Terrier and a bird? [seeking advice]

[IndySE]

I lost my beloved budgie a month ago and have started researching into getting another. The species is still unclear, but it will be something relatively small (i.e. GCC, cockatiel, lovebird, parrotlet, another budgie... still narrowing down XP).

The only problem is our terrier. She is very much terrier. If it moves, she chases it. She isn't driven much by scents, though. She's gone nuts looking at my friend's chickens once in a coop, so I know if I do get a bird she could never in a thousand years be trusted when it is out of the cage.

I do have a room I could keep the bird secure in and keep the dog out of, but the bird would be secluded and wouldn't be able to get to know my family well. This makes me sad There's a spot for the cage on the first floor by the stairs, where he'd see plenty of people everyday and really integrate into the routines of everyone. But this would be an area the dog shares as well.

I already have a pretty secure cage
[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Parakeet-Cockatiel-Lovebird-Removable-Black/dp/B00C332AOG/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1464575430&sr=8-2&keywords=parakeet+flight+cage"]Amazon.com : Large Wrought Iron Flight Canary Parakeet Cockatiel Lovebird Finch Cage With Removable Stand #15 Black Bird Cage, 32-Inc : Parrot Cages : Pet Supplies[/ame]

It's tall and sturdy. The dog shouldn't be able to jump up to it and it's made of wrought iron. I've heard you could place the cage on a matt that would discharge a small electric shock to teach the dog to avoid the cage or not show interest in it. I'm not sure how successful these strategies would be with a terrier, however. Most research I've come across mostly says 'don't get a terrier or a sporting breed with birds'.

In your opinion, would having the bird in the main area be too risky? I do want the bird to get to know my family, but his safety is 100% my priority. I have some experience keeping harmony between budgies and our past dog (also a high prey drive) so I know how to be vigilant, but the birds were usually in their own space. I'm also concerned on whether being stared at like chicken dinner might cause undue stress on the poor little guy.

I also want to say that the bird would most likely sleep in a separate cage upstairs with me at night I plan on setting up an area for him or her in my room with lots of toys and treats to play with while I'm home supervising and a smaller cage for sleeping. The larger flight cage would only be used while I'm at school and he needs to keep himself occupied.

Thanks for your thoughts !

 

[LeaKP]

Hi there! We have a terrier mix but she's always away from the bird. I don't trust dogs and cats around birds, they are predators and it's only natural for them to want to chase the bird. With creativity, the bird doesn't need to feel secluded. Good luck!

 

[BIRDIGIRL]

Hi IndySE I think leaKP has answered your question and as to the mat with the electric shock I do not agree with that either for the dog or the bird because in the birds case unless you insulate it from the bird cage it is likely that the metal will carry the charge and your bird might get electricuted too but apart from that electric shock methods of dog training belong in the dark ages ....training with positive reward is what you need (for the dog I mean)and you never leave the bird and the dog in the same room together unsupervised or while the bird is out of its cage.

 

[OutlawedSpirit]

I have two small dogs. They tend to ignore my Ekkie, but they are much more curious about the little birds. I have the birds in a common area of the house so they get to see everyone, but when it's time for out of cage time, either I bring the birds into another room that the dogs can't get to, or the dogs go in their crate or outside. However, I am able to do that because my dogs don't pay any attention to them if they are in their cages. If your dog would be too interested even when the bird is in a cage that may not work.

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[IndySE]

Thanks all for your input!

Yes the matt is something I wasn't too pleased with the idea of. I prefer using positive reinforcement and have only considered things that cause discomfort (not pain) where safety is a concern.

From your advice I think I'll try having them both in the common area when the time comes and see how it goes/ if Flower (the dog) will respond well to correct. She is very distract able and it may be manageable with some runs and toys so we'll see B) If it gets too much the bird will just have to live in his own isolated room.

