Getting impatient

[Oliver17]

LordTriggs thank you. He wouldn't step up for the vet and she said strangely some people train there parrots to step up backwards, strange I know but Oliver did it for her.

I'll keep working with him of course, the birds at the rescue are awesome and I have no problems having them step up, today I played with a Quaker, yesterday it was a pair of pineapple conures, and I always interact with Wally a plucked blue and gold macaw.

I just also have seen cage aggression, and that's hard to work with. But if Oliver was cage aggressive I wouldn't be able to touch him right?

 

[LordTriggs]

you're right. This isn't aggression of any sort. It's fear because he isn't tame. Remember that the birds you see in rescues are used to humans so may very well step up willingly to anyone.

remove any sense of timescale in your mind. This process as you have seen from others can literally take over a year to overcome. You go a little bit each day

 

[Oliver17]

My vet can into the shelter today, and when she was done with other birds , she asked about Oliver. We talked at the end she offered a one on one behavorial class at her place.
She will sit with you for at least an hour and go over target and clicker training with you and your bird. Go over any question and so on. What do you think? Can't hurt right? Cost is $125

 

[Oliver17]

Started target training on my own today, it was a great day. Let's see what tomorrow brings

 

[Oliver17]

So this is a short video on my progress with Oliver. He comes to the bottom of the cage for treats. I will put out my fingers, thumb tucked in or sometimes I offer my wrist. I make him stretch as far as he can go, then I put up my fingers.
Oliver runs, if I wait a little he will come down again and the results are the same. He has repeated this 4 or 5 times.
Today he lost his footing and landed on the floor. Most birds will step up if they are on the floor. Oliver would not. He got to his cage and perched at the top of his door. I just observed him. After a few minutes I again offered my hand. Oliver took of and spent the next 20 minutes on the side of the cage trying to figure where to go. I offered him the treat and he perched on the bowl, he just by passed my hand. Ugh!
That was this morning, this afternoon business as usual. I target train him three times a day in his cage, on his rope perch, he goes right then left, he reaches high and low, no problems there except it's only on the rope perch.

Thanks


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V19AniHAk30

 

[chris-md]

To be blunt, if that’s a typical step up training session I’m not sure you’ll ever get any results.

He shows not much motivation when sees the treats. I don’t see him puzzling over how to get to the treats. But we didn’t get much time to see his reaction there. A bird primed for training is chomping at the bit to get to the treat the minute hey see it.

I’d want to see the food offered a different way, not with something he could potentially perch on. Plate or spoon.

He needs something to do. If he’s targeting well, and he problem is FINGERS, you need to start using target training as the means to get him on your hand. Targeting will get him to voluntarily move toward the fingers, then eventually on the hand.

Can you film a typical targeting session?

 

[Soyajam]

In that particular video he looked mildly interested in treats. You might want to see if there's anything else he likes more.

You got a pretty big fear response from your hand after a few seconds so you'll have to work backwards. You want a situation in which a fear response is only when you push his boundaries (and you control how often that happens so it's not too much for him)

It looks like he was ok with just your hand up close, so next time try that and holding it there and reward if he's calm.
If he still backs away, you find a point where you can hold your arm and he doesn't back away, and you work in gradually from there.

(This is why it can be such a long and arduous process)

 

[Violet_Diva]

Your body is blocking the cage door, this might make him feel trapped, panicked or cornered. He can't see the treat. The bowl is large and scary - he doesn't understand why it's there or what you are doing. It's not where it normally is.

Here is what I would do...

