tragic, but it’s sensational largely because it almost never happens.

Behaviorally speaking, parrots are not domesticated. It can certainly be argued that they’re highly intelligent & empathetic, but they do not have the instinct built as a result of thousands of years of being integrated in human society like canines do. The studies about the way dogs intuit commands from their humans based on micro-signals is really fascinating!

Again, my biggest issue (other than putting undue pressure on the bird) is that the process by which true service animals become certified is not yet well streamlined or documented and fakes abound; causing issues for actual trained animals and other people. In most cases, an upset parrot can do a lot more damage than a toddler (I have extensive experience being bitten by both ;) ) and furthermore there is a real risk of escape, which would endanger the bird.

A parrot can absolutely be trained to perform and for the most part comport themselves politely, and often are - which again makes them perfectly suitable as emotional support animals and deserving of protection under that legislation (housing, etc).

As far as other exotics being used as service animals - snakes and reptiles are often used as ESA. There is also a documented case of a turkey (I realize this is domestic poultry and not an exotic) being brought aboard a plane as someone’s service animal.

I am sorry if you feel this discussion became hostile in some way.
Again, lots to consider
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
Hmm, I think it’s important to remember here that while a parrot can be safely left unattended in a secured cage or area of your house, it is absolutely illegal to do the same to a human toddler - so their access to public facilities is not something that can really be compared. Also, far more people need amputations from exposure to things like rusty nails, etc, but no one is tabling a ban for common construction materials! A bit apples and oranges. An adult human sustaining a bite that could cause that kind of medical trauma is interesting and tragic, but it’s sensational largely because it almost never happens.

Behaviorally speaking, parrots are not domesticated. It can certainly be argued that they’re highly intelligent & empathetic, but they do not have the instinct built as a result of thousands of years of being integrated in human society like canines do. The studies about the way dogs intuit commands from their humans based on micro-signals is really fascinating!

Again, my biggest issue (other than putting undue pressure on the bird) is that the process by which true service animals become certified is not yet well streamlined or documented and fakes abound; causing issues for actual trained animals and other people. In most cases, an upset parrot can do a lot more damage than a toddler (I have extensive experience being bitten by both ;) ) and furthermore there is a real risk of escape, which would endanger the bird.

A parrot can absolutely be trained to perform and for the most part comport themselves politely, and often are - which again makes them perfectly suitable as emotional support animals and deserving of protection under that legislation (housing, etc).

As far as other exotics being used as service animals - snakes and reptiles are often used as ESA. There is also a documented case of a turkey (I realize this is domestic poultry and not an exotic) being brought aboard a plane as someone’s service animal.

I am sorry if you feel this discussion became hostile in some way.
And also again, not everyone likes dogs/fears dogs. And you can't really fit a horse in a store, I know personally about dogs, they're cute, sure, but I really wouldn't consider them as a companion for myself. I don't connect with them, to me, dogs just do dogs, sure they have abilities to "communicate" with us but didn't we in all reality force them to breed that way a long time ago?
Plus not to mention honestly, dogs can be messy and smelly, even service dogs. And that's the truth.
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
Hmm, I think it’s important to remember here that while a parrot can be safely left unattended in a secured cage or area of your house, it is absolutely illegal to do the same to a human toddler - so their access to public facilities is not something that can really be compared. Also, far more people need amputations from exposure to things like rusty nails, etc, but no one is tabling a ban for common construction materials! A bit apples and oranges. An adult human sustaining a bite that could cause that kind of medical trauma is interesting and tragic, but it’s sensational largely because it almost never happens.

Behaviorally speaking, parrots are not domesticated. It can certainly be argued that they’re highly intelligent & empathetic, but they do not have the instinct built as a result of thousands of years of being integrated in human society like canines do. The studies about the way dogs intuit commands from their humans based on micro-signals is really fascinating!

Again, my biggest issue (other than putting undue pressure on the bird) is that the process by which true service animals become certified is not yet well streamlined or documented and fakes abound; causing issues for actual trained animals and other people. In most cases, an upset parrot can do a lot more damage than a toddler (I have extensive experience being bitten by both ;) ) and furthermore there is a real risk of escape, which would endanger the bird.

A parrot can absolutely be trained to perform and for the most part comport themselves politely, and often are - which again makes them perfectly suitable as emotional support animals and deserving of protection under that legislation (housing, etc).

As far as other exotics being used as service animals - snakes and reptiles are often used as ESA. There is also a documented case of a turkey (I realize this is domestic poultry and not an exotic) being brought aboard a plane as someone’s service animal.

I am sorry if you feel this discussion became hostile in some way.
Also I did some research because I was curious about the human bite thing, and honestly I'm shocked too about what I found. 250,000 human bites causing trauma to another human are reported each year.
 

ravvlet

Well-known member
Jun 25, 2019
2,349
7,078
Seattle WA
Parrots
Kirby - OWA, 33yrs old (2019-)
Broccoli - Dusky Conure - 3?mo old (July 2023 -)
~~~
(Rehomed) Sammy - YNA, 45 yrs old (2022-2023)
(RIP) Cricket - Cockatiel (2019-2022)
I can tell you feel really strongly about this, so I think it’s time we agree to disagree, as we’ve long since left the original topic of this thread behind. :)
 

moxxiethecockatoo

Well-known member
Jul 20, 2022
141
286
Parrots
I have previously owned one cockatiel and two budgies. I currently own one sulphur crested cockatoo
I can tell you feel really strongly about this, so I think it’s time we agree to disagree, as we’ve long since left the original topic of this thread behind. :)
I'm sorry if you feel offended, I was looking at stuff about service animals and came across this, I thought I'd throw some research in and educate some people, so I will leave you be now.
 
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Cottonoid

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Feb 20, 2022
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This resurrected thread has run its course and will now be closed. As a reminder, our forum guidelines state:

"Respect other members. Do not flame, badger, disrespect or taunt anyone on the forums. If we feel a thread is getting out of hand we will close it or delete it."
 
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