 

[lplummer52]

A bigger bird (bigger than a Conure) would have no trouble holding their own with a dog or cat in my opinion. I have a very active Min Poodle who has learned that our Sun Conure s off limits. The Sun has no fear and will approach both dogs and bite their noses f they don't back off. The Poodle is super smart, but not as smart as the Sun. We have two dogs....an Italian Greyhound who is afraid of his own shadow, including the bird's, the Poodle and Screech. They all have to get along in this house. We all live together and no one is shut away in another room. The bird is only in her cage at night....as are the dogs in their crates at night. It took about 6 weeks to get the Poodle to ignore the bird. My challenge is now to get the bird to ignore the dog. But Poodles are retrievers with a very gentle mouth and IGs are lap dogs. I've owned and actually bred terriers in years past and I don't know that I would ever trust a terrier or a cat around birds smaller than an Amazon. I had a Yellow Nape at the time and had no problem. The smaller the bird, the more flighty or active they are in my observation. Dogs and cats would be much more enticed by budgies, cocktails and finches. Get a Grey or an Amazon if you have to have a bird. That terrier will come to know the bird as a a treat resource just as any dog looks after a toddler, and that's all. The bird is as smart as a toddler and will have that dog eating from his hands, so to speak in no time. Please don't seclude either dog or bird....they will learn to live together in the house. Anything outside the house, however, is fair game.

 

[jdlehman76]

I will start by saying I don't know how well trained your dog is or how well you are at controlling your dog. However, I have both a German Shorthaired Pointer and a terrier in my house along with a German Shepard mix and a Maltese. We have a CAG and a Lovebird, the dogs pay almost no attention to them. They will move if the birds approach them because they have been nipped or climbed on before. We never, and I stress the never, leave them out together without extremely close supervision, however, I have never had the dogs go after either of these birds.
That said, my advice is that you know the dog best and are most able to decide if you can train the dog to leave the bird alone.
I know that isn't necessarily helpful, but I know some dog owners that can't control their dogs enough to have a bird and the dog in the same house let alone the same room. I know plenty of other dog owners though whose dogs will ignore raw meat laying on the floor if they are told "no".

 

[Kyoto]

I have cats. If I want to take the bird out of her room, I don't feel any guilt locking the cats up in the basement because she is locked up while I'm working and they get the house to themselves close to 20 hours a day. 4 hours or so isn't a big loss of freedom for them. Our basement has their litter boxes, toys, and food and water so they are usually not too mad as long as they get their treats

I tried Keeping her cage in our living room but the one cat is completely intent and obsessed with her when she's in it, so her cage has to stay in the one room unless the cats are locked away. That said, hubby and I have a computer in there and he goes in and hangs out with her every day while I work and when I get home we put the cats downstairs and take her into the living room where she has another smaller cage and our undivided attention until bed time.

 

[IndySE]

Flower is well trained and I have reasonable confidence she wouldn't lunge at the bird if she was in my direct line of sight and I said 'leave it' (she's really awesome with that command). It's when I'm not watching I'm worried because she's rather sneaky and has been known to do bad things when she knows she can get away with it (ate half a box of donuts off the table, snuck out the door into the street, once strung yarn across our yard, drags socks into the yard, ate a random pill of the floor and we had to call poison control... she's a terrier alright XD; ). I think as long as the cage is secure though (and I'm pretty sure it is? please someone correct me there) we'll be okay. They can't be out in the open at the same time but that's not really an objective for me anyways.

A larger bird would be amazing, but I don't have the time or confidence to put into one. Greys are very neat, but I think I will stick to watching videos of them haha. The biggest bird I'd consider getting is the GCC.