Firstly find out what his fave treat is. If you feed him a mixture of chopped food or seeds - when you feed him - look at what he eats first or picks out first. If you can see what it is, use THAT as his treat to begin with. So remove that particular thing from future meals and ONLY use it as a treat. (You can always convert his treat to something else later on)

STEP 1
If he won't take treats from your fingers at all in any situation, you would firstly need to get him taking treats from a spoon to create distance between your fingers and him. Do this with him fully caged and with the door shut.
You will need to make sure the spoon is tilted slightly so he can see whats on offer. You must hold the spoon steady for a long time until he feels comfortable approaching the spoon. BE PATIENT and consistent.
Once he has taken food from the spoon - say 'good boy'. Once he does this a few times and understands 'spoon = food'... (or if you use your fingers - 'fingers = food')

STEP 2
Do target training whereby you teach a 'come here' request by tapping a perch from the outside of the cage and verbally saying "come here" (with him fully caged) with the treat on the spoon (or between your fingers) in position throughout.
He must be able to see what is on the spoon (or between your fingers). Don't tap continuously or he may be scared, just tap enough to get his attention to the area of the perch, the moment he looks away - tap again saying 'come here' and ensure the treat is visible.
BE PATIENT and consistent. Even if your arm is hurting from holding a steady position for a prolonged period.
When he eventually goes to the perch reward with a 'good boy' and a treat via the already established method (fingers or spoon). He may take seconds, or minutes to pluck up the courage to go to where you have indicated...

STEP 3
Repeat process at a very nearby perch, make it easy for him. Go between the two different (but close together perches). Once he does this easily and consistently...

STEP 4
Begin to encourage to different locations with the 'come here' and tap, gradually increasing the distance you are asking him to go to get the treat. Always have a perch affixed to the inside of the cage door - slightly lower than your 'arm perch' height. Keep doing the 'come here' and rewards around perches in the cage including the door perch...

STEP 5
Once this is normal, do the same routine with the door open so he has to climb to the door perch.

STEP 6
Once this is normal you are ready to start requesting a 'step up' from the door perch to your arm. Make sure the door is open wide so he doesn't feel trapped. Stand as far to the right as possible so there is lots of space at the door opening. Stand sideways and use your left arm as the perching arm and your right as the treat giving hand.
Have your arm ever so slightly higher than the perch and hold the treat on the other side of your arm so he has to step up onto your arm to get to it. If you are able to tap your arm with a finger and hold the treat at the same time - do it. Again BE PATIENT. You need to prove you are a steady and safe perch. Say 'step up' and do the established tap. Once he steps up say 'good boy' and let him get his treat. Try to move your arm very steadily behind the door perch he just stepped off of so that the door perch is now higher than your arm, offer a treat infront if him so he has to climb back onto the door perch. He may prefer a 'clothed arm' or a 'naked arm', if clothed, make sure the fabric is fairly tight to your arm so that it won't spin or move when he perches on it.

STEP 7
Keep practicing the 'come here' request in different cage locations, include the door perch, and do some 'step up' requests from the door perch.
This whole process could take days or weeks. Make sure you do it every day so he understands what is happening and what will happen.

I hope this helps you. If not, someone else may have a different method which may help you. But so far this has worked for me and my ekkies.

I would recommend pinching the treat between your thumb and forefinger with the treat pointing upwards (back of your hand facing the floor and the rest of your fingers in a fist). This makes the treat the prominent aspect and easily visible and obtainable without obstruction.

Good luck!

 

[Oliver17]

This is target training with Oliver today,
Thank you to you all who have replied, I'm super excited to get the help from you all


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NCxXumsw2CM

 

[wrench13]

Excellent stuff, Violet. Really good advice and tips. Buck, boyo, this takes time, lots of time, but he IS working with you, a little bit each day, and e prepped for a few steps back.

 

[chris-md]

I really like what I see there. He’s very focused and motivated. Violet diva has it right basically. Target him to different places. He doesn’t have to stay on his rope perch. With him sitting on the rope perch, target him to the bottom of the door where your first video took place, make him scale the cage bars a bit. . Target him to the top of the cage, or a nearby stand.

Once he’s confident targeting over a distance, you can start targeting him towards your hand. Ultimately his drive will overcome his fear and he will climb your arm to target. Especially if you target him in stages.

Targeting really is your key to getting him to step up here.

 

[Violet_Diva]

Looks like you're both doing super! He seems to be responding really well to your target training. He's going to be great!

Definitely agree with chris_md about targeting him to other places around the cage and not sticking to the rope. He may be wary at first but eventually he will follow your target anywhere (even step onto your arm to get it)

You look like you're progressing really well. From what I understand some birds take weeks, some months. Just keep with it, the rewards will be worth it!

 

[Oliver17]

I got a small background on Oliver, I spoke with the person who received him at the shelter.
It seems the man who brought him in is 85 years old, had Oliver for seven years. He received Oliver from someone else who could no longer care for him. He was told you just have to feed and water him, clean his cage once in awhile that he was a no trouble bird.
He fed him seeds and color pellets.

No wonder Oliver doesn’t come out of his cage, he doesn’t touch his toys or like to be handled even his veggies are a struggle.

Good news is he is healthy, target train8ng is going as excepted, he spent time on my wrist.
Oliver is smart and he mine.

Luv my Oliver
Have a great day

 

[chris-md]

That’s really revealing! And good news too. It’s a lack of socialization, which can be overcome somewhat readily with a couple weeks intense training. You got this. He’ll be a prime sociable parrot in no time flat.

 

[AmyMyBlueFront]

I just saw this thread..It seems like Oliver is SLOWLY coming around...he is on your wrist now! That is awesome! I was going to mention,that when he is out of his house,does he sit on his roof? If so,close his front door,so he can't run back inside,and he'll have to focus on your hand,or perch stick.
Is Oliver flighted?
It seems like everyone who is offering you and Olly advice are doing a great job..and so are you!
Like mentioned,it'll take time,and patience..but just watch vid's of Chris,with his Parker Doodles and Katie's Jasper,and you'll see what Oliver has the potential of becoming.
DON'T GIVE UP!! You are doing great...and so is Oliver!




Jim

 

[Boozieshome]

Also what do you mean by "pick up his toes"?

Thank you for your help

Basically trying to make him have no other choice but to step up onto you. Bring your fingers undernearth his feet and lift him up so he is forced up off the perch he is sitting on. It may or may not work, but you could give it a shot.

I do this with my U2 who will not step up. She offers nips to my fingers but thankfully doesn't remove my fingers.

 

[Oliver17]

Starting to think it’s me. He seem to get bored with target training of which he picked up on quickly. As soon as I moved the target outside the cage he was done. Step up is non existent. Yes he was on my wrist but that was twice never to happen again.
As you know I volunteer at a shelter,
I know there are birds that like me, follow me, dance with me. I have a cockatoo that protects me when others are around, I met a Blue and Gold that sings with me and followed me all day today, talked up a storm. Nobody has heard him make a peep till today.

What about my Oliver, what’s wrong?
His cage is open all day long unless I leave, I tried to get him to stretch so far he has to step on me.... no go he leaves. You might ask is it a treat he would die for, yes he comes down to the bottom of his cage like a bat out of hell. Loves his treats, but not enough to bstep up or target train outside his cage.

Are we just not a good match? Is that possible?Is it a oneway street? I .ove this guy, but want more, not looking for cuddles or hugs, just some Spend time with me.

I know he knows when I get home because he goes to the side of the cage where I sit, usual I share some of what I’m eating.

Thanks for letting me get it out of my system, reassure I’m not giving up����

 

[chris-md]

Just keep at it, I promise it’ll come around. It’s a socialization issue. He WILL come around with consistent training. I promise. Some nuts are just harder to crack and take more time. But when you finally do get through that shell, he’ll be putty in your hands.

 

[Anansi]

Agreed. What you have to remember is that all birds are different. Not unlike people. Some are social butterflies. Others are painfully shy. And some respond differently to different approaches, as well. What works with one may not necessarily work with another. Like with children, sometimes you just haver to throw different things up at the wall and see what sticks.

Patience and consistency. These are the keys to a breakthrough.

 

[Oliver17]

Do you think he is possibly happy with the way things are? I would be bored, but maybe this is the way he likes it, happy content
One person told me to capture him in a towel daily and hold him close he will like what he feels. And want to be with me. My knowledge tells me that Oliver’s not that kind of guy. I’m not gonna lie, I myself are getting bored doing the same thing over and over, ugh
He still is happy with me or a perch. It’s like he says “ nope” and walks away

Thanks to all that replied