 

[RavensGryf]

A bigger bird (bigger than a Conure) would have no trouble holding their own with a dog or cat in my opinion. I have a very active Min Poodle who has learned that our Sun Conure s off limits. The Sun has no fear and will approach both dogs and bite their noses f they don't back off. The Poodle is super smart, but not as smart as the Sun. We have two dogs....an Italian Greyhound who is afraid of his own shadow, including the bird's, the Poodle and Screech. They all have to get along in this house. We all live together and no one is shut away in another room. The bird is only in her cage at night....as are the dogs in their crates at night. It took about 6 weeks to get the Poodle to ignore the bird. My challenge is now to get the bird to ignore the dog. But Poodles are retrievers with a very gentle mouth and IGs are lap dogs. I've owned and actually bred terriers in years past and I don't know that I would ever trust a terrier or a cat around birds smaller than an Amazon. I had a Yellow Nape at the time and had no problem. The smaller the bird, the more flighty or active they are in my observation. Dogs and cats would be much more enticed by budgies, cocktails and finches. Get a Grey or an Amazon if you have to have a bird. That terrier will come to know the bird as a a treat resource just as any dog looks after a toddler, and that's all. The bird is as smart as a toddler and will have that dog eating from his hands, so to speak in no time. Please don't seclude either dog or bird....they will learn to live together in the house. Anything outside the house, however, is fair game.

Even the largest birds are small delicate animals as compared to dogs. The bacteria in saliva issue aside, a dog who really means business can kill a larger bird in an instant. An Amazon or Grey (as you said) is not even a close match for dogs (capable predatory animals) who have sharp teeth and powerful crushing jaws. To think that "certain parrot species" are so large that they can be so formidable as to be immune against the dangers of a dog is not correct.

 

[getwozzy]

A bigger bird (bigger than a Conure) would have no trouble holding their own with a dog or cat in my opinion. I have a very active Min Poodle who has learned that our Sun Conure s off limits. The Sun has no fear and will approach both dogs and bite their noses f they don't back off. The Poodle is super smart, but not as smart as the Sun. We have two dogs....an Italian Greyhound who is afraid of his own shadow, including the bird's, the Poodle and Screech. They all have to get along in this house. We all live together and no one is shut away in another room. The bird is only in her cage at night....as are the dogs in their crates at night. It took about 6 weeks to get the Poodle to ignore the bird. My challenge is now to get the bird to ignore the dog. But Poodles are retrievers with a very gentle mouth and IGs are lap dogs. I've owned and actually bred terriers in years past and I don't know that I would ever trust a terrier or a cat around birds smaller than an Amazon. I had a Yellow Nape at the time and had no problem. The smaller the bird, the more flighty or active they are in my observation. Dogs and cats would be much more enticed by budgies, cocktails and finches. Get a Grey or an Amazon if you have to have a bird. That terrier will come to know the bird as a a treat resource just as any dog looks after a toddler, and that's all. The bird is as smart as a toddler and will have that dog eating from his hands, so to speak in no time. Please don't seclude either dog or bird....they will learn to live together in the house. Anything outside the house, however, is fair game.

I have to disagree with you..... any bird regardless of size wouldn't stand a chance against a dog or a cat if it meant business.

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[Scott]

While many dogs/cats are observed to be respectful of birds in the home, the best trained 4-legged creatures can revert to instinct given an unfortunate trigger.

At the risk of being indelicate, I have seen the aftereffects of a dog vs bird tragedy. The first, an escaped Kakariki, lived a short period. The second, a beloved Citron, haunts me to this day even though I was not present.

 

[GaleriaGila]

Over the decades, the Rickeybird has outlived many dogs and cats. He still calls their names at times. My Grandmother used to swear he saw their ghosts. The dogs were all mutts and the cats were all cat-mutts. The dogs were well-trained and the cats learned early that approaching the bird resulted in horrible outbursts on my part. Eventually the bird of course mimicked me: we BOTH erupted. Sometimes he beat me to it! The other animals soon decided he was to be avoided. As a final safeguard, the bird's room door was closed whenever we were away and at night. I never forgot once. And we never so much had a close call of which I'm aware.

 

[IndySE]

The last thing I want is a tragedy D: ! I've had many close calls with my budgies over the years with my our past mutt in the early years but all survived under her wrath.

My mom will be home a lot and would probably be keeping the bird company while I'm at school, but I don't want to burden her with a responsibility either. From what you're telling me a terrier should probably never be left alone with the bird, in case the bird somehow figures out a way to escape its cage? I certainly wouldn't expect either to avoid each other if such an opportunity came a knocking Q___Q;

 

[DexMom]

Even the largest birds are small delicate animals as compared to dogs. The bacteria in saliva issue aside, a dog who really means business can kill a larger bird in an instant. An Amazon or Grey (as you said) is not even a close match for dogs (capable predatory animals) who have sharp teeth and powerful crushing jaws. To think that "certain parrot species" are so large that they can be so formidable as to be immune against the dangers of a dog is not correct.

I agree with this completely. I have dogs and an Eclectus. My ekkie has a big, sharp beak and knows how to use it. My dogs are well trained and follow commands without pause. I will still never leave Dexter out with the dogs in the same room. Dogs are prey animals with canine instincts that cannot be trained out of them (nor should they, IMO) and birds are prey. That's nature and I don't mess with nature.

 

[DexMom]

To clarify, my dogs can be in the room with my bird while he is in the cage, just not when he is out. They were a little antsy around him when he first came home and would go investigate whenever he moved around the cage, after being corrected a couple of times for barking, they stopped and no longer bark at him. Now, they hang out near the cage whenever I put in the food bowls because they know he will toss them some tasty morsels. Occasionally, if he's in his cage taking a bath or flapping his wings and making a big racket, they will come around to see what's going on, but they don't bother him.

You are probably best to try and keep the bird's cage in an area of the house with routine traffic and activity, so he can be part of the household. He would probably be very sad in a room all by himself most of the time. Once he's been around a while, your dog will probably ignore him when he's in the cage. When you are going to allow the bird some freedom, keep them in separate areas.

 

[IndySE]

To clarify, my dogs can be in the room with my bird while he is in the cage, just not when he is out. They were a little antsy around him when he first came home and would go investigate whenever he moved around the cage, after being corrected a couple of times for barking, they stopped and no longer bark at him. Now, they hang out near the cage whenever I put in the food bowls because they know he will toss them some tasty morsels. Occasionally, if he's in his cage taking a bath or flapping his wings and making a big racket, they will come around to see what's going on, but they don't bother him.

You are probably best to try and keep the bird's cage in an area of the house with routine traffic and activity, so he can be part of the household. He would probably be very sad in a room all by himself most of the time. Once he's been around a while, your dog will probably ignore him when he's in the cage. When you are going to allow the bird some freedom, keep them in separate areas.

Thank you! I think that's my ideal scenario and I think I might be able to train the pooch to leave the birdie alone. My only concern at this point is unforeseeable accidents, like the bird figuring out how to escape it's cage when we're not home and the dog getting to him :'< I'm not too sure I have a good prevention plan in that unlikely scenerio. Has this ever happened to anyone/ is this a likely and valid concern?

 

[Anansi]

It can definitely happen. My Bixby worked out how to open his cage rather unexpectedly. I came home from work one day and there he was, hanging out on top of the cage. Not cool. Lol! Fortunately, I don't have dogs or cats.

Also, if you think your dog might jump against the cage, that would also be a problem. As would a dog or cat staring intently at your new bird. The stress of that kind of scenario would be terrible.

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[Taw5106]

When I was about 12 I believe we had a budgie and a terrier mix. The dog got the bird and put a hole in his back. My parents didn't have the money and wouldn't take him to the vet. He survived and recovered well, believe it or not, a happy ending. Terriers are natural chasers so any bird is at risk. I like having my birds in the family area and we have three dogs, two pugs and a bulldog.

Then the birds!!! This morning I woke up and Venus was sitting on top of her cage door! I'm still looking to figure out how she did that but she is known for her lock picking talents. So if you got a bird, personally I want them in the family room, the dog would have to learn the bird is of limits but I would never trust him around the bird, ever. My dogs sleep in kennels and if we leave they stay in their kennels. Thankfully Venus has tried or ever picked the kennel locks, lol!